Paint Job
NavySeal
Just a question from a guy tryin to budget for his future resto job, my
first actually
How much is it to get a first gen camaro painted, including the engine
compartment?
Just a q so i can figure how long i have to wait before i get it.
Thanks
NavySeal_01
Gear Head
<3675B9E8...@austintx.net>...
Anywhere from $500 to $5000. Seriously. But here's a tip: you get what
you pay for when it comes to paint and body work.
Justin
--
It's good to be king, if just for a while
To be there in velvet, yeah, to give 'em a smile
It's good to get high, and never come down
It's good to be king of your own little town --Tom Petty
XoDAMIANoX
>
>Just a question from a guy tryin to budget for his future resto job, my
>first actually
>
>How much is it to get a first gen camaro painted, including the engine
>compartment?
>Just a q so i can figure how long i have to wait before i get it.
>
>Thanks
Why dont you take the car down to Maaco or some kind of paint specialist and
ask them? You need to shop around for the best deal.
Paul Hubrich
>
> Hey guys,
>
> Just a question from a guy tryin to budget for his future resto job, my
> first actually
>
> How much is it to get a first gen camaro painted, including the engine
> compartment?
> Just a q so i can figure how long i have to wait before i get it.
>
> Thanks
>
Like someone else posted, it can range from $500 to $5000.
For $500 you can get somebody to scuff & shoot a quick coat of cheap
enamel, but you won't be happy with the results.
For $5000 you can get the car stripped to bare metal and completely
redone in a flawless base/clear finish, but then you'll be afraid to
drive it.
For about halfway in between you should be able to get a decent paint
job that might not win any shows, but will sure turn a lot of heads.
Of course, any major body work that's needed will push the price up
accordingly.
Good luck with your project - I sure love the looks of those first gen
camaros!!
Brent Franker
>Why dont you take the car down to Maaco or some kind of paint specialist
and
>ask them? You need to shop around for the best deal.
Well, that's not a good suggestion IMO. If I was trying to sell a $2000 car
and thought I could get $2500 out if it by slapping on a $189.99 paint job
THEN I'd take it to Maaco or a similar place. If that's not the case, then
those assembly line type paint shops won't get near any of my vehicles!
From what I've seen in paint and body work, you get what you pay for. It's
a lot different than shopping around for the cheapest blender :)
If I were doing a restoration project, I'd want to ask around town and find
out who does the best work or at least who does the best work for a
reasonable price. If you're going to sink time, money, and effort into a
restoration project, you want to get a paint job you'll be happy with.
Around here, I'd expect to pay about $2000 for a restoration project paint
job if the body doesn't need much work and you pull off most of the
moldings, etc. yourself. You could spend a lot more, but $2000 should get
you a reasonable paint job (probably more $$$ if you want to change colors).
See ya,
Brent
For mods & info
95 T/A - Stock http://www.citrus.infi.net/~bfranker
94 Z28 - Not Stock :-) 4th gen Appearance Modification Guide
http://www.fl-fbody.com/SIGs/appearance
Michael Sadlock
have a 68 Camaro and my buddy has a 67 Camaro. We both started with about
the same canvas. I chose to have mine plastic media blasted, he did not. I
chose a professional restorer to do the paint, he chose Maaco(he has a buddy
there that "does REAL good work"). It cost me about $6500 bead blasting,
replacing both quarters, body work and paint. His was $2500 to scuff, body
work and paint. He has now been back 6 times to have them 1) Put more paint
on the car where you could see through it, 2) repaint deck lid for poor
adhesion, 3) redo body work around quarters 4) repair rust bubbles in the
roof 5) Realign fenders 6) to raise hell. I have yet to have a problem. He
is now ready to start all over and do it right....The SECOND time. The old
saying is true Do it right the FIRST time...it may cost more now, but it
will cost less down the road.
Mike Sadlock
www.nashchevy.com
'Wulff wrote in message <36770e45...@news.edm.shaw.wave.ca>...
>On 15 Dec 1998 09:29:16 GMT, xodam...@aol.com (XoDAMIANoX) wrote:
>
>>>Hey guys,
>>>
>>>Just a question from a guy tryin to budget for his future resto job, my
>>>first actually
>>>
>>>How much is it to get a first gen camaro painted, including the engine
>>>compartment?
>>>Just a q so i can figure how long i have to wait before i get it.
>>>
>>>Thanks
>>
and
>>ask them? You need to shop around for the best deal.
>>
>>
>
>each other.
>There's a reason for the $299 paint jobs.....first,no bodywork,chips
>flixed etc.
>The cars are brought in,washed with water and a type of adhesion
>promoter (which is garbage IMHO).
>then masked up and sprayed with the closest color they have in their
>45 gallon drums (last time i checked they had 32 colors)
>total time ....about 2 hours.
>
>Hell, for a gallon of quality clearcoat my cost alone is probably over
>
>$200.00
>
>My usual quote for customers that want an immaculate paint job (done
>properly) starts at 4 grand and i'll call when I need more money ; )
>Seriously,as someone stated,you get what you pay for.
