New York taxi boss shops for new cabs - Crown Vic's dominance in Big Apple may end
C. E. White
Crown Vic's dominance in Big Apple may end
Ryan Beene
Automotive News
January 18, 2008 - 4:23 pm ET
DETROIT -- The Ford Crown Victoria sedan, which has been the workhorse
of New York's taxicab fleet, could be history.
The New York City Taxi and Limousine Commission is shopping for a new
generation of cars to be phased in to its fleet of about 13,000 yellow
cabs. Officials from New York's taxi commission were at the auto show
this week to discuss their Taxi of Tomorrow project with major
automakers.
" We met with all of the major automobile manufacturers," commission
Chairman Matthew Daus told Automotive News. " We're taking this as an
opportunity to ask manufacturers to custom-build the utopian cab for
us."
Daus said such a cab would be reasonably priced, fuel efficient,
accessible for passengers with disabilities and distinctively styled.
To help draft specifications for the cab project, the commission has
contracted with the suburban Detroit operations of the U.K. automotive
engineering and technology firm Ricardo PLC as a consultant.
Specifications will be sent to every major automaker in about a month,
Daus said. He declined to name specific companies.
Taxi program
The Crown Victoria has been the dominant cab in the New York fleet for
years. While about 18 percent of the city-administered fleet is
supplied by other automakers, Ford has a taxi program that alters
Crown Victorias on request.
" The difference between the Ford Crown Victoria and every other
vehicle that's out there is that Ford is the only one that came up
with a taxi package program, a commercial-vehicle initiative where
they actually tailor the vehicle over the years to make it a better
taxi," Daus said. " The other manufacturers have not authorized
specifically a program to use these vehicles as taxis."
In 2001, Ford lengthened Crown Victorias destined to be in the cab
fleet by about 6 inches, upon request by the city of New York, Daus
said.
But rising fuel costs, environmental awareness, recently increased
fuel economy standards for New York cabs and the inevitable demise of
the Crown Victoria are pushing the issue.
" The Crown Victoria is basically coming to an end," Daus said. "
We're looking to make our environment cleaner and be more fuel
efficient and save more money for drivers and the owners, so you could
basically say that the Crown Victoria is going to be phased out."
That could upset a lot of New York cab riders. A survey by CNW
Marketing Research, of Bandon, Ore., found that 95 percent of
respondents preferred the Crown Victoria over other New York cabs,
such as the dozen Toyota Prius sedans the city has in its fleet.
" The Crown Vic has been a spectacular fleet car," CNW analyst Art
Spinella said in a phone interview with Automotive News. " It's
perfect for what it does."
Spinella said Ford would benefit if it continued to dominate the New
York fleet, but that doesn't mean it will happen.
Phone messages to Ford Motor were not returned today." If Ford were to
stay doing nothing but Crown Vics for taxis and upgrading them to some
degree, maybe fitting a more fuel-efficient V-6 instead of a V-8 in it
or hybridizing it, they could probably hold on to 70 to 75 percent of
that market," Spinella said. " But I'm not sure that they want to
spend the money to do it."
Big Apple is biggest
New York is the largest purchaser of cabs, according to the Taxicab,
Limousine &Paratransit Association, of Kensington, Md. Second is
Chicago, where the dominant cab also is the Crown Victoria.
New York has been testing other vehicles as it retires and replaces
cabs every three to five years. The city's fleet includes hybrids,
vans and SUVs from a number of automakers, but Daus said there isn't a
vehicle now on the market that can solve the city's needs.
Hybrids could be a viable fleet solution for New York, Spinella said,
citing two nameplates: the Ford Escape Hybrid. and the Prius.
The Escape Hybrid " may be Ford's ace in the hole," Spinella said,
adding that if Ford could strip it down, the car could be sold at a
cheaper price.
While the Prius gets poor marks for lack of cargo space, Spinella said
building something larger on the Prius frame could make it a viable
cab.
Said Spinella: " It might be in Toyota's best interest to turn the
Prius into a London-taxi-type of vehicle. The Prius is sturdy enough
to be transformed into that type of vehicle."
By taking a chance on a relatively low-volume fleet, the rewards could
be bigger than the initial risk, he said, adding: " If New York does
it, you know Chicago and some other major Eastern cities are going to
do the same thing."
DeserTBoB
<cewh...@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>New York taxi boss shops for new cabs
>
>Crown Vic's dominance in Big Apple may end
>
>Ryan Beene
>Automotive News
>January 18, 2008 - 4:23 pm ET
>
>DETROIT -- The Ford Crown Victoria sedan, which has been the workhorse
>of New York's taxicab fleet, could be history.<snip>
It's already history. Toyota is swamping NYC's cab industry with the
enormously successful minivan version. Also, police agencies are
abandoning the tired, obsolete Crown Vickie for the Dodge Charger in
droves.
The Crown Vickie has been a fairly obsolete vehicle or years now, and
didn't improve any after its last competition left the marketplace,
the Chrysler M-body in 1989 and the old Chevy Caprice left a few years
later. Small interior space with large exterior bulk is one problem,
horrid fuel economy is another. At last tally I saw, there are fewer
than 100 Crown Vickies on Ford dealers' lots right now nationwide, and
ZERO Marquises.
It's over, and high time it was.
Retired VIP
<cewh...@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>New York taxi boss shops for new cabs
>
>Crown Vic's dominance in Big Apple may end
>
>Ryan Beene
>Automotive News
>January 18, 2008 - 4:23 pm ET
>
>DETROIT -- The Ford Crown Victoria sedan, which has been the workhorse
>of New York's taxicab fleet, could be history.
The Crown Vic and it's sister, the Mercury Grand Marquis are the last
examples of the Detroit Iron of old. They are full-size, rear wheel
drive V8's and make great cabs, police cars or fleet vehicles but they
are dated and their production is coming to an end. A suitable
replacement is needed and not just by taxi fleets.
Nobody in his/her right mind would get into a high-speed pursuit with
today's front-wheel drive 4 bangers, their handling is just too
unpredictable. They go from understeer to oversteer with little or no
warning. I don't know what will replace the Crown Vic in taxi fleets
but I can almost guarantee that state police fleets will stay with
some brand/type of rear wheel drive vehicle.
Jack
C. E. White
"DeserTBoB" <des...@rglobal.net> wrote in message
news:std9p3p16vangt4g3...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 21 Jan 2008 09:10:01 -0500, "C. E. White"
> <cewh...@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>New York taxi boss shops for new cabs
>>
>>Crown Vic's dominance in Big Apple may end
>>
>>Ryan Beene
>>Automotive News
>>January 18, 2008 - 4:23 pm ET
>>
>>DETROIT -- The Ford Crown Victoria sedan, which has been the
>>workhorse
>>of New York's taxicab fleet, could be history.<snip>
>
> It's already history. Toyota is swamping NYC's cab industry with
> the
> enormously successful minivan version. Also, police agencies are
> abandoning the tired, obsolete Crown Vickie for the Dodge Charger in
> droves.
I am not sure what you mean by "swamping." From
http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/12/19/imagining-super-taxis-of-the-future/ :
"Among the 13,000 taxi medallions out there, there are 11,324 Crown
Victoria Sedans, 1,318 Toyta Sienna minivans, 216 Ford Escape
sport-utility vehicles, 61 Toyota Highlander S.U.V.'s, 52 Chevy
Uplander S.U.V.'s, 6 Toyota Prius sedans, 5 Honda Odyssey minivans, 4
Toyota Campry sedans, 2 Dodge Grand Caravan S.U.V.'s"
I am not sure 1,318 Siennas are "swamping" 11,324 Crown Vistorias.
> The Crown Vickie has been a fairly obsolete vehicle or years now,
> and
> didn't improve any after its last competition left the marketplace,
> the Chrysler M-body in 1989 and the old Chevy Caprice left a few
> years
> later. Small interior space with large exterior bulk is one
> problem,
Ford actually builds a long wheel base Crown Victoria for the cab
industry. It has even more rear seat room than the very roomy standard
Crown Victoria.
> horrid fuel economy is another.
Actually Crown Victorias get relativelty good fuel economy, the same
as the V-8 Chargers, and they have much more interior room. A 2008 CV
is EPA rated 15 city, 23 highway, 18 combined. A 2008 Sienna mini-van
is rated 17 city, 23 highway, 19 combined. A V-8 Charger (not the high
performance V-8) is rated 15 city, 23 highway, 18 combined (same as
the CV, despite being smaller and lighter).
> At last tally I saw, there are fewer
> than 100 Crown Vickies on Ford dealers' lots right now nationwide,
> and
> ZERO Marquises.
Ford has decided to concentrate on fleet sales for the Crown Victoria,
but the Grand Marquis is still being marketed to the general public -
I just saw an ad for them last Friday. The Mercury dealer closest to
my house (Capital Lincoln-Mercury, Cary, NC) had over twenty 2008
Grand Marquis in stock. The local Ford dealer has a few 2007 Crown
Victorias in stock, but no 2008s and Ford doesn't even list the CV on
the Ford website (the Grand Marquis is prominently listed on the
Mercury web site).
Ed
Mike hunt
car/SUV, built on an AWD chassis, that will come to market later this year,
that will fill the bill as a CV replacement. There is no question that the
CV is the prefered NEW cab in major US cities. What most poeple do not know
however is the fast majority of CV cabs in NYC were purchased USED not new.
NYC cabs, in general for the most part, are puchased used. Nearly half of
the CV cabs in NYC are rebuilt former police cars, many with well over 500K
on the clock. ;)
"C. E. White" <cewh...@removemindspring.com> wrote in message
news:4794a819$1@kcnews01...
Mike hunt
totaly differant car from 1999. New body, new chassis, new engine, new
tranny, new electronics, get real
.
"DeserTBoB" <des...@rglobal.net> wrote in message
news:std9p3p16vangt4g3...@4ax.com...
Mike hunt
are filled with Gipsy and Livery cabs, not medallion cabs ;)
"C. E. White" <cewh...@removemindspring.com> wrote in message
news:4794c078$1@kcnews01...
Mike hunt
drivetrain parts etc.from others
"dbu" <nos...@nospam.moc> wrote in message
news:nospam-EDC53C....@comcast.dca.giganews.com...
> In article <CqGdnSSyNJD0QAna...@ptd.net>,
> "Mike hunt" <mikeh...@lycos.com> wrote:
>
>> The name excape me at the monment but Ford has a new box crossover like
>> car/SUV, built on an AWD chassis, that will come to market later this
>> year,
>> that will fill the bill as a CV replacement. There is no question that
>> the
>> CV is the prefered NEW cab in major US cities. What most poeple do not
>> know
>> however is the fast majority of CV cabs in NYC were purchased USED not
>> new.
>> NYC cabs, in general for the most part, are puchased used. Nearly half
>> of
>> the CV cabs in NYC are rebuilt former police cars, many with well over
>> 500K
>> on the clock. ;)
>
> What ever happened to the Checkers?
> --
>
>
> "We're going to take things away from you on behalf of the common good."
>
> Hillary Clinton
do...@28.usenet.us.com
> New York taxi boss shops for new cabs
> Hybrids could be a viable fleet solution for New York, Spinella said,
> citing two nameplates: the Ford Escape Hybrid. and the Prius.
I thought it was a done deal, mostly Escapes and Highlanders, with some
Prius.
http://www.nyc.gov/html/tlc/html/home/home.shtml
"MAYOR BLOOMBERG ANNOUNCES TAXI FLEET TO BE FULLY HYBRID BY 2012"
"Currently there are only 375 hybrid vehicles in the City's taxi fleet. By
October 2008, the number of hybrids in the fleet will triple. The phase-in
for the City fleet to become completely hybrid is as follows:
October 2008 - 1000 yellow hybrid taxicabs;
October 2009 - 4000 yellow hybrid taxicabs (30% of the fleet)
October 2010 - 7000 yellow hybrid taxicabs (53% of the fleet)
October 2011 - 10000 yellow hybrid taxicabs (76% of the fleet)
October 2012 - all yellow taxicabs will be hybrid (100% of the fleet)
"
--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5
Mike hunt
vehicle many years ago, for the reasons you cite. Several toopers were
injured and killed doing so in the FWD cars supplied by the feds under the
"55 Alive" program. The few FWD cars they do buy are used for
administrative work or by detictves
.
"Retired VIP" <jackj.ext...@windstream.net> wrote in message
news:a9f9p39apeqotgir9...@4ax.com...
Tomes
"Mike hunt" <mikeh...@lycos.com> wrote in message
news:DfednYlzr-ogdAna...@ptd.net...
> Price! Checkers were "assembled" cars, they only made bodies and puchased
> drivetrain parts etc.from others
>
>
Tomes
(back from the Usenet dead)
Tomes
TV channel uses a Sienna and it seems to work well.
Bruce L. Bergman
There's no problem in using FWD in a pursuit - just keep the front
wheels aimed where you want to go and stand on the gas, the rear end
will follow in due time... (See "Drifting".) The problem is that all
the cops that are used to driving the big old front engine RWD barges
will all have to re-learn how to drive practically from scratch, and
the thought scares them.
Building a larger Prius or Escape hybrid specifically modified for
the needs of cops and taxis would be useful. For starters, when the
engine is driving that huge traction alternator, no more worries about
not having enough 12V for the light bar and the radios. Just leave
the engine in "Standby" mode, and it will start itself up and recharge
the accessory battery as needed.
And it would be nice to have the auxiliary power, space for mounting
a computer terminal, 2-way radios and a shotgun rack (that the airbags
already have been tested to clear) all engineered in by the car-maker.
Most cop cars and taxis require many hours of semi-custom hand
modifications before they can be put into service, pre-planning can
cut that cost significantly.
They would need to boost the engine horsepower output, perhaps with
a turbocharger, a simple enough trick if the computer runs the
wastegate. Seriously stiffen up the suspension. And reprogram the
hybrid computer to allow for more aggressive driving and higher top
speeds - if you floorboard it and dump full engine power and full
battery power to the drive wheels at the same time, you want to be
able to boil the tires just like those good old big-blocks did...
Oh, and a circuit to desensitize the airbags in a pursuit - too many
crooks have learned the trick of "Pop A Cop". If there's only one
cruiser behind you, just slam on the brakes and get him to rear-end
you, and "Bang!" he's out of the chase.
--<< Bruce >>--
Mike hunt
not all cabs.
<do...@28.usenet.us.com> wrote in message news:fn2psl$la9$2...@blue.rahul.net...
Mike hunt
"Tomes" <ask...@here.net> wrote in message
news:fn2ssf$v38$1...@registered.motzarella.org...
Mike hunt
higher top speeds?" You aparently have not drive in NYC lately LOL
"Bruce L. Bergman" <blnospa...@earthlink.invalid> wrote in message
news:dts9p3tr5uin7ndpp...@4ax.com...
JoeSpareBedroom
Lately? How about EVER? :-)
Jeff
> Better make that "medallion" cabs. The city only regulates medallion cabs,
> not all cabs.
What other type of cabs are there in NYC other than medallion cabs? In
NYC, there are lots of Limos, and they are regulated by the same folks
who regulate the cabs, the taxi and limo commission. The city also
regulates the pedicabs (the pedal-powered tricycles that carry tourists
around) and horse-pulled carriages.
Of course, there are gypsy cabs, but, they are licensed by any one. And
there are cabs from New Jersey and Long Island and other places, but
they don't pick up people in NYC.
Jeff
Jeff
> The operative word is "Medallion" cabs. As any Newyorker knows the streets
> are filled with Gipsy and Livery cabs, not medallion cabs ;)
I just in NYC with my mentee in midtown. I saw plenty of medallion cabs.
In Harlem, most of the cab service is done by limos. The limos I have
seen almost always have a TL&C license plate on them.
Limos and livery vehicles (limos) are regulated by the city.
Jeff
Jeff
> The name excape me at the monment but Ford has a new box crossover like
> car/SUV, built on an AWD chassis, that will come to market later this year,
> that will fill the bill as a CV replacement.
Not in all major cities. NYC has placed fuel mileage requirements that
are being phased in over the next few years. Currently, the only
vehicles that meet the requirements are hybrids. Obviously, if an
automaker comes out with a suitable vehicle that is not a hybrid that
meets the mileage requirements, that vehicle would be able to be
licensed as a taxi.
> There is no question that the
> CV is the prefered NEW cab in major US cities. What most poeple do not know
> however is the fast majority of CV cabs in NYC were purchased USED not new.
> NYC cabs, in general for the most part, are puchased used. Nearly half of
> the CV cabs in NYC are rebuilt former police cars, many with well over 500K
> on the clock. ;)
Really? Why would one buy a new police car, use it for less than 500
miles, then sell it to a taxi company or owner?
In NYC, there is a requirement that all taxicabs have less less than 500
miles traveled at the time of hack-up.
For reference, see Chapter 3, Taxicab Specs, page 3:
http://www.nyc.gov/html/tlc/html/rules/rules.shtml
Jeff
Jeff
>> car/SUV, built on an AWD chassis, that will come to market later this year,
>> that will fill the bill as a CV replacement. There is no question that the
>> CV is the prefered NEW cab in major US cities. What most poeple do not know
>> however is the fast majority of CV cabs in NYC were purchased USED not new.
>> NYC cabs, in general for the most part, are puchased used. Nearly half of
>> the CV cabs in NYC are rebuilt former police cars, many with well over 500K
>> on the clock. ;)
>
Checker cabs went out soon after the Taxi show left ABC. Taxi's last
season on ABC was 1981-82. The last checker came off the line in July
1982. Checker motors still makes body parts for GM.
Jeff
Jeff
> Price! Checkers were "assembled" cars, they only made bodies and puchased
> drivetrain parts etc.from others
They still make body parts for GM.
There's no problem with using drive train parts from others. Ford and GM
do that, a lot.
In addition, the dies that they made body parts were worn out. The
design was out-of-date, wasn't aerodynamic and would have to be updated
to meet safety standards. Checker elected not to do that.
Jeff
Jeff
> GM indeed made Checkers great drivetains ;)
They also used Lycoming engines before WWII.
There's even one former Checker taxi still in use in NYC. The driver
will give anyone a free ride in the city. Of course, while he may not
charge anyone for a ride, there is no law against people giving him
tips, which they do.
A lot of people like riding in the old car.
Jeff
Jeff
In NYC, they also have Highlander Hybrids as Taxicabs.
Jeff DeWitt
Jeff DeWitt
Jeff DeWitt
Checker Motors shut down automobile production in 1982, but the company
still exists (as in Checker Cabs among other things).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Checker_Motors_Corporation
Jeff DeWitt
Ray O
<snipped>
> Toyota ought to make a hybrid Sienna. The Cash Cab (in NYC) on that cable
> TV channel uses a Sienna and it seems to work well.
> Tomes
> (back from the Usenet dead)
>
sold in the U.S.
--
Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)
Mr4701
"C. E. White" <cewh...@removemindspring.com> wrote in message
news:4794a819$1@kcnews01...
> New York taxi boss shops for new cabs
>
> Crown Vic's dominance in Big Apple may end
>
> Ryan Beene
> Automotive News
> January 18, 2008 - 4:23 pm ET
>
> DETROIT -- The Ford Crown Victoria sedan, which has been the workhorse of
> New York's taxicab fleet, could be history.
>
> Hybrids could be a viable fleet solution for New York, Spinella said,
> citing two nameplates: the Ford Escape Hybrid. and the Prius.
>
Jeff
Congratulations!
Jeff
Mike hunt
to see if they would hold up as cabs, they did poorly. Why the Mayor thinks
they will do any better today is a mistery
When I was still in the fleet service business, the majority of used police
cars we sold where taken up by cab compaines, particurally by NYC cab
companies
"Jeff" <kidsd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:zDblj.2831$pC5.817@trnddc05...
Retired VIP
FWD is okay in a pursuit as long as your going straight. The problem
arises when you try to turn. The differential will give you a power
bias that will screw up the cornering big time. Also, if you have
uneven traction on the front tires (one wheel on sand) you're screwed.
There is a good reason why all serious, high speed race cars are rear
wheel drive and it isn't because the drivers are afraid to learn new
tricks.
Jack
EdV
Is that the Estima in Japan?
Bruce L. Bergman
>dbu wrote:
>> What ever happened to the Checkers?
>
>Checker cabs went out soon after the Taxi show left ABC. Taxi's last
>season on ABC was 1981-82. The last checker came off the line in July
>1982. Checker motors still makes body parts for GM.
The problem that killed the Checker Cab as a production car is that
it costs between $50,000 and $500,000 to make a set of production body
panel or frame rail stamping dies for one panel, and each car model
takes several dozen die sets to produce.
Mass production carmakers can easily spread the tooling costs out
over 100,000 units per year per body style, and the structural
stampings for a common platform are often used for multiple models and
many model years, making them even more economical. And they stamp
and sell replacement panels to the aftermarket for many years using
those same dies.
Checker couldn't spend the big bucks needed (I'm guessing $10
Million minimum) to retool for a new car design to meet the safety
requirements - even if they sold 10,000 cars a year and didn't have to
change the dies again for 12 years or more, they'd still have to
charge double what a Detroit production car would run. And unless
they can promise double the durability, "No Sale".
The only thing that keeps Avanti Motors and other specialty
producers going is the use of fiberglass bodies, because production
molds cost a whole lot less than stamping dies.
--<< Bruce >>--
Ray O
"EdV" <syst...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bdb9651c-60d9-487d...@i7g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
Yes. This link describes the Estima Hybrid in English:
http://www.hybrid-vehicles.net/toyota-estima-hybrid-minivan.htm
EdV
> "EdV" <systme...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
I searched Estima in youtube and this came out.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=KrqkQRJh2os
Nice. If they ever do sell them in North America as Taxis I bet the
passengers would love the lazyboy passenger seats.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=OPg0NUj5uis
I does look smaller than the Sienna and suited for typical Asian body
size as seen on the 2nd video.
Daniel Who Wants to Know
news:qrclj.2841$pC5.273@trnddc05...
> It's already phasing in hybrids...
>
>
>
>
You have to consider the source here as this is the same CNW that said that
an H1 would go 379,000 miles on average VS a Prius at 109,000 IIRC. That
study has been thoroughly picked apart already many times.
Ray O
<snipped>
> Yes. This link describes the Estima Hybrid in
> English:http://www.hybrid-vehicles.net/toyota-estima-hybrid-minivan.htm
>> --
>>
>> Ray O
>> (correct punctuation to reply)
>
> I searched Estima in youtube and this came out.
>
> http://youtube.com/watch?v=KrqkQRJh2os
> Nice. If they ever do sell them in North America as Taxis I bet the
> passengers would love the lazyboy passenger seats.
>
> http://youtube.com/watch?v=OPg0NUj5uis
> I does look smaller than the Sienna and suited for typical Asian body
> size as seen on the 2nd video.
The Japan market Sienna is smaller than the one sold in the U.S. for several
reasons. One big consideration is that vehicle registration fees are
determined by the vehicle's physical size class, in addition to engine
displacement.
DeserTBoB
wrote:
>You don't know what you are talking about. The CV/Interceptor of today is a
>totaly differant car from 1999. <snip>
Who said anything about 1999? The CV/Marquis is still an old,
inefficient platform. Ever see a cop trying to shoehorn a perp into
the back seat of one of those things? They're a joke.
DeserTBoB
<jackj.ext...@windstream.net> wrote:
> I don't know what will replace the Crown Vic in taxi fleets
>but I can almost guarantee that state police fleets will stay with
>some brand/type of rear wheel drive vehicle. <snip>
That's because most cops don't know how to handle a FWD car, just like
the CHP found out that 90% of the deputies they had during the Ford
Mustang 5.0 disaster didn't really know how to drive a stick. The
lines of 5.0s with burned clutches and crunched boxes outside CHP
shops was impressive, to say the least.
Some jurisdictions have gone to FWD, and report no problems and better
economy.
DeserTBoB
wrote:
>"Reprogram the hybrid computer to allow for more aggressive driving and
>higher top speeds?" You aparently have not drive in NYC lately LOL <snip>
Exactly. You'll also remember that for years, NYPD's Plymouth fleets
came equipped with 225 slant 6s and 904 Torqueflites. Why have a V8,
when the best speed you could do on 5th Ave. was around 25 MPH? MAYBE
45 on the FDR...MAYBE.
DeserTBoB
wrote:
>I drove in New York City once by accident, once was enough! <G> <snip>
I drove a 40' highway coach (an MC-7) around Manhattan and Brooklyn
for a month. I've got street cred over ALL of ya. Never had an
accident, either, although I was a moving target for all the cabbies.
NYC in the '70s was sort of like watching a preview trailer for "Fort
Apache: The Bronx." Whatta DUMP!
I even screwed up just getting to the tunnel upon arrival by winding
up on the Skyway in NJ. That was a fat ticket.
Jeff
Don't forget, NYC includes the Bronx, Brooklyn and Queens. There are
highways there. And you reach pretty high speeds when it's not rush hour.
Jeff
C. E. White
"DeserTBoB" <des...@rglobal.net> wrote in message
news:nfvdp39utbgmjr5dm...@4ax.com...
Ford actually builds a long wheel base Crown Victoria with a larger back
seat. However, it is not intended for use as a pursuit vehicle. I've been in
the back of a CV police car (not as a criminal) and it is not too bad. The
one I was in would have been a lot better if it didn't have the divider
installed behind the back seat. The divider really cut down on the rear seat
leg room. BUT, if you think a Crown Vic is bad, take a look at the back seat
of a Charger.
Ed
bente...@gmail.com
wrote:
>
> The Crown Vic and it's sister, the Mercury Grand Marquis are the last
> examples of the Detroit Iron of old. They are full-size, rear wheel
> drive V8's and make great cabs, police cars or fleet vehicles but they
> are dated and their production is coming to an end. A suitable
> replacement is needed and not just by taxi fleets.
> Jack
What about the new big Dodges?
Cop versions are on the streets here, and they seem quite happy with
them. Could keep Dodge afloat until they come out with better small
cars (although those will probably come from China)
Jeff
Why do you think those will come from China? Which company will make
them. I don't think Chrysler has plants in China. And the small cars
they are going to sell in South America are coming from Nissan.
Jeff
Mike hunt
The Interecpter has the largest rear seat and trunk of all of the current
certified police vehicles sold in the US. Now go back in you hole LOL
"DeserTBoB" <des...@rglobal.net> wrote in message
news:nfvdp39utbgmjr5dm...@4ax.com...
Mike hunt
The fact is eight out of ten certified police vehicles sold in the US are
Intercepters. I owed a fleeet service business, that maitained thousands of
police vehicles, in six eastern states. I can asssure you many departments
that did buy FWD cars swithched bact to RWD because the much higher
mainatenance costs and down time that more than negated the $2,000 lower
purchase price. The Pensylvania State Police banned the use of FWD cars in
the eighties, because of their inherant poor handling on wet an ice roads,
that injured and killed some of the troopers
Now do us a favor and go back in your hole and do a bit of research before
you choose to comment again on a subject of which you obviously have little
or no knowledge LOL
"DeserTBoB" <des...@rglobal.net> wrote in message
news:nivdp31v83kpi1gn2...@4ax.com...
JoeSpareBedroom
He says some departments use FWD cars. You say many don't. He provided
nothing to back up his claim. You provided nothing to back up your claim,
either. Sounds like you're even, unless you can prove that NOBODY in law
enforcement uses FWD vehicles.
Mike hunt
that is what you believe ;)
"Jeff" <kidsd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:479738DE...@hotmail.com...
Mike hunt
"JoeSpareBedroom" <dishbo...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:IxMlj.2615$Sa1...@news02.roc.ny...
JoeSpareBedroom
Yeah. It means you said "go back in your hole" for no reason, except that
once again, you're drunk.
Mike hunt
again must resort to a personal attack LOL
"JoeSpareBedroom" <dishbo...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:nEMlj.2732$7d1...@news01.roc.ny...
JoeSpareBedroom
And your saying "go back in your hole" to the other guy was NOT a personal
attack?
My Name Is Nobody
Well, My Name Is NOBODY, and I DO NOT use Front Wheel Drive!
:-)
Bruce L. Bergman
wrote:
Yes, but L.A. has almost as bad traffic, and the idjits that try to
run still manage to find holes and head for daylight as fast as they
can. Occasionally, they even succeed in getting away, but when you
have all the media helicopters converging it's rare - someone will
have a lock on the perp.
They'll have a 10 MPH crawling pursuit for a few minutes, then the
crook will get off the freeway and turn around against the traffic and
open it up to 90 again - at least till the next batch of traffic...
So raw acceleration and a decent top end is still important.
--<< Bruce >>--
Jeff
The highway is open nearly 24 hrs a day, seven days a week. The highway
is quite open in the middle of night. During the day, not as much.
Ray O
<bente...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:aa589287-ec35-4ede...@j78g2000hsd.googlegroups.com...
Sales of Dodge Chargers to police forces will not be enough to keep Dodge
"afloat." They are going to have to do it the old fashioned way - by
selling to consumers.
bente...@gmail.com
>
> In NYC, they also have Highlander Hybrids as Taxicabs.
Hybrid Sienna... Hybrid Charger...
Whichever Mfgr that can make a 25mpg hybrid as capable as the current
crown vics is going to dominate that market.
Dodge is way behind on hybrids, Toyota and Honda are by far the most
advanced and numerous. Ford only has the escape, too small for a cab
and not scalable (they had to buy most of their technology from
Toyota, who is in no hurry to help them with anything bigger)
But I digress...
Ben
Jeff
Actually, the Escape hybrids are used as cabs in NYC.
> But I digress...
>
> Ben
uzistar
http://www.motorsforum.com/toyota/New-York-taxi-boss-shops-for-new-cabs-Crown-Vic-s-dominanc-150859-.htm
uzistar wrote:
C. E. White wrote: NYC TAXICAB OWNER DRIVER FOR THE PAST 36 YEARS IN NEW
YORK
CITY FROM MY EXPERIANCE THE BEST CAR NYC YELLOW TAXIS EVER USED WAS THE
FORD
CROWN VICTORIA NOW TAKE IT TO NEXT LEVEL NON BETTER THAN THE FORD CROWN
VICTORIA
BUILT IN ONTARIO PLANT CANADA FOR THIS HEAVY DUTY EASY TO UPKEEP BEST # 1
TAXICAB !!!
> New York taxi boss shops for new cabs
> Crown Vic's dominance in Big Apple may end
> Ryan Beene
> Automotive News
> January 18, 2008 - 4:23 pm ET
> DETROIT -- The Ford Crown Victoria sedan, which has been the workhorse
> of New York's taxicab fleet, could be history.
> The New York City Taxi and Limousine Commission is shopping for a new
> generation of cars to be phased in to its fleet of about 13,000 yellow
> cabs. Officials from New York's taxi commission were at the auto show
> this week to discuss their Taxi of Tomorrow project with major
> automakers.
> " We met with all of the major automobile manufacturers,"
> commission
> Chairman Matthew Daus told Automotive News. " We're taking this as
> an
> opportunity to ask manufacturers to custom-build the utopian cab for
> us."
> Daus said such a cab would be reasonably priced, fuel efficient,
> accessible for passengers with disabilities and distinctively styled.
> To help draft specifications for the cab project, the commission has
> contracted with the suburban Detroit operations of the U.K. automotive
> engineering and technology firm Ricardo PLC as a consultant.
> Specifications will be sent to every major automaker in about a month,
> Daus said. He declined to name specific companies.
> Taxi program
> The Crown Victoria has been the dominant cab in the New York fleet for
> years. While about 18 percent of the city-administered fleet is
> supplied by other automakers, Ford has a taxi program that alters
> Crown Victorias on request.
> " The difference between the Ford Crown Victoria and every other
> vehicle that's out there is that Ford is the only one that came up
> with a taxi package program, a commercial-vehicle initiative where
> they actually tailor the vehicle over the years to make it a better
> taxi," Daus said. " The other manufacturers have not
> authorized
> specifically a program to use these vehicles as taxis."
> In 2001, Ford lengthened Crown Victorias destined to be in the cab
> fleet by about 6 inches, upon request by the city of New York, Daus
> said.
> But rising fuel costs, environmental awareness, recently increased
> fuel economy standards for New York cabs and the inevitable demise of
> the Crown Victoria are pushing the issue.
> " The Crown Victoria is basically coming to an end," Daus
> said. "
> We're looking to make our environment cleaner and be more fuel
> efficient and save more money for drivers and the owners, so you could
> basically say that the Crown Victoria is going to be phased out."
> That could upset a lot of New York cab riders. A survey by CNW
> Marketing Research, of Bandon, Ore., found that 95 percent of
> respondents preferred the Crown Victoria over other New York cabs,
> such as the dozen Toyota Prius sedans the city has in its fleet.
> " The Crown Vic has been a spectacular fleet car," CNW analyst
> Art
> Spinella said in a phone interview with Automotive News. " It's
> perfect for what it does."
> Spinella said Ford would benefit if it continued to dominate the New
> York fleet, but that doesn't mean it will happen.
> Phone messages to Ford Motor were not returned today." If Ford were
> to
> stay doing nothing but Crown Vics for taxis and upgrading them to some
> degree, maybe fitting a more fuel-efficient V-6 instead of a V-8 in it
> or hybridizing it, they could probably hold on to 70 to 75 percent of
> that market," Spinella said. " But I'm not sure that they want
> to
> spend the money to do it."
> Big Apple is biggest
> New York is the largest purchaser of cabs, according to the Taxicab,
> Limousine &Paratransit Association, of Kensington, Md. Second is
> Chicago, where the dominant cab also is the Crown Victoria.
> New York has been testing other vehicles as it retires and replaces
> cabs every three to five years. The city's fleet includes hybrids,
> vans and SUVs from a number of automakers, but Daus said there isn't a
> vehicle now on the market that can solve the city's needs.
> Hybrids could be a viable fleet solution for New York, Spinella said,
> citing two nameplates: the Ford Escape Hybrid. and the Prius.
> The Escape Hybrid " may be Ford's ace in the hole," Spinella
> said,
> adding that if Ford could strip it down, the car could be sold at a
> cheaper price.
> While the Prius gets poor marks for lack of cargo space, Spinella said
> building something larger on the Prius frame could make it a viable
> cab.
> Said Spinella: " It might be in Toyota's best interest to turn the
> Prius into a London-taxi-type of vehicle. The Prius is sturdy enough
> to be transformed into that type of vehicle."
> By taking a chance on a relatively low-volume fleet, the rewards could
> be bigger than the initial risk, he said, adding: " If New York
> does
> it, you know Chicago and some other major Eastern cities are going to
> do the same thing."
-------------------------------------
NEW YORK CITY MEDDALLION TAXICAB BEST CARS ARE THE CROWN VICTORIA FROM A
36
YEARS VETERAN OF THE NYC YELLOW TAXICAB INDUSTRY OF NEW YORK CITY !!!
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cl...@snyder.on.ca
Ford is pushing the new Transit Van as a Taxicab.