Re: Study of psychopaths
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
"- .. -- Tim .-." <timr...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
>So let's not bother to endlessly repeat the same arguments and
>counter-arguments. We've been there, done that, and bought the Tee-shirt
>several times over. Let's try just accepting that there are differing
>beliefs and love one-another as Christ commanded, anyway.
Paul who was chosen by Christ to teach us, so what he says goes or Christ is
being defied, commands withdrawal from wicked fornicators [which includes
homosexual fornicators] they are to be put out of the Churches professing
godliness. They cause the rest of the flock to become polluted with their
sin.
"A little leaven leaveneth the WHOLE LUMP"
Why can't you see that basic truth, Tim?
"11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is
called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer,
or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 12 For
what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them
that are within? 13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put
away from among yourselves that wicked person." 1 Cor 5:11-13 (KJV)
You aren't loving Christ or your brother by shielding them from the Divine
punishment meant for those who defy God when they end up fornicating with
each other.
And as for allowing such evil people to become leaders in your churches it
is a true "Abomination" and if you can't see it, you are not a genuine
Christian believer.
__
Veff...
- .. -- Tim .-.
dozens of different church groups, so everyone can just pick the one that
suits them. These days we can truly 'Live and let live' over theological
differences, IF we have the will to do so.
Tim.
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
Well done!
__
Veff...
----------------
Homosexuals like to complain that Christians tend
to make the sin of homosexual acts worse than
any other sin and that hetros are the ones who
keep bringing this issue up.
But before we go any further, isn't it interesting
that in saying that, they are by default admitting
that according to God's word, it is a sin. :)
And their attempts to vilify Christians for hating sin
do not make their sin Godliness. are noted. And
the truth is, that what homos never do, is take stock
of how *they* bring the issue to the forefront in
the first place.
They want to make it a huge public issue and then
complain when people *respond* to their shouting.
They want to march down the street with their
"gay pride parades", in which they march down
the street, half dressed, fawning all over each
other, but then get upset when hetros talk
about it.
They want to try to force special rights for homos
into legislation, but then get upset when people
rally against it.
The truth is, that homos want "homo rights",
but they also want to take away the rights of
hetros to do the very same thing; to rally to
make their beliefs heard.
And worse of all, they want to try to force churches
to accept their perversion as Godly, marrying them
and placing active homos in charge of the flock!
In all of these things, it is THE HOMOS who bring
homosexual acts to the forefront and make it the
main topic in the church and in society, but then
when someone who isn't patting them on the back
even mentions it, then all of the sudden, they're up
in arms about it even being mentioned, as if their
"gay pride parades" are somehow not a mention
and they whine and rant about how we are making
homosexuality the main issue and persecuting them,
while they lie to peoples' faces and pretend that
they have no problem with hetros as citizens who
have a right to their opinion!
The truth is, that homosexuals do not want
"equal rights". They want a "homo society"!
In fact, if homos weren't trying to slam their lifestyle
down our throats (no pun intended) as being okay
with God in society and even in Biblical/Christian
forums like this one , then our conversations about
homosexual acts would be few and far between
and wouldn't even last very long!
Take these news groups for example. Almost every
time you see a discussion about homosexual acts
in here, it is always some homosexual who brings
the issue up and attacks those who adhere to
the word of God regarding this issue!
So they need to stop lying about this and telling us
that we're the problem! It is they who are the problem,
loudly trying to force their perversion down our throats,
demanding that we accept it as being Godly, even as
far as perverting the very words of God Almighty Himself!
And your "God's okay with loving, monogamous homosexual
relationships" garbage is just that! Garbage! It is fornication
and God is not okay with fornication!
Now, that being said and moving on to your their about
Christians looking at homosexual acts as committing the
worst sin, has it ever occurred to them that there is a
reason for that? I'm not saying whether it is the worse
sin or not, nor whether or not there are sins that are
worse than others. That is a whole separate debate! :)
But as to which sin God hates the most, God hates sin,
period! And I wouldn't sit here and try to gauge what
sins God hates more than others, as far as trying to make
a list and rank them. But what I can tell you, is that the
sin of homosexual acts go to THE CORE of the faith and
what God did from the very beginning and even how He
represented the consummation of it all (the ages) and
that is what homosexuals do not seem to realize.
It begins right there in Genesis and is spoken of throughout
the Scriptures and is right there in Revelation as well!
The marriage covenant is not just about the man and the woman
here on Earth. Rather, it is a picture and an image of Christ
and the church and so, goes to the core of the Christian faith
and so it is THAT, that you are perverting when you try to claim
that it is okay to try to make it into something else!
Read the following *very* *carefully* and note the comparisons
made between Christ and the church and the married couple
of husband and wife:
Ephesians 5:28-33
28) So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies.
He that loveth his wife loveth himself.
29) For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth
and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:
30) For we are members of his body, of his flesh and of
his bones.
31) For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother,
and shall be joined unto his wife and they two shall be
one flesh.
32) This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ
and the church.
33) Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love
his wife even as himself; and the wife [see] that she
reverence [her] husband.
Note that Paul talked about marriage and said that he speaks
concerning Christ and the church.
He called it "a great mystery" and that word, means "secret",
or "mystery", but the word's definition speaks of it being done
through the idea of silence imposed by initiation into religious
rites. And that's because it goes all the way back to what God
had done in Genesis.
Marriage is about more than just a couple. It is about being
the shadow of what was kept secret throughout time and
was then revealed through the Apostles, after Christ had
ascended.
Romans 16:25-26
25) Now to him that is of power to stablish you according
to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according
to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret
since the world began,
26) But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures
of the prophets, according to the commandment of
the everlasting God, made known to all nations for
the obedience of faith:
And God established this, as Paul said, when the world began
and it's right there in Genesis, where God established marriage
and established this covenant to be between a man and a
woman and said that the man will leave his father and his
mother, not to go and be with another man, but to be with
his wife!
Genesis 2:21-25
21) And the Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam
and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the
flesh instead thereof;
22) And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man,
made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
23) And Adam said, This [is] now bone of my bones and flesh
of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken
out of Man.
24) Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother
and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
25) And they were both naked, the man and his wife and
were not ashamed.
Now did God not know what He was doing here? :)
Husband and wife is not just a nice idea. It is a representation
on Earth of Christ and the church at the consummation, being
wed and therefore represents more than just two people together
and God nowhere opens up that idea to homo relationships!
Throughout Scripture, it is a man and a woman! One is head
over the other and Scripture says that it is the husband who is
head over the wife, just as the Lord is head over the church.
And so, the point is, that when you have two members of
the same sex, then you have perverted that idea beyond
recognition and have taken the very core of it and mutilated
what God has decreed!
"For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother
and shall be joined unto his wife and they two shall be
one flesh. This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning
Christ and the church." - Ephesians 5:31-32
So don't wonder why Christians have a problem with the perversion
that homosexuals try to claim is okay with God. It is obvious!
Michael James
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> Giving credit where it is due....this is an excellent post I saw in passing.
> Well done!
> __
> Veff...
> ----------------
>
> Homosexuals like to complain that Christians tend
> to make the sin of homosexual acts worse than
> any other sin and that hetros are the ones who
> keep bringing this issue up.
>
with.
If there is anything to complain about it is your attitude. You think
that you have real understanding of what 'god' wants. I disagree with
that . You do not have any real idea about homosexals. The only thing
that you know is your hatred and fear of us and what other negative
feeling you have. You interpret texts from 2000 years ago to
justify these feelings you have, Your interpretations are wrong
because they are coloured by the feelings you have within yourself,
not by the reality that homosexuals live. And we are made the way we
are by divine will, whether you agree or not. If you think that
the Creator is bothered by two guys having a sexual relationship, then
you really haven't a clue.
We know what are YOU DO NOT.
AND by the way..you ARE the one who 'keeps bringing up this issue.
As you havefor the past two or three years, and definitely the only
thing in the past couple of months, which to anyone who reads ARCE
it is evident.
You NEVER talk about Jesus, something that someone who claims to be
Christian would be talking about everyday, not harping on a few words
from St. Paul.
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
"Michael James" <michae...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
news:3bea521e-583f-4917...@m11g2000yqf.googlegroups.com...
On Sep 10, 7:03 pm, "1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist"
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> Giving credit where it is due....this is an excellent post I saw in
> passing.
> Well done!
> __
> Veff...
> ----------------
>
> Homosexuals like to complain that Christians tend
> to make the sin of homosexual acts worse than
> any other sin and that hetros are the ones who
> keep bringing this issue up.
>
~with.
Very sad then.... for you will continue to live a life of sin.
"7 And don't forget Sodom and Gomorrah and their neighboring towns, which
were filled with immorality and every kind of sexual perversion. Those
cities were destroyed by fire and serve as a warning of the eternal fire of
God's judgment." Jude 1:7 (NLT)
- .. -- Tim .-.
Hmmm. Who started this thread?
Tim.
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
"Michael James" <michae...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
news:3bea521e-583f-4917...@m11g2000yqf.googlegroups.com...
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> Giving credit where it is due....this is an excellent post I saw in
> passing.
> Well done!
> __
> Veff...
> ----------------
>
> Homosexuals like to complain that Christians tend
> to make the sin of homosexual acts worse than
> any other sin and that hetros are the ones who
> keep bringing this issue up.
>
~with.
God does, [so much so they are to be barred from God's Kingdom] so it
doesn't matter a jot whether you or Tim think they aren't.
__
Veff...
Pastor Dave
Traditionalist" <broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> spake
thusly:
> Giving credit where it is due....
Then why was my name stripped off? :)
Just kidding. I don't care about the credit.
I was just commenting on your statement. :)
> this is an excellent post I saw in passing.
> Well done!
Thank you. :)
--
Pastor Dave
The following is part of my auto-rotating
sig file and not part of the message body.
All we can do every day is the next right thing.
Pastor Dave
<michae...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>> Homosexuals like to complain that Christians tend
>> to make the sin of homosexual acts worse than
>> any other sin and that hetros are the ones who
>> keep bringing this issue up.
>
> No we don't we do not see homosexual relationships
> as a sin to begin with.
God does.
> If there is anything to complain about it is your attitude.
> You think that you have real understanding of what
> 'god' wants. I disagree with that.
Nice try at manipulating the situation and trying to
make it about the opinions of people, but it isn't.
You don't get to define God to fit your desires and
then falsely accuse me of doing that. Everything
I wrote is in accordance with Scripture and if you
have a problem with what you read here, then
take it up with God. It is His word that I quoted.
And as for "knowing what God wants" and I note
that you left "God" in lower case and put it in
quotes, showing you don't even believe in Him,
I don't have to read God's mind. He said it
plain as day for us and He set up marriage
and marriage is an earthly representation of
Christ and the church and so, when you pervert
the idea of marriage being between a man and
a wife, you then pervert the idea of the marriage
of Christ and the church into being one of two
men, or two women, when Scripture clearly
defined it as a man and a woman when God
set it up and calls the marriage of Christ to His
church, that of the bridegroom and the bride.
So I'm sorry, but you lose and unbelievers do
not get to tell Christian what to believe, nor do
they get to rewrite Scripture. But thank you
for once again proving that you want the
church to change, to suit your perversion.
>> And their attempts to vilify Christians for
>> hating sin do not make their sin Godliness
>> are noted. And the truth is, that what
>> homos never do, is take stock of how
>> *they* bring the issue to the forefront
>> in the first place.
>
> You do not have any real idea about homosexals.
> The only thing that you know is your hatred and
> fear of us and what other negative feeling you have.
And here we go again. Anyone who disagrees
with what you do, must be afraid of you, right?
Do you homos have any idea how ridiculous
you sound making that claim?
The truth is, it is a claim you make to try to shame
people into being kow towed into your demands.
And if you're not out to do exactly what I said,
then the question is; Why are you, an unbeliever,
here in Christian groups at all?
You see, it is hard to deny your motive being
exactly what I said it is, when you are here,
in Christian groups. And don't bother claiming
that you're just here to defend homosexuals,
because that's not what you're doing. You're
here to do exactly what I said, which is to
bring the issue up in the first place. Otherwise,
there would be no need for a non-believer,
homosexual, to be here in Christian groups.
Like I said, the issue wouldn't get mentioned
much, if you homosexuals didn't bring it up
all the time and in fact, what I wrote was
a response to the claims of a homosexual
Christian groups.
--
Pastor Dave
The following is part of my auto-rotating
sig file and not part of the message body.
"What else is the whole like of mortals, but a sort
of comedy, in which the various actors, disguised
by various costumes and masks, walk on and plays
each one his part, until the manager waves them
off the stage " - Erasmus
Michael James
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
It doesn't matter what you think blind Veff. You do not know what
'god' thinks...you only listen to the echoes of your own mind and you
mistake that for knowledge about gays. It is only your feelings that
espouse not God's will.
You are clueless about gays and their place in the creation as well as
to our fate after leaving the physical body.
You can quote scriptures for the rest of your life. That does not mean
you understand them
Love is love is love is love. That is something you obviously
don't know....your post are evidence, You never
never NEVERspeak of God's love NEVER, You only do your endless &
bigoted rant against gays,nothing else.It is the only thing you think
about and talk about on these groups. You are obsessed about gay
relationships.
And to reiterate, they are your own thoughts, not the will of the
Creator. You are wrong!
Pastor Dave
<michae...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>On Sep 11, 3:49�am, "1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist"
><broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>> "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
>>
>> > Homosexuals like to complain that Christians tend
>> > to make the sin of homosexual acts worse than
>> > any other sin and that hetros are the ones who
>> > keep bringing this issue up.
>>
>> ~No we don't �we do not see homosexual relationships as a sin to begin
>> ~with.
>>
>> God does, [so much so they are to be barred from God's Kingdom] so it
>> doesn't matter a jot whether you or Tim think they aren't.
>> __
>> Veff...
>
>It doesn't matter what you think blind Veff.
He didn't write it, I did.
> You do not know what 'god' thinks...
I don't have to. God wrote it down for us.
>you only listen to the echoes of your own mind and you
>mistake that for knowledge about gays. It is only your feelings that
>espouse not God's will.
This is not a response to what I said.
--
Pastor Dave
The following is part of my auto-rotating
sig file and not part of the message body.
"Fear does not have any special power unless you
empower it by submitting to it." -Les Brown
Pastor Dave
<michae...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
> You never never NEVER speak of God's love.
God's love does not equal endorsement of your sin.
--
Pastor Dave
The following is part of my auto-rotating
sig file and not part of the message body.
God sends us meat, the Devil sends us cooks.
::: Jesus is LORD :::
In Germany there is almost no "preterism" at all - and people would only
shake their heads if someone came along, saying that Jesus Christ came
back for a second time in 70 AD as they claim.
Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among
you that there is no resurrection of the dead? But if there be no
resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen: And if Christ be not
risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain. Yea, and
we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God
that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead
rise not. For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised: And if
Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins. Then
they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished. If in this
life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable. But
now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them
that slept. For since by man came death, by man came also the
resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ
shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the
firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh
the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the
Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and
power. For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. (1 Corinthians 15:12-26
KJV)
Telling the people that the resurrection of the dead has taken place
Spiritually already is robbing people of the chance they have for the
future.
Christians are told to be on the watch day and night... for Jesus will
come like a thief and they should be holy.
Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a
new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness. Wherefore, beloved, seeing
that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in
peace, without spot, and blameless. (2 Peter 3:13-14 KJV)
How could they if they believe that Jesus came back in 70 AD?
After the first and second warning, reject a man of heresy, knowing that
he who is such has been perverted, and sins, being self-condemned.
(Titus 3:10-11 MKJV)
And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the
flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye
have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
(1 John 4:3 KJV)
But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more
ungodliness. And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is
Hymenaeus and Philetus; Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that
the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.
Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The
Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name
of Christ depart from iniquity. (2 Timothy 2:16-19 KJV)
In addition, preterists steal the hope of the Christian believers:
But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which
are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. For
if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which
sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. For this we say unto you by the
word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of
the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself
shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel,
and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then
we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in
the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with
the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words. (1
Thessalonians 4:13-18 KJV)
Preterists cannot do what Christ told the Disciples:
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of
the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to
observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with
you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. (Matthew 28:19-20 KJV)
In Preterists' views the Second Coming of Christ took place in 70 AD, so
what should Disciples of today preach?
Preterism denies (or changes) most of the New Testament, and there will
not be much left. Take this, for example:
Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a
new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness. Wherefore, beloved, seeing
that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in
peace, without spot, and blameless. (2 Peter 3:13-14 KJV)
Peter speaks of a promise, but what a promise wouild be left for the
people of today? Shall we listen to Dave not to look for such things, or
shall we listen to Peter?
Peter writes in his second letter:
But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept
in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition
of ungodly men. (2Pe 3:7, KJV)
Preterists like Dave say that this is not valid for us anymore, for
Peter was speaking of a near future in 70 AD, when the Solomon Temple
fell and Jerusalem was taken and so many killed.
Preterists rob the people of the TRUTH by their claim that the Judgement
has already taken place in 70 AD! They actually fear Judgement, but
please do not ask me why.
Peter describes the destruction of the earth and everything around it.
Dave describes the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem.
Peter writes in that same letter:
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which
the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall
melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein
shall be burned up. (2 Peter 3:10 KJV)
Now please tell me, how could this describe the fall of Jerusalem,
especially if one regards the fact that the New Testament deals with
CHRISTIANS? Why should Christians have regarded this the END OF
EVERYTHING, while the Christian churches had been founded by the
Apostles already - in Corinth, Ephesus, Rome, Minor Asia, etc...???
Preterists are dreamers that do not want to believe God's Word when He
informs the people of the coming Judgment. Peter warned:
For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the
heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the
water: Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water,
perished (2 Peter 3:5-6 KJV)
And the following of Peter's words were obviously only valid for the
people BEFORE 70 AD if we believe Dave and not the Apostles:
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count
slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should
perish, but that all should come to repentance. (2 Peter 3:9 KJV)
So why would someone like Dave come to repentance hundreds of years
afterwards?
Preterism is a LIE - probably Dave is not aware of that, but it is what
it is.
This lie is not just about a verse or two, but affects almost the whole
New Testament, especially the Book of Revelation:
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the
first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. And I John saw
the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven,
prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice
out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he
will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself
shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears
from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor
crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are
passed away. (Revelation 21:1-4 KJV)
Preterists will TEACH the people that this was all fulfilled in 70 AD
already... Can you imagine the consequences of that?
And they also reject the following (or paraphrase it to their liking or
whatever they do so it fits their self-composed Bible:
Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they
also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because
of him. Even so, Amen. (Revelation 1:7 KJV)
Preterists want you to believe that *every eye* saw Jesus coming in some
symbolical clouds on His Second Coming in 70 AD.
Preterists cannot even sign the Nicene Creed or the Apostle's Creed,
either:
The Apostles' Creed
I believe in God the Father Almighty.
And in Jesus Christ his only Son our Lord,
who was born of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary;
crucified under Pontius Pilate and buried;
the third day he rose from the dead;
he ascended into heaven,
and sits at the right hand of the Father,
from thence he shall come to judge the quick and the dead.
And in the Holy Spirit;
the holy Church;
the forgiveness of sins;
the resurrection of the flesh.
Preterists would have to kick the fifth line from the bottom out,
because it is related to future events which they deny, since they claim
they have taken place already.
Please notice that the Creeds were created to save the Church from false
teachers and filter them out, because...
A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump. (Galatians 5:9 KJV)
It was not only Peter who fought against the false teachers of his
time... but Paul, John, Titus and Jesus Himself, but the church fathers,
too.
Having studied Dave's claims for years now, I have come to the
conclusion that preterism is a deadly sect like the Mormons, Seventh Day
Adventists or the like, and their replacement theory also fosters a
really bad form of Anti-Semitism.
--
___________________________________________________
http://www.acc-growing-deeper.de
http://the-beauty-of-the-psalms.blogspot.com
http://jesus-christ-is-my-lord-and-my-god.blogspot.com
http://bible-prophecy-and-revelation.blogspot.com/
Pastor Dave ananias917_@_gmail.com wrote in
rgnpa5hn0ge8bat88...@4ax.com
::: Jesus is LORD :::
Michael James
> On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 17:36:42 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
>
> > You never never NEVER speak of God's love.
>
> God's love does not equal endorsement of your sin.
>
> --
different than him is: Your innate love for others does not allow
YOu to condone something which YOU consider a sin.
Pastor Dave
<michae...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>On Sep 13, 8:00�am, Pastor Dave wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 17:36:42 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
>> <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>>
>> > You never never NEVER speak of God's love.
>>
>> God's love does not equal endorsement of your sin.
>
>What you mean which is a different than veff, because YOU are
>different than him is: Your innate love for others does not allow
>YOu to condone something which YOU consider a sin.
Once again, he didn't write what you responded to,
I did. And do not tell me what I mean.
Homosexual acts are sin and God does not endorse sin.
And for you to pervert His word, by trying to lay claim
to "God's love", as if that somehow means that the
homosexual acts that homosexuals commit are okay,
is also a sin.
--
Pastor Dave
The following is part of my auto-rotating
sig file and not part of the message body.
All we can do every day is the next right thing.
Michael James
> On Sun, 13 Sep 2009 07:28:02 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
>
> >On Sep 13, 8:00 am, Pastor Dave wrote:
>
> >> On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 17:36:42 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
> >> <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>
> >> > You never never NEVER speak of God's love.
>
> >> God's love does not equal endorsement of your sin.
>
> >What you mean which is a different than veff, because YOU are
> >different than him is: Your innate love for others does not allow
> >YOu to condone something which YOU consider a sin.
>
> Once again, he didn't write what you responded to,
> I did. And do not tell me what I mean.
>
> Homosexual acts are sin and God does not endorse sin.
> And for you to pervert His word, by trying to lay claim
> to "God's love", as if that somehow means that the
> homosexual acts that homosexuals commit are okay,
> is also a sin.
>
> --
>
> Pastor Dave
>
Pastor Dave
<michae...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>On Sep 13, 6:10�pm, Pastor Dave wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 13 Sep 2009 07:28:02 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
>> <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>>
>> >On Sep 13, 8:00�am, Pastor Dave wrote:
>>
>> >> On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 17:36:42 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
>> >> <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>>
>> >> > You never never NEVER speak of God's love.
>>
>> >> God's love does not equal endorsement of your sin.
>>
>> >What you mean which is a different than veff, because YOU are
>> >different than him is: �Your �innate love for others does �not allow
>> >YOu to condone something which YOU consider a sin.
>>
>> Once again, he didn't write what you responded to,
>> I did. �And do not tell me what I mean.
>>
>> Homosexual acts are sin and God does not endorse sin.
>> And for you to pervert His word, by trying to lay claim
>> to "God's love", as if that somehow means that the
>> homosexual acts that homosexuals commit are okay,
>> is also a sin.
>
> Your opinion = end story!
No, wrong. It's God's opinion, since He wrote it.
End of story.
And don't forget, you are in Biblical news groups.
So why you would think that you're going to run
around in them, getting sympathy for the idea
that God conforms to whatever you want to do
and approves of whatever sin you want to call
good instead, in beyond me.
--
Pastor Dave
The following is part of my auto-rotating
sig file and not part of the message body.
"To Follow by faith alone is to follow blindly. "
- Ben Franklin
Michael James
> On Sun, 13 Sep 2009 16:37:07 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
>
>
>
> >On Sep 13, 6:10 pm, Pastor Dave wrote:
>
> >> On Sun, 13 Sep 2009 07:28:02 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
> >> <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>
> >> >On Sep 13, 8:00 am, Pastor Dave wrote:
>
> >> >> On Sat, 12 Sep 2009 17:36:42 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
> >> >> <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
>
> >> >> > You never never NEVER speak of God's love.
>
> >> >> God's love does not equal endorsement of your sin.
>
> >> >What you mean which is a different than veff, because YOU are
> >> >different than him is: Your innate love for others does not allow
> >> >YOu to condone something which YOU consider a sin.
>
> >> Once again, he didn't write what you responded to,
> >> I did. And do not tell me what I mean.
>
> >> Homosexual acts are sin and God does not endorse sin.
> >> And for you to pervert His word, by trying to lay claim
> >> to "God's love", as if that somehow means that the
> >> homosexual acts that homosexuals commit are okay,
> >> is also a sin.
>
> > Your opinion = end story!
>
> No, wrong. It's God's opinion, since He wrote it.
> End of story.
>
wrote. If that is your belief then I will not try to change it, But
be very sure, that I do not believe these text were written by 'God'
Some of them were inspired others were not.
> And don't forget, you are in Biblical news groups.
DUH!
> So why you would think that you're going to run
> around in them, getting sympathy for the idea
> that God conforms to whatever you want to do
> and approves of whatever sin you want to call
> good instead, in beyond me
I think that it is evident. I do not share ALL your beliefs. Well you
seem to think that ONLY your beliefs are valid.
and that 'God' approves what you believe. Ergo my beliefs are
invalid in your eyes. So much for respecting other peoples beliefs.
Anything that is different from your is wrong according to you. ONLY
Dave has right understanding and cannot be wrong. According to you I
am not able to have right understanding and knowledge.
I REITERATE, THAT IS YOUR OPINION and only your opnionand just because
you thnk it does not make it true
A l lot people believe in creationism others in evolution . Each
group thinks they are right.
Well how Strange that "god" did not write in the Bible that six
billion years ago there was a big bang, So I presume you don't
believe in evolution.
Pastor Dave
<michae...@videotron.ca> spake thusly:
> God never wrote anything on paper.
So in other words, your goal is to come into Biblical,
Christian news groups and tell us how the Bible is not
God's word, while pretending to be interested in what
God has to say.
> People wrote what you say 'god' wrote.
> Some of them were inspired others were not.
And of course, you're just the man to tell us
which is which! But we shouldn't question
your divine ability, because it is just coincidence
that everything you disagree with will just so
happen to be on your list of which parts are
NOT God's word, right?
> If that is your belief then I will not try to change it
You ARE trying to change it! That's why you're
in here, telling people that God has no problem
with homosexual acts!
The truth is, you want to make your own Bible,
that exactly reflects your own personal desires
and then pretend that you're an honorable
person who has integrity.
>> And don't forget, you are in Biblical news groups.
>
> DUH!
Thank you for the admission that you know exactly
what you're trying to do.
>> So why you would think that you're going to run
>> around in them, getting sympathy for the idea
>> that God conforms to whatever you want to do
>> and approves of whatever sin you want to call
>> good instead, in beyond me
>
> I think that it is evident. I do not share ALL
> your beliefs. Well you seem to think that ONLY
> your beliefs are valid. And that 'God' approves
> what you believe.
Trying to turn the tables and accuse me of what
you are guilty of is a common tactic of the left,
but it doesn't work if the other person isn't stupid
and I'm not stupid.
My statements reflect what the Bible says. Yours
reflect what you prefer to believe. Therefore, it
is you who thinks that God approves of what you
believe, even though the Bible says the opposite.
And it is you, not me, who comes into Biblical
news groups, trying to convince people that
the Bible is wrong, where it disagrees with YOU
and then you want to pretend that you are being
attacked by others, when you're the one coming
in here and attacking God's word, by saying it isn't
all God's word. And that cannot be denied with
any integrity. It is what you are doing, period.
And then you want to pretend to be the innocent,
wounded lamb, as if you can't understand why
people would be that way, when in reality, they
are just telling you how dishonest you're being,
when you pretend to be here to express faith
in God and when you try to pretend that it is
everyone else who is just stating their own
personal opinions, when in reality, you are
the one doing that while they are simply stating
what the Bible says, in Biblical news groups,
while it is your statements that directly conflict
with what the Bible says.
You are not fooling anyone and you don't get
to tell us what is and isn't God's word in the
Bible, as if we should all bow to your opinion
of what should and should not be included
as such!
> So I presume you don't believe in evolution.
And now that you know that you have been
exposed on one subject, you wish to try to
change the subject to evolution, because
you mistakenly think it's an argument you
can win, even though you are ignorant of
the involved sciences and will merely parrot
what others have said on web sites and in
messages that say what you want to here
and that is the sum total of your "research"
and because you mistakenly assume that
a Christian, especially a pastor is not aware
of the facts and the involved sciences.
That would be a BIG, HUGE mistake, son!
But I'm not going to allow you to change
the subject. You have shown that have
no integrity, which includes your attempt
to change the subject to deflect from the
obvious your comments and so, there would
be no point in discussing anything else with
you, since your approach would obviously
be the same and the best you would ever
be able to come up with, would be to
demand that I "prove that it did not happen".
Please! <chuckle>
Now you have a good day, son. I'm done
with this, since you have been exposed
for what you are and your mission here
has been exposed as well.
--
Pastor Dave
The following is part of my auto-rotating
sig file and not part of the message body.
"Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot
be conquered by it. Do not count on them. Leave
them alone." - Ayn Rand
Michael James
> On Mon, 14 Sep 2009 09:01:14 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
> to tell us what is and isn't God's word in the
> Bible, as if we should all bow to your opinion
> of what should and should not be included
> as such!
***************************************************
No mr Dave, I will not bow to your opinion.
The fact that I don't obviously bothers you.
I am not trying to 'fool' anyone. I am just conveying my
understanding. You seem to be threatened by it.
.
Bow down? I thought we were discussing. You do NOT have accept what I
say.
But don't tell me I have no right to say it, when it does not match
your thoughts.
To refuse me the right to speak in these groups according to my honest
understanding is I would say a very fascist attitude.
In discussing one may learn , but you seem to have nothing to learn
You know is all,
You do not need to discuss. Your purpose it would seem is tell
everyone the Gospel according to Dave.
**********************************************************************************
>
> > So I presume you don't believe in evolution.
>
> And now that you know that you have been
> exposed on one subject, you wish to try to
> change the subject to evolution, because
> you mistakenly think it's an argument you
> can
*******************************************************************************
AT ALL.. I was not trying to change any subject. I was using it as an
example of how people could have different views about the same book.
Too bad you did not understand.
Argument? I thought this was a discussion
************************************************************************************************
even though you are ignorant of
> the involved sciences and will merely parrot
> what others have said on web sites and in
> messages that say what you want to here
> and that is the sum total of your "research"
> and because you mistakenly assume that
> a Christian, especially a pastor is not aware
> of the facts and the involved sciences.
You call me ignorant? You do not know me or what I know. You have
never met me, have no knowledge of my life, education and experience.
Yet your presume that I anm ignorant. Talk about hubrous!
Of you can make such erroneus statements about someone you do not
know,uch more erroneous must be your views about God. Of course if
you have met God and converse with Him on a continual basis then your
words must be correct.
********************************************************************************
>
> That would be a BIG, HUGE mistake, son!
*************************************************************************************************************
How patronizing of you. At my advanced age I am no ones son, but a
man with a lifetime of experience You might have the decency to have
some respect of my life and wat I have learned. TRY.
I do have integrity. I state my beliefs honestly and without guile
for which you have not respect.
You seem to think that only people who are like you and think exactly
like yopu have a right to post in news groups dealing with the Bible.
Any on who differs views is not allowed. Then what is tge point of
discussion. NONE there is just you telling me what I should think. If
you can't accept that I do not see the Bible as God's word too bad.
I do not. I see it as a collection of writing by many aithors over
thousands of years.
If you read in this book, you will come across a text that says "in
the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the word was
God."
That is the Word I rely on. The Word is not a book written in the
past three thousand years The Word existed before the universe was
created , exists now and will exist when the creation is crisp..
If you do not rely on that Word then too bad. Read your collection of
scrolls, which can be burned in a fire and destroyed.
Better to rely of the Word which is God who made all and cannot be
destroyed.
Of course many people who have contributed to the tome we call the
Bible have been commited to that Word and have written about their
experiences and knowledge of the Word...but then never EVER considered
their writings as GOD.
Why do you?
As a Bible newsgroup one may discuss the knowledge of people in the
past and their relationship to God etc.
But to read this writing of theirs to be the WORD OF GOD is wrong.
It is definitely not the Word of God.
***********************************************************************************************************
- .. -- Tim .-.
killfiled by me! Others have tried hard to achieve that status, but only
the Spaghetti Dave Bolognese has got there, apart from the spammers.
Good luck with him Michael, but he's left one prison only to put himself
into another of his own making, a mind-prison from which escape is highly
unlikely.
Tim.
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
> The silly Pasta is one of the very, very few elect who has actually been
> killfiled by me! Others have tried hard to achieve that status, but only
> the Spaghetti Dave Bolognese has got there, apart from the spammers.
>
> Good luck with him Michael, but he's left one prison only to put himself
> into another of his own making,
As he has served his time, and as he has now repented it shouldn't be bought
up and used against him anymore.
>a mind-prison from which escape is highly unlikely.
Even so, he does understand the need to obey and comply with Christ's and
Apostolic doctrines and practises in many instances which you readily fail
to understand, Tim.
__
Veff...
Pastor Dave
> The silly Pasta is one of the very, very few elect
> who has actually been killfiled by me! Others
> have tried hard to achieve that status, but only
> the Spaghetti Dave Bolognese has got there,
> apart from the spammers.
>
> Good luck with him Michael, but he's left one prison
> only to put himself into another of his own making,
>
>a mind-prison from which escape is highly unlikely.
Yes Tim, you surely look like the intelligent one here.
--
Pastor Dave
The following is part of my auto-rotating
sig file and not part of the message body.
"The face is the mirror of the mind and eyes without speaking
confess the secrets of the heart." -Saint Jerome
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
"Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
news:evnua5d2oua28vped...@4ax.com...
There is a lot I disagree with Dave about his beliefs, but not in this
excellent post, he hits the nail squarely and exactly on the head and
exposes the real underhand intensions of Michael James and others of the
[fornicating] Sodomite/Lesbian persuasion.
__
Veff...
"9 Or know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?
Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor
effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men, 10 nor thieves, nor
covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the
kingdom of God." 1 Cor 6:9-10 (ASV)
I
<whatever>
1. Which is the ONE and ONLY true ending to Mark's gospel? There are
SEVERAL!!!!
2. The BIBLE CONDONES SLAVERY in both the Old and New Testament.
WHY AREN'T YOU PETITIONING THE LAWMAKERS TO DECRIMINALISE SLAVERY BECAUSE
GOD CONDONES SLAVERY - IT SAYS SO IN "GOD'S WORD"?????
Randy ®
I <me@home000000000000524> wrote:
Where's your authoritative word of God that gave you knowledge of
and faith in the "truth" about Jesus and Yahweh, since you claim
you can't know if anything in the Bible is not an error?
_______________________
_______________________
--
Have you heard Christ died for our sins, and God raised Him
from the dead? Did you know God saves you from hell and
gives you eternal life through faith in this finished work alone,
not your merits (Jn. 3:16; 1 Cor. 15:1-3; Eph. 2:8-10; 2 Thess.
1:8-9)? This is so man cannot boast, and God alone gets the
glory (Eph. 2:8-9).
______________________________________________
www.faithguard.org
www.twitter.com/faithguard
www.facebook.com/faithguard
______________________________________________
Michael James
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> "Pastor Dave" <ananias917_@_gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:evnua5d2oua28vped...@4ax.com...
>
>
>
> > On Mon, 14 Sep 2009 09:01:14 -0700 (PDT), Michael James
There is nothing underhanded in expressing one's real thoughts. That
you accuse me of being 'underhanded' is just another one of your nasty
feelings towards any one whose sexual orientation differs from yours.
I say what I think period and there is nothing underhanded in that.
At least I don't use the Bible to justify feelings of hatred towards
others as you do.
Asfor PD the post you are referring to I answered honestly with NO
UNDERHANDEDNESS.
NO REVILERS?
That is what you are doing to me! You judgement is on your head
BTW you incessant post against gays definitely seems pyscho,
expecially your suggestion that they should be treated like in the Old
Testament - stoned to death, as you mentioned in another one of your
posts.
Then you accuse soldiers in theatre of war kiilling for their country
as not being Chistian. What hypocrisy. Do take the bean out of your
eye.
How dare you accuse others of killing when that is what you would do
with homosexuals!
Michael James
> There is nothing underhanded in expressing one's real thoughts. That
> you accuse me of being 'underhanded' is just another one of your nasty
> feelings towards any one whose sexual orientation differs from yours.
> I say what I think period and there is nothing underhanded in that.
> At least I don't use the Bible to justify feelings of hatred towards
> others as you do.
>
> Asfor PD the post you are referring to I answered honestly with NO
> UNDERHANDEDNESS.
>
> NO REVILERS?
>
> That is what you are doing to me! You judgement is on your head
>
> BTW you incessant post against gays definitely seems pyscho,
> expecially your suggestion that they should be treated like in the Old
> Testament - stoned to death, as you mentioned in another one of your
> posts.
>
> Then you accuse soldiers in theatre of war kiilling for their country
> as not being Chistian. What hypocrisy. Do take the bean out of your
> eye.
>
> How dare you accuse others of killing when that is what you would do
> with homosexuals!
> I should add a lot of soldiers were killing in WWII , whom you consider unChristian and a lot died so that you have >the freedom today to shoot off your mouth and make nasty accusations about them, and me and anyone else who >doesn't fit you views.
>***********************************************************************************
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
"Michael James" <michae...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
>BTW you incessant post against gays definitely seems pyscho,
>expecially your suggestion that they should be treated like in the Old
>Testament - stoned to death,
In which post have I suggested that 'gays' as you call them, should be
stoned to death?
Thanks.
__
Veff...
Michael James
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
In the post where you said they should be treated like inb the old
testament...where they were stoned to death
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
On Nov 9, 5:38 pm, "1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist"
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
> >BTW you incessant post against gays definitely seems pyscho,
> >expecially your suggestion that they should be treated like in the Old
> >Testament - stoned to death,
>
> In which post have I suggested that 'gays' as you call them, should be
> stoned to death?
> Thanks.
> __
> Veff...
~ In the post where you said they should be treated like inb the old
~ testament...where they were stoned to death
Then show me the post.
Thanks!
__
Veff...
Michael James
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
>
> news:31f2c444-8f83-48dd...@m38g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
> On Nov 9, 5:38 pm, "1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist"
>
> <broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> > "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
> > >BTW you incessant post against gays definitely seems pyscho,
> > >expecially your suggestion that they should be treated like in the Old
> > >Testament - stoned to death,
>
> > In which post have I suggested that 'gays' as you call them, should be
> > stoned to death?
> > Thanks.
> > __
> > Veff...
>
> ~ In the post where you said they should be treated like inb the old
> ~ testament...where they were stoned to death
>
> Then show me the post.
> Thanks!
> __
> Veff...
Yeah, like I am going to to go back through all your posts like your
secretary. You know which one. The one where I said your post could
be considered criminal in Canada. Tim mentioned that it was similar
in the UK. Remember now?
Michael James
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
>
> news:31f2c444-8f83-48dd...@m38g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
> On Nov 9, 5:38 pm, "1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist"
>
> <broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> > "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
> > >BTW you incessant post against gays definitely seems pyscho,
> > >expecially your suggestion that they should be treated like in the Old
> > >Testament - stoned to death,
>
> > In which post have I suggested that 'gays' as you call them, should be
> > stoned to death?
> > Thanks.
> > __
> > Veff...
>
> ~ In the post where you said they should be treated like inb the old
> ~ testament...where they were stoned to death
>
> Then show me the post.
> Thanks!
> __
> Veff...
" Such blatant immorality and homosexual perversion will be
punished
> as severely as in the days of Moses.
> __
> Veff... " you typed gleefully.
------How did they punish gays back then? ref: Leviticus LAPIDATION !
(which means killing with extreme brutality)
Remember now?
******************************************************************
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
On Nov 10, 3:27 am, "1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist"
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
>
> news:31f2c444-8f83-48dd...@m38g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
> On Nov 9, 5:38 pm, "1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist"
>
> <broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> > "Michael James" <michaelrja...@videotron.ca> wrote in message
> > >BTW you incessant post against gays definitely seems pyscho,
> > >expecially your suggestion that they should be treated like in the Old
> > >Testament - stoned to death,
>
> > In which post have I suggested that 'gays' as you call them, should be
> > stoned to death?
> > Thanks.
> > __
> > Veff...
>
> ~ In the post where you said they should be treated like inb the old
> ~ testament...where they were stoned to death
>
> Then show me the post.
> Thanks!
> __
> Veff...
~Yeah, like I am going to to go back through all your posts like your
~secretary. You know which one. The one where I said your post could
~be considered criminal in Canada. Tim mentioned that it was similar
~in the UK. Remember now?
You mean this one.....
.> "- .. -- Tim .-." <timrea...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
>
> > Similarly, most Christians do not believe sex before marriage is good
> > moral behaviour, but few would support making it *illegal* in the
> > secular
> > law.
>
I stated:
> Why ever not?
> It would be a marvelous moral step forward and indeed will be the case on
> the Lord's Return when the saints reign over the nations, with a "Rod of
> iron".
>Such blatant immorality and homosexual perversion will be punished
> as severely as in the days of Moses.
Which it will be so when Christ returns, but I never mentioned the actual
punishment or that it ought to carried out today.
So you are fantasying within your own mind something I never stated.
Thus you cunningly attempted to promote a despicable lie, Michael.
Shame on you!!
__
Veff...
Michael James
Not cunning, you paranoid person,
Again you accuse me of being cunning ,a liar and underhanded. You
may disagree with what I say , but do not accuse me of these things..
These things you *revile* me of are NOT true, I write what I think,
no hyprocrisy no cunning. I have seen too many people in my life
like you pretending to so holy and righteous , spewing their hatred
towards gay people and justifying that hatred with the bible. No
I am not fantasying what I have seen and experienced in my life and I
have seen happen to other gays, from Bible Thumpers who hate gays
JUST LIKE YOU
it is what I see implied in your texts, that you endorce the idea of
gays being punished with stoning.
No you never mentioned a time frame AT ALL! Clever.
So who is the cunning one now . You word it so you can worm out of
any idea that you would love to see faggots stoned.
*revilers will not enter the kingdom
No you never 'stated' you implied. Faggots being stoned that is
your vision of what Christ wants.
Michael James
Not cunning, you paranoid person,
Again you accuse me of being cunning ,a liar and underhanded. You
may disagree with what I say , but do not accuse me of these things..
These things you *revile* me of are NOT true, I write what I think,
no hyprocrisy no cunning. I have seen too many people in my life
like you pretending to so holy and righteous , spewing their hatred
towards gay people and justifying that hatred with the bible. No
I am not fantasying what I have seen and experienced in my life and I
have seen happen to other gays, from Bible Thumpers who hate gays
JUST LIKE YOU
it is what I see implied in your texts, that you endorce the idea of
gays being punished with stoning.....MURDERED.
No you never mentioned a time frame AT ALL! Clever. No you never
'stated' you implied
So who is the cunning one now . You word it so you can worm out of
any idea that you would love to see faggots stoned.
You are attirbuting your thoughts and desires to those Christ
wants but he does not want or ever would want ANY harm to come to me
or any other gays person.
You are not preaching the Gospel of Christ, ..... you are preaching
the Gospel of Jeff.
*revilers will not enter the kingdom - fromthe text you have quoted
hundreds of times
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
~Not cunning, you paranoid person,
Oh! yes! you thought you could twist my words to mean something I did not
state.
> Again you accuse me of being cunning ,a liar and underhanded.
Exactly!
> You may disagree with what I say , but do not accuse me of these things.
Then don't participate in them.
>These things you *revile* me of are NOT true, I write what I think,
>no hyprocrisy no cunning.
They are true, you did it with the passage I proposed and tried to turn it
to suit your sick hate for anyone who cares to remind you of what will
happen to those who persist in their homosexual fornication without sorrow
and repentance.
> it is what I see implied in your texts, that you endorce the idea of
>gays being punished with stoning.
God put them there as a warning to be shown to all who abuse their bodies
with homosexual fornication.
>No you never mentioned a time frame AT ALL! Clever.
Because it is not to be in this dispensation, as we are now in a period of
grace, allowing people to repent and change their evil lifestyles and be
saved for the corruptive lives they are living before God.
But one day it will end, just as the time allowed to Sodom & Gomorrah
finally came to a head.....and we all know what happened to those evil,
wicked men.
~So who is the cunning one now. You word it so you can worm out of
~any idea that you would love to see faggots stoned.
Frankly it effects me neither way if 'faggots' as you call them, are or not
punished today, it doesn't affect my life at all, I am doing such people
service by showing them what will happen if they keep resisting God and the
Gospel message.
I am really their best 'friend' as if they hearken they can escape form the
clutches of their iniquity and come to "Resist the Devil" and start living
godly
moral lives before God.
>*revilers will not enter the kingdom
>No you never 'stated' you implied.
Which is what the Scripture does do to make sure it is understood in a
serious manner.
Then on their judgment day they cannot say to God "If only we had been
warned of the terrible consequences of our persistent fornication and
ungodly and [proven vie AIDS] disease ridden lifestyles and given the
opportunity of repentance"
__
Veff...
Thus hearken to Paul and start to become a wise man, Michael.
"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be
not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor
effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with men, 10 nor thieves, nor
covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the
kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you" 1 Cor 6:9-11 (ASV)
Notice the words "And such WERE some of you"
They weren't anymore....
Michael James
You say nothing nut nasty comments about me. You think you are right
and have the right to say these things.
I hope that Christ appears to you and shows you things that the Bible
can only feebly describe, then you will change your mind and never
speak to anyone again the offensiveway you have spoken to me
guardian Snow
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com>
> And as for allowing such evil people to become leaders in your churches it
> is a true "Abomination" and if you can't see it, you are not a genuine
> Christian believer.
> __
> Veff...
Good for him, what is that anyway? A person who lives like a demon
six days a week, gives praise to Paul Sunday morning and argues for
eternity about conflicts in scriptures?
We are required by scriptures to warn our brothers of the fact that
their behavior is wrong.
Eze 3:17 “Son of man, I have made you a watchman for the house of
Yisra’ĕl. And you shall hear a word from My mouth, and shall warn them
from Me.
Why do we presume to speak for the Almighty? The applicable words
are, “from My mouth”, have all of you heard the Almighty speaking to
you from his mouth to your ears?
Eze 3:19 “But if you have warned the wrong and he does not turn from
his wrong, nor from his wrong way, he shall die in his crookedness,
and you have delivered your being.
When we speak our peace to other people, we have fulfilled our
obligation to warn our brothers when they are wrong. Why do people
live in judgment of other people when clearly scriptures teach us not
to do this? If we believe somebody is in error, we should speak up
but then,
Pro 26:20 Where no wood is, there the fire goeth out: so where there
is no talebearer, the strife ceaseth.
Scriptures repeat over and over that we should leave them alone:
Isa 55:7 Let the wrong forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his
thoughts. Let him return to Yahweh, who has compassion on him, and to
our Elohim, for He pardons much. 8 “For My thoughts are not your
thoughts, neither are your ways My ways,” declares Yahweh. 9 “For as
the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your
ways, and My thoughts than your thoughts.
Let the wrong forsake his way! WOW, you mean it’s not our job to go
around accusing every other person of being the antichrist?
Rev 22:11 “He who does wrong, let him do more wrong; he who is filthy,
let him be more filthy; he who is righteous, let him be more
righteous; he who is set-apart, let him be more set-apart.
Are we seeing this? He who is wrong, LET HIM DO MORE WRONG… This
can’t be true, how could this be in the bible?
Eze 3:27 “But when I speak with you, I open your mouth, and you shall
say to them, ‘Thus said the Master Yahweh.’ He who hears, let him
hear. And he who refuses, let him refuse, for they are a rebellious
house.
He who refuses, “Let him refuse”… You mean the idea of leaving people
that you might consider wicked alone isn’t a unique teaching?
Mar 8:33 And turning around and seeing His taught ones, He rebuked
Kĕpha, saying, “Get behind Me, Satan! For your thoughts are not those
of Elohim, but those of men.”
That our thoughts are not his thoughts aren’t unique is something we
should all consider in our peaceful journey forward. Learning to
respect even those that disagree with us is not something unscriptural
or some fancy new age teaching.
Mat 15:13 But He answering, said, “Every plant which My heavenly
Father has not planted shall be uprooted.
Mat 15:14 “Leave them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And
if the blind leads the blind, both shall fall into a ditch.”
It’s not something only the Messiah taught, it’s Old Testament.
Hos 4:17 “Ephrayim is joined to idols, let him alone.
I have no doubt that this is a hard teaching to follow for us.. that
we let them be what they are but in doing so, we submit to the
teachings of our scriptures and show by our works, the faith that
motivate our actions.
Hos 4:4 “However, let no one strive or reprove another, for your
people are like those striving with a priest. 5 “And you shall
stumble in the day, and the prophet shall also stumble with you in the
night. And I shall make your mother perish. 6 “My people have
perished for lack of knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge, I
reject you from being priest for Me. Since you have forgotten the
Torah of your Elohim, I also forget your children.
Yahweh desires that we know and understand but this does not happen
when we waste our time passing OUR judgment on our other people. The
scriptures are very clear in that we are not to strive with other
people. Now this is not to say that we can’t have a spirited debate
which by the very meaning is righteous, only that it is not our place
to seek to subvert other peoples understandings.
Eze 18:23 “Have I any pleasure in the death of the wrong?” declares
the Master Yahweh. “Is it not that he should turn from his ways, and
live?
I strongly recommend people read Ezekiel especially chapters, 3, 18
and 33 which are all relevant to the topic.
Deu 17:12 “And the man who acts arrogantly, so as not to listen to the
priest who stands to serve there before Yahweh your Elohim, or to the
judge, that man shall die. So you shall purge the evil from IsraEL.
We have ONE JUDGE and ONE CREATOR who will judge all, don’t try to
think it’s you. Be Humble.
Shalom,
*´¨)
¸.•´ ¸.•*´¨) ¸.•*¨)
(¸.•´ (¸.• (Snow(.¸.•*´¨)
Respond directly:
http://groups.google.com/group/messianicYehoshua
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/messianic_Yehoshua/
The heart of another is a dark forest, always, no matter how close it
has been to one's own.
Willa Cather
An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation,
nor does truth become error because nobody sees it.
Mohandas Gandhi
http://www.isr-messianic.org/ <- download the scriptures free
http://messianicyehoshua.googlegroups.com/web/RNKJV.zip <--free
download of the Restored Names King James Version
Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other
time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are the change that
we seek.
Barack Obama
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
"guardian Snow" <snowp...@eck.net.au> wrote in message
news:a97b3678-14ce-40ca...@i12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> And as for allowing such evil people to become leaders in your churches it
> is a true "Abomination" and if you can't see it, you are not a genuine
> Christian believer.
> __
> Veff...
~Good for him, what is that anyway? A person who lives like a demon
~six days a week, gives praise to Paul Sunday morning and argues for
~eternity about conflicts in scriptures?
~We are required by scriptures to warn our brothers of the fact that
~their behavior is wrong.
~We have ONE JUDGE and ONE CREATOR who will judge all, don’t try to
~think it’s you. Be Humble.
-------------------------------
Meanwhile.......
"1 I charge thee in the sight of God, and of Christ Jesus, who shall judge
the living and the dead, and by his appearing and his kingdom:
2 preach the word; be urgent in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke,
exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching.
3 For the time will come when they will not endure the sound doctrine; but,
having itching ears, will heap to themselves teachers after their own lusts;
4 and will turn away their ears from the truth, and turn aside unto fables."
2 Tim 4:1-4 (ASV)
__
Veff...
Michael James
<broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> "guardian Snow" <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote in message
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
~You say nothing nut nasty comments about me.
If you attempt to put words in my mouth by altering what I state, what else
can you expect but righteous rebuke and correction?
>You think you are right
>and have the right to say these things.
The truth is its own defence and has a habit of turning around and biting
anyone falsely accusing it, that is why you are hurt, miffed and angry.
>I hope that Christ appears to you and shows you things that the Bible
>can only feebly describe,
It is not "feebly describe" to me it is "Quick, and powerful, and sharper
than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and
spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and
intents of the heart." Heb 4:12 (KJV)
That is why you have cornered yourself.
>then you will change your mind
I will never change my mind in what the Bible teaches whether...... on a
women's deportment in the church or in the home......killing enemies in
wars, or self protection.....warning fornicators and adulterers whether
hetro or homo or remarrieds living in adultery, amongst many other things
the churches of Christendom wickedly indulge themselves in today.
So if you cannot stand the penetrating heat of Inspired Paul's excellent
teachings, better to stay out of the Biblical kitchen and join your friends
in the homosexual newsgroups where you will no doubt be very happy and
content.
__
Veff...
"And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men
loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20 For
every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light,
lest his deeds should be reproved." John 3:19-20 (KJV)
mose
Well if you really want to pass on Gods word perhaps you had better
familiarse yourself with the new testament? unless you are denying it? which
simply makes you jews. however not the same as modern jews who claim that
the talmud is what the jewish religion is based on.
CHECK THE Talmud
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-6657600254881054584&hl=en
If you're interested this is the reason Jesus was crucified.
See the problem is who are the people that God chose? The killers that
follow the Talmud written by rabbis apparently obssesed with hate or the
Torah, Gods bible, or so claimed.
So which are you? frauds representing yourself as God's chosen.
Or true followers of the Torah and so God's law.
"1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist" <broadband1234[remove]@ntlworld.com>
wrote in message news:7m0jfvF...@mid.individual.net...