>If you need bodywork,rust repair etc. then it adds up.
>personally I rip my cars apart for painting so there's no masking
>lines but If you just want it shiny until you decide to sell it,then
>it'll save a bit.
>All depends what you want.
>
>
>'Wulff
>
>"Words from my 7 yr. old......."Dad? if God is so smart why
>does he make stupid people?"
>
>*replace "nospam" with "Shaw" to email.
'Wulff
Qwik1320
sentence!) I've helped several friends redo their Camaros as well as a few
myself and I'd say the average cost of a good quality paint job with some minor
body work is around $3000.
My advice to you is that while you are waiting and saving the cash do as much
of the disassembly and prep work as you can. Things like removing molding,
trim, lights, bumbers, etc. will only speed up the rate at which they will be
able to get to work.
I'd even suggest going to a few body shops and asking them for advice on what
to do. When I redid my 73 I found a great guy who gave me pointers on what
"shit" work I could do and what materials to use. I ended up stripping off all
the paint myself and covering with primer. Saved myself some $$$, learned
alot, and felt more a part of the restoration.
'Wulff
Hehe.....I've got a sign above my desk that says ;
Shop rates-$45\hr
If you watch-$55\hr
If you help-$65\hr
If you worked on it first $100\hr
<G>
In reality I kind of cringe when someone brings in a car that they
worked on "to save some cash".
For one thing I won't warranty the paint because even though my work
is done properly I've no idea if the prep was.
Disassembly is fine as long as you're confident that you can put it
back together without harming the fresh paint (there's nothing worse
for a painter than to put out a flawless paint job and have it come
back in a week to spot in scratches)
Stripping to bare metal is great but if you don't know what you're
doing then you can easily lose any savings.
Case in point ,You've just spent the better part of the day stripping
your car,it's all done except for the hood.you get excited that it's
so close to being finished that you neglect to let the areas cool down
properly,.....best case scenario- you only warp the hood a little,but
it'll probably cost a couple hundred to get it perfectly straight.
worst case - you heat up the urethane binders between the skin and the
braces and they seperate. usually a new hood would be cheaper than the
bodywork needed to make that one perfect.(say $300.)
So now you go through all that work and lose all you saved in a few
minutes.
Don't get me wrong,having a fantastic paint job on your car and being
able to say you did some of the work on it is a great feeling,just
make sure you research it properly so you don't end up causing more
costs than needed.
Find a good bodyshop first,(talk to car club members...they usually
know the best finesse painters)
Get them to MIL gauge your paint to find out how much work it's going
to take to remove it all.
Ask them how they'd do it
Ask about their warranty if you work on it.
Get the names of the products they suggest and price them out,unless
you can find a place that will sell you only the amounts that you need
you will have to buy the full product,which in most cases is a lot
more than you need.this alone can defeat the purpose of doing any work
yourself as the bodyshop gets their products cheaper and overflow
carries on to another job.
Most of all,if you end up doing some of the work,take your time,If it
gets tedious (and it probably will) don't invent shortcuts.
The end result will be all the more satisfying.( and hopefully
cheaper)
Got Balls?
<snip>
> Don't get me wrong,having a fantastic paint job on your car and being
> able to say you did some of the work on it is a great feeling,just
> make sure you research it properly so you don't end up causing more
> costs than needed.
You did leave something out, there is nothing better then having a
great looking car, and being able to say, I did all of that my self.
Every time I look at the IROC I just smile, the kind of smile that a
proud parent gets when they see their child.
************************************************************************
Got Balls?
bmk...@yahoo.com
One F-body painted up just right, the other getting ready.
'Wulff
wrote:
True......very true,I still get that feeling when I put out a nice
paint job,and I've probably painted well over a thousand.<G>
William Platt
do most of the work, you can get an awsome job done for under $1000.
Get on book on bodywork and do most of the prepwork yourself. A good
paint job is 80% prep. Take the car down to bare metal, use a metal
prepping solution to stabilize the metal(inhibit rust). get a couple
dozen cans of zinc-chromate primer and prime the car. It will be an
ugly green-yellow, but it will never rust. Then get a couple dozen
cans of regular grey primer and spray the car. sand it with 120grit
paper. Clean, re-prime, and resadnd with 200 grit. Clean, reprime,
resand with 280 grit. Continue this process up to 400 grit. On the
last primer coat wet sand with 400 or higher. A good quality paint
and a competant painter should give you an awsome finish. If body
work need be done, buy a book on bodywork. The straighter and
smoother the body is, the less you'll have to pay for the paint job.
On 15 Dec 1998 16:54:05 , Paul Hubrich wrote:
>NavySeal wrote:
>>
>> Hey guys,
>>
>> Just a question from a guy tryin to budget for his future resto job, my
>> first actually
>>
>> How much is it to get a first gen camaro painted, including the engine
>> compartment?
>> Just a q so i can figure how long i have to wait before i get it.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> NavySeal_01
>
>Like someone else posted, it can range from $500 to $5000.
>
>For $500 you can get somebody to scuff & shoot a quick coat of cheap
>enamel, but you won't be happy with the results.
>
>For $5000 you can get the car stripped to bare metal and completely
>redone in a flawless base/clear finish, but then you'll be afraid to
>drive it.
>
>For about halfway in between you should be able to get a decent paint
>job that might not win any shows, but will sure turn a lot of heads.
>
>Of course, any major body work that's needed will push the price up
>accordingly.
>
>Good luck with your project - I sure love the looks of those first gen
>camaros!!
>.
Got Balls?
>
> Assuming the body is in good shape, and that you have the ability to
> do most of the work, you can get an awsome job done for under $1000.
> Get on book on bodywork and do most of the prepwork yourself. A good
> paint job is 80% prep. Take the car down to bare metal, use a metal
> prepping solution to stabilize the metal(inhibit rust). get a couple
> dozen cans of zinc-chromate primer and prime the car. It will be an
> ugly green-yellow, but it will never rust. Then get a couple dozen
> cans of regular grey primer and spray the car. sand it with 120grit
> paper. Clean, re-prime, and resadnd with 200 grit. Clean, reprime,
> resand with 280 grit. Continue this process up to 400 grit. On the
> last primer coat wet sand with 400 or higher. A good quality paint
> and a competant painter should give you an awsome finish. If body
> work need be done, buy a book on bodywork. The straighter and
> smoother the body is, the less you'll have to pay for the paint job.
Really bad advice. First off, unless the car needs a lot of body work,
has oxidation under the paint, or has been painted more than 2 times, it
should not need striped. Even the best body man will leave the first
coat of paint on if it is in good shape. Not only does that save time
and money, but it helps prevent rust.
Second, considering most people cannot even follow the instructions on
a spray can, how do you expect a novice to get a smooth finish without
runs, drips, and the primer applied correctly.
Third thing is, a lot of spray can primers are not compatible with base
coat clear coat paint. You have to know what brand and type paint the
car will be painted with, to make sure you use the correct type of
primer.
Forth, most painters will not touch a car they did not prep. I sure as
hell never have, and never will. A bad prep job will make the best
paint job look like dog shit. The best prep can make the worst paint
job look decent. Most body people will not even risk the damage to
their reputation that they would receive if they painted a car that the
customer prepped, and it looked like shit.
Fifth, Never advise a novice to get a book and start doing body work.
There is a lot a novice can fuck up, that will cost thousands to fix
right. Any one who can do good body work has a lot of experience, and
has made a lot of fuck ups. It takes time to develop the skills needed
to tell what is right and what is wrong, and who exactly things should
be done.
I do not discourage people from doing body work, but at the same time I
am not going to tell a novice to patch rust holes, or pull dents.
I even have started to teach a novice how to do body work, and know it
will take him years of practice to get the skills to do half of what I
can.
************************************************************************
Got Balls?
bmk...@yahoo.com
You can always learn on your own, but having someone to show you how to
do stuff will always teach you more.
CLASSICA
>
> Assuming the body is in good shape, and that you have the ability to
> do most of the work, you can get an awsome job done for under $1000.
> Get on book on bodywork and do most of the prepwork yourself. A good
> paint job is 80% prep. Take the car down to bare metal, use a metal
> prepping solution to stabilize the metal(inhibit rust). get a couple
> dozen cans of zinc-chromate primer and prime the car. It will be an
> ugly green-yellow, but it will never rust. Then get a couple dozen
> cans of regular grey primer and spray the car. sand it with 120grit
> paper. Clean, re-prime, and resadnd with 200 grit. Clean, reprime,
> resand with 280 grit. Continue this process up to 400 grit. On the
> last primer coat wet sand with 400 or higher. A good quality paint
> and a competant painter should give you an awsome finish. If body
> work need be done, buy a book on bodywork. The straighter and
> smoother the body is, the less you'll have to pay for the paint job.
>
> >NavySeal wrote:
> >>
> >> Hey guys,
> >>
> >> Just a question from a guy tryin to budget for his future resto job, my
> >> first actually
> >>
> >> How much is it to get a first gen camaro painted, including the engine
> >> compartment?
> >> Just a q so i can figure how long i have to wait before i get it.
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >> NavySeal_01
> >
> >Like someone else posted, it can range from $500 to $5000.
> >
> >For $500 you can get somebody to scuff & shoot a quick coat of cheap
> >enamel, but you won't be happy with the results.
> >
> >For $5000 you can get the car stripped to bare metal and completely
> >redone in a flawless base/clear finish, but then you'll be afraid to
> >drive it.
> >
> >For about halfway in between you should be able to get a decent paint
> >job that might not win any shows, but will sure turn a lot of heads.
> >
> >Of course, any major body work that's needed will push the price up
> >accordingly.
> >
> >Good luck with your project - I sure love the looks of those first gen
> >camaros!!
> >.
this car . Now if you want to do the work then sit down and talk to the
people you are having do the paint work as many paints are no longer
compatible and this will cause a problem ie: Glasurit say DO NOT USE
nay metal etchant before priming.
You also would not get a warranty due to the fact that prep is your
paint job and if a problem were to occure it would more than likly be a
substrate problem , primer ,filler . Yes you can save money if you work
WITH your paint people or you may not get what you expect. The last one
some one talked us in to doing after a nother shop had done the body
work and prime, we ended up almost completly having to strip all the
body work down repair rust they had filled with bondo and quarter
pannels that had more waves than the Cal. coast and of couse he wanted
it BLACK so by the time he was out his bill doubled .
Mike Shambarger
CLASSIC AUTO WORKS
SEMA/SRMA
Grintloc
>some one talked us in to doing after a nother shop had done the body
>work and prime, we ended up almost completly having to strip all the
>body work down repair rust they had filled with bondo and quarter
>pannels that had more waves than the Cal. coast and of couse he wanted
>it BLACK so by the time he was out his bill doubled .
>Mike Shambarger
>CLASSIC AUTO WORKS
>SEMA/SRMA
>
>
>
>
>
>
I have a question. Since Bondo is looked down upon so much (and rightly so,
IMO), what do the pros use to fill pits and such when needed?
Grintlocamanoliomastermanhestheonewiththemasterplan
'84 TA !exhaust, !center caps
Gear Head
<19981220032628...@ng100.aol.com>...
> >The last one
> >some one talked us in to doing after a nother shop had done the body
> >work and prime, we ended up almost completly having to strip all the
> >body work down repair rust they had filled with bondo and quarter
> >pannels that had more waves than the Cal. coast and of couse he wanted
> >it BLACK so by the time he was out his bill doubled .
> >Mike Shambarger
> >CLASSIC AUTO WORKS
> >SEMA/SRMA
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> I have a question. Since Bondo is looked down upon so much (and rightly
so,
> IMO), what do the pros use to fill pits and such when needed?
In a paint job where absolutely no filler is used (very rare), they use
lead to fill imperfections in the metal. In primer, small imperfections
are filled with primer. Simple as that. Lots of coats of primer and good
block sanding will eventually fill anything, within reason.
Justin
--
Well, I don't know, but I've been told,
You never slow down, you never grow old.
I'm tired of screwin' up, tired of going down,
Tired of myself, tired of this town.
Oh, my, my. Oh, hell, yes.
Honey, put on that party dress.
Buy me a drink, sing me a song.
Take me as I come 'cause I can't stay long. --Tom Petty
Gear Head
<367C31...@yahoo.com>...
> William Platt wrote:
> >
> > Assuming the body is in good shape, and that you have the ability to
> > do most of the work, you can get an awsome job done for under $1000.
> > Get on book on bodywork and do most of the prepwork yourself. A good
> > paint job is 80% prep. Take the car down to bare metal, use a metal
> > prepping solution to stabilize the metal(inhibit rust). get a couple
> > dozen cans of zinc-chromate primer and prime the car. It will be an
> > ugly green-yellow, but it will never rust. Then get a couple dozen
> > cans of regular grey primer and spray the car. sand it with 120grit
> > paper. Clean, re-prime, and resadnd with 200 grit. Clean, reprime,
> > resand with 280 grit. Continue this process up to 400 grit. On the
> > last primer coat wet sand with 400 or higher. A good quality paint
> > and a competant painter should give you an awsome finish. If body
> > work need be done, buy a book on bodywork. The straighter and
> > smoother the body is, the less you'll have to pay for the paint job.
>
> has oxidation under the paint, or has been painted more than 2 times, it
> should not need striped. Even the best body man will leave the first
> coat of paint on if it is in good shape. Not only does that save time
> and money, but it helps prevent rust.
>
> Second, considering most people cannot even follow the instructions on
> a spray can, how do you expect a novice to get a smooth finish without
> runs, drips, and the primer applied correctly.
>
> Third thing is, a lot of spray can primers are not compatible with base
> coat clear coat paint. You have to know what brand and type paint the
> car will be painted with, to make sure you use the correct type of
> primer.
Not to mention the downright fucked up coat of primer you'll get from a
spray can. Jeez, who would even CONSIDER spray can primer???
> Forth, most painters will not touch a car they did not prep. I sure as
> hell never have, and never will. A bad prep job will make the best
> paint job look like dog shit. The best prep can make the worst paint
> job look decent. Most body people will not even risk the damage to
> their reputation that they would receive if they painted a car that the
> customer prepped, and it looked like shit.
I got a story for you. I occasionally work for a guy that restores
classic trucks. I was there the other day, and saw a truck in the parking
lot, with a nice paint job. Smooth, glass-like finish, no orange peel or
runs. I thought his body man painted it, he does good work. But I almost
shit when I found out who DID paint it: One Day Paint and Body. Yep. The
customer blocked and prepped it, and took it to One Day to have them paint
it. They used PPG's dbu Base/clear, which is really good paint. They
charged him $150, including paint. I couldn't believe how nice the finish
was. No color sanding, nothing. Came out of the gun like glass. Makes
sense, I guess, considering they paint 20 cars a day.
>
> Fifth, Never advise a novice to get a book and start doing body work.
> There is a lot a novice can fuck up, that will cost thousands to fix
> right. Any one who can do good body work has a lot of experience, and
> has made a lot of fuck ups. It takes time to develop the skills needed
> to tell what is right and what is wrong, and who exactly things should
> be done.
>
> I do not discourage people from doing body work, but at the same time I
> am not going to tell a novice to patch rust holes, or pull dents.
> I even have started to teach a novice how to do body work, and know it
> will take him years of practice to get the skills to do half of what I
> can.
You shoulda seen this buddy of mine trying to rivet a patch in his front
fender of his truck. Right on the surface, of all things. Some things are
left up to the people who've got their shit together. Took me about 5
years to get good at paint and body work. Of course, I was 14 when I
started :)
Carrell Hinton
> I have a question. Since Bondo is looked down upon so much (and rightly so,
> IMO), what do the pros use to fill pits and such when needed?
>
> Grintlocamanoliomastermanhestheonewiththemasterplan
> '84 TA !exhaust, !center caps
For most cars, there will always be areas that need some filler. Bondo, or other
brands of filler material, is fine if the bodywork under it is good. The problem
seems to be the thickness of the filler and the way it is applied and finished.
Regards,
Carrell
Paul Hubrich
>
> I got a story for you. I occasionally work for a guy that restores
> classic trucks. I was there the other day, and saw a truck in the parking
> lot, with a nice paint job. Smooth, glass-like finish, no orange peel or
> runs. I thought his body man painted it, he does good work. But I almost
> shit when I found out who DID paint it: One Day Paint and Body. Yep. The
> customer blocked and prepped it, and took it to One Day to have them paint
> it. They used PPG's dbu Base/clear, which is really good paint. They
> charged him $150, including paint. I couldn't believe how nice the finish
> was. No color sanding, nothing. Came out of the gun like glass. Makes
> sense, I guess, considering they paint 20 cars a day.
>
Last time I priced DBU base/clear, it would cost about double that
amount just for the materials (depending on color). I know the high
volume shops can getter a better price than I can, but not that much
better.
'Wulff
>I have a question. Since Bondo is looked down upon so much (and rightly so,
>IMO), what do the pros use to fill pits and such when needed?
>
>
>Grintlocamanoliomastermanhestheonewiththemasterplan
>'84 TA !exhaust, !center caps
Most suppliers have 2 part putties out,( Personally I like Wurth's)
These are less porous than bondo and a lot easier to sand.
They're also more brittle so they shouldn't be used for large dents
etc.
Gary - KJ6Q
While restoring my '70 Cad convertible, I needed some minor door dings
fixed, and some emblems removed and holes filled. I got an estimate from
the local MAACO outfit for all the work, and then went to a local
bodyshop to see if they might do a better job on the body work portion
of the job. They recommended against splitting up the job, because they
said if there was any problem with the final paint job, MAACO would
claim no responsibility due to pre-existing "defects" that were not
their fault or responsibility... Good advice, as it turned out!
Whem I got the Cad from MAACO, they had missed minor, but noticeable,
dings in 2 of the quarter panels, there were serious paint runs, and
within several days, minor paint bubbling began... I took the car back,
naturally, and without protest, they COMPLETELY re-did the job and
corrected all problems. The second time through, they did a fantastic
job, and after a year the car still looks perfect. Thank God I didn't
screw the job up with some of my own foolishness.
The total job cost $1400, about half was body work.
Gary - KJ6Q
'Wulff
Platt) wrote:
>Assuming the body is in good shape, and that you have the ability to
>do most of the work, you can get an awsome job done for under $1000.
>Get on book on bodywork and do most of the prepwork yourself. A good
>paint job is 80% prep. Take the car down to bare metal, use a metal
>prepping solution to stabilize the metal(inhibit rust). get a couple
>dozen cans of zinc-chromate primer and prime the car. It will be an
>ugly green-yellow, but it will never rust. Then get a couple dozen
>cans of regular grey primer and spray the car. sand it with 120grit
>paper. Clean, re-prime, and resadnd with 200 grit. Clean, reprime,
>resand with 280 grit. Continue this process up to 400 grit. On the
>last primer coat wet sand with 400 or higher. A good quality paint
>and a competant painter should give you an awsome finish. If body
>work need be done, buy a book on bodywork. The straighter and
>smoother the body is, the less you'll have to pay for the paint job.
Got to totally disagree here,....first off,finding a book that has up
to date info isn't that easy , even the actual trade books in school
are fairly archaic.
Secondly, "a couple dozen cans" of a good quality zinc chromate primer
will run close to double (or more) of the price of a quart(unmixed)
and activator. it's usually mixed 1-1 so 2 quarts sprayable would be
more than enough for a complete.
also the "never rust" statement is incorrect, the only thing that
stops rust(even minor pinhole rust) is a 2" cold cut replaced with new
metal.
There are products that change the chemical composition of rust to a
inert carbon but the chances of getting every affected molecule are
slim and none.
As for stripping the car,totally depends on the condition of the old
paint,(as GB points out).
"A couple dozen cans" of regular primer ,again will cost more in the
spray bombs than in a package stock,plus being an aerosol,the
thickness that can be applied (without runs) is pretty much useless if
you've stripped your car with ,say even 100 grit.
Body work thats been done decently can be covered with one medium coat
of Z/C and 2 or 3 coats of a quality High solids primer without
resorting to the sand\re-prime scenario.
Applying a guide coat to the primer and then sanding with nothing less
than 280 to start will get rid of most of the minor bumps etc.....then
finishing with a 600 wet on the same coat will still give good reults
for painting.
Personally i prefer re-clearing after painting just to add to
smoothness and depth but then that may be just me.
Just to add,most people who do this for a living can look at a wet,
primed,panel and tell whether or not it's perfectly straight,They
simply can't teach that in a book.
BTW ....GB....What products have you been using?just curious.
'Wulff
Got Balls?
> > Third thing is, a lot of spray can primers are not compatible with base
> > coat clear coat paint. You have to know what brand and type paint the
> > car will be painted with, to make sure you use the correct type of
> > primer.
>
> Not to mention the downright fucked up coat of primer you'll get from a
> spray can. Jeez, who would even CONSIDER spray can primer???
It does have its uses. For one, I use it when trying to make sure I
have an area free of high and low spots. I fog the area with the spray
primer, then sand it, and find the high and low spots. Lets say the
color primer IM using is a light green, light pink, light blue, off
white, or gray. For that I would use a black spray can primer, as it
would show up well. For darker primers, I would use a can of off white
primer.
Also, in the hand of someone who knows how to use a spray can, spray
can primer is good for priming small areas that need it. Lets say I
just welded a new dog leg in to a fender, and that is the only area I
need to primer. I could use a good sandable primer that would work with
the paint I was using, and do the small area. After a few coats, and
some sanding I could apply a bit more. After that I could prep the area
for paint. I have done repairs like that, blended the paint just right,
and not been able to tell that the area was ever damaged. Most good
paint makers do make spray can primer just for this reason. Who wants
to dirty the paint cup, and clean the spray gun for a small area repair?
Not to mention, that some things are not needed in large batches, and
keep well in spray cans. Stuff like under coating for example. I
usually buy it in spray cans, and only apply it where needed.
> > Forth, most painters will not touch a car they did not prep. I sure as
> > hell never have, and never will. A bad prep job will make the best
> > paint job look like dog shit. The best prep can make the worst paint
> > job look decent. Most body people will not even risk the damage to
> > their reputation that they would receive if they painted a car that the
> > customer prepped, and it looked like shit.
>
> I got a story for you. I occasionally work for a guy that restores
> classic trucks. I was there the other day, and saw a truck in the parking
> lot, with a nice paint job. Smooth, glass-like finish, no orange peel or
> runs. I thought his body man painted it, he does good work. But I almost
> shit when I found out who DID paint it: One Day Paint and Body. Yep. The
> customer blocked and prepped it, and took it to One Day to have them paint
> it. They used PPG's dbu Base/clear, which is really good paint. They
> charged him $150, including paint. I couldn't believe how nice the finish
> was. No color sanding, nothing. Came out of the gun like glass. Makes
> sense, I guess, considering they paint 20 cars a day.
That price sounds way to low, but the story is one I can believe.
About 15 years ago, I painted a Corvette for a friend of mine. He knows
how to prep cars, and that car is one of the few I ever painted that I
did not prep. The car turned out great, and my friend told every one
who painted it. I regret doing it now, because for years people would
hound me about painting cars for them!
> >
> > Fifth, Never advise a novice to get a book and start doing body work.
> > There is a lot a novice can fuck up, that will cost thousands to fix
> > right. Any one who can do good body work has a lot of experience, and
> > has made a lot of fuck ups. It takes time to develop the skills needed
> > to tell what is right and what is wrong, and who exactly things should
> > be done.
> >
> > I do not discourage people from doing body work, but at the same time I
> > am not going to tell a novice to patch rust holes, or pull dents.
> > I even have started to teach a novice how to do body work, and know it
> > will take him years of practice to get the skills to do half of what I
> > can.
>
> You shoulda seen this buddy of mine trying to rivet a patch in his front
> fender of his truck. Right on the surface, of all things. Some things are
> left up to the people who've got their shit together. Took me about 5
> years to get good at paint and body work. Of course, I was 14 when I
> started :)
>
I have seen worse stuff then that. One of the guys at work has a 74
Fire Bird, and it looks horrible. He tried to repair rust with body
filler! Then he premiered over it! Last time he drove it to work,
people laughed at the thing when around 2 pounds of body filler fell off
when he slammed the door! I might offer to fix it correctly for him.
************************************************************************
Got Balls?
bmk...@yahoo.com
Good body work is an Art, it takes a lot of practice to get it right.
Got Balls?
>
> >The last one
> >some one talked us in to doing after a nother shop had done the body
> >work and prime, we ended up almost completly having to strip all the
> >body work down repair rust they had filled with bondo and quarter
> >pannels that had more waves than the Cal. coast and of couse he wanted
> >it BLACK so by the time he was out his bill doubled .
> >Mike Shambarger
> >CLASSIC AUTO WORKS
> >SEMA/SRMA
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> IMO), what do the pros use to fill pits and such when needed?
>
> Grintlocamanoliomastermanhestheonewiththemasterplan
> '84 TA !exhaust, !center caps
A lot of body people use body filler. Doing a job without it, would
require a lot more work. But the thing that most lay people miss is
there is more than one type of body filler. The oldest, hardest to use,
and least paint friendly, is Lead. Doing lead takes a lot of skill, and
work. And lead has a tendency to bleed thru the newer types of paint.
Then you have the more common Plastic Body Fillers. Bondo is known for
its plastic body filler, which is sold just about every where. While a
lot of people frown on Bondo, it is OK. I personally like PPG's plastic
body fillers, but in a pinch, Bondo will do. (Like its 1 in the
morning, and I want to get the car prepped before dawn, and the only
place open in Wal-Mart.)
Bondo also makes a fiber glass filler, as do some other. I do not care
to use it unless I am working on fiber glass.
There are also putty type fillers, and tar type fillers (that go
between panels).
And even as I type this, I can rest assured that someone, some where in
some lab is working on a new type of filler. So to answer your
question, most body people use fillers, just not in the way or brand
that you hear the most about.
************************************************************************
Got Balls?
bmk...@yahoo.com
Bondo is great for dry wall repairs.
Got Balls?
<snip>
'Wulff:
I mostly use PPG's paint, fillers, primers, reducers, hardeners, and
the like. I also use some things by Under Car Specialties, as well as
3M. Actually 3M makes one of my favorite sanding products, Scotch
Brite!
I get all of my sanding products whole sale from a Company in
Brookville, OH, called Needmore Abrasives. They get all the sand paper
in huge rolls, and make the final products, then box them and send them
off to other companies to market as there own. I only even know of them
because I did some machine work for them about 9 years ago.
For stuff I do not use often, (and remember I don't do much body work
any more), I just get recommendation from the people at the supply shop.
So 'Wulff, what products do you use?
************************************************************************
Got Balls?
bmk...@yahoo.com
Just a Red Neck with a spray booth in my barn.
CLASSICA
>
> >The last one
> >some one talked us in to doing after a nother shop had done the body
> >work and prime, we ended up almost completly having to strip all the
> >body work down repair rust they had filled with bondo and quarter
> >pannels that had more waves than the Cal. coast and of couse he wanted
> >it BLACK so by the time he was out his bill doubled .
> >Mike Shambarger
> >CLASSIC AUTO WORKS
> >SEMA/SRMA
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> I have a question. Since Bondo is looked down upon so much (and rightly so,
> IMO), what do the pros use to fill pits and such when needed?
>
> Grintlocamanoliomastermanhestheonewiththemasterplan
> '84 TA !exhaust, !center caps
abuse in that the better body work thats done the less bondo you use.
For those lacking the skills of metal work use bondo as a crutch . Also
better than half of the work I see using bondo is incorrect and will
eventuly fail , ie: using drilled holes to pull out pannel and NOT
WELDING THEM UP thinking this will give better grip to the bondo and it
will . It will also wick moisture inbetween the pannel and bondo and
rust causing the bondo to fall off the car or rust thru the pannel ( and
never hurt the paint.
CLASSICA
> quite a bit When I worked at a BMW repair place,(their colors come
> package stock from factory).
> I've used pretty much all the main paints but I find for complete
> paint jobs Standox high solid clear is the best with DuPont clear a
> close second.
> DP is great for spot jobs as well as what I call "creative blending"
> I use it in my airbrush for those pissant little marks you get,with
> their blending solvent you can pretty much make it unnoticeable.
> For sandpaper i usually use Carbo or 3M,(whichever salesman takes me
> golfing the most before I order<G> )
> Scotchbrite is a mainstay of course,Wurth putty and Bondo (which I
> rarely use anymore).
> Actually I was just curious about whether or not the US was getting as
> anal as Canucklehead land in regards to VOC regulations.
> All of our paint suppliers are making major product changes to comply
> for emissions etc.
>
> Ciao
> Cogito cogito,ergo cogito sum.
>
> 'Wulff
Wulff just have to disagree on clears the European paints have a much
deeper clear and brighter colors . We did a Cobra a while back for a guy
who was always competing with a friend what ever one had the other got .
So when he gets the same Cobra as his buddy he wanted it the same
colors. His freinds car was shot with PPG we only shoot Glasurit there
was NO comparison for depth of color or luster when these car were side
by side.
CLASSICA
>
> I have a 69 in the paint shop right now. car is straight, rust free.
> They have removed the doors, hood and trunk lid, pulling all
> weatherstripping, etc.
>
> They pulled the front and rear inner side panels to access all
> exterior chrome, handles and emblems.
>
> Front and rear glass is out, all lights, bumpers, emblems, chrome, etc
> are off.
>
> Car had orig paint so we didn't strip it. Sanded thoroughly, cleaned
> front and rear window channels, (no rust!) primed, guide coated and
> blocked the car twice.
>
> Getting base/clear and complete re-assembly including glass,
> weatherstrip, etc.
>
> I brought a lot of parts home to clean, polish, etc. myself. That's
> the only work I've done myself.
>
> Cost is just under 3000.
>
> Cliff
>
> 69 loaded 350/350 base Camaro coupe, 53,000, survivor. blue/blk wht
> houndstooth
> 69 loaded 350/350 RS Camaro red/red black vinyl top. Comfortweave.
> Restored from matching, unmolested 98,000 black plate car.
> 77 base coupe, bought for its new HO 350 engine.
> 95 Z/28 convert, red, 6spd
> 83 GT 5.0 HO 5spd red low mile survivor Mustang. (Horrors!!)
> 96 Jimmy 4X4 - well, I have a great wife and we do buy groceries J
> Don’t laugh, they’re paid for.
Well count your self lucky and I hope you are satisfied with the end
results. Don't know what part of the contry your in but must have one
low labor rate because thats how we do every car/truck and I know how
many man hours it takes for complete diassembly and reassembly.
Gear Head
<75jd6f$8...@newsops.execpc.com>...
> Gear Head wrote:
> >
>
> > I got a story for you. I occasionally work for a guy that
restores
> > classic trucks. I was there the other day, and saw a truck in the
parking
> > lot, with a nice paint job. Smooth, glass-like finish, no orange peel
or
> > runs. I thought his body man painted it, he does good work. But I
almost
> > shit when I found out who DID paint it: One Day Paint and Body. Yep.
The
> > customer blocked and prepped it, and took it to One Day to have them
paint
> > it. They used PPG's dbu Base/clear, which is really good paint. They
> > charged him $150, including paint. I couldn't believe how nice the
finish
> > was. No color sanding, nothing. Came out of the gun like glass.
Makes
> > sense, I guess, considering they paint 20 cars a day.
> >
>
> amount just for the materials (depending on color). I know the high
> volume shops can getter a better price than I can, but not that much
> better.
Exactly. They get about a 40% discount from retail price. They don't
usually use DBU, but you can request it. It usually costs more, but you
can ask for it. In this case, they must have forgot to charge him extra
for it.
Gear Head
> Gear Head wrote:
> >
> > Got Balls? <bmk...@yahoo.com> wrote in article
> <snip>
> > > Third thing is, a lot of spray can primers are not compatible
with base
> > > coat clear coat paint. You have to know what brand and type paint
the
> > > car will be painted with, to make sure you use the correct type of
> > > primer.
> >
> > Not to mention the downright fucked up coat of primer you'll
get from a
> > spray can. Jeez, who would even CONSIDER spray can primer???
>
> It does have its uses. For one, I use it when trying to make sure I
> have an area free of high and low spots. I fog the area with the spray
> primer, then sand it, and find the high and low spots. Lets say the
> color primer IM using is a light green, light pink, light blue, off
> white, or gray. For that I would use a black spray can primer, as it
> would show up well. For darker primers, I would use a can of off white
> primer.
It's called a "spotting dye" by a lot of paint guys. I use it for that,
as well. Works excellent. Sand the panel, apply extra primer (with the
GUN) to the spots with dark primer.
> Also, in the hand of someone who knows how to use a spray can, spray
> can primer is good for priming small areas that need it. Lets say I
> just welded a new dog leg in to a fender, and that is the only area I
> need to primer. I could use a good sandable primer that would work with
> the paint I was using, and do the small area. After a few coats, and
> some sanding I could apply a bit more. After that I could prep the area
> for paint. I have done repairs like that, blended the paint just right,
> and not been able to tell that the area was ever damaged. Most good
> paint makers do make spray can primer just for this reason. Who wants
> to dirty the paint cup, and clean the spray gun for a small area repair?
You're splitting hairs, Balls. I meant for the whole car, of course. I'm
guilty of using spray can primer for small spot repairs as well.
> Not to mention, that some things are not needed in large batches, and
> keep well in spray cans. Stuff like under coating for example. I
> usually buy it in spray cans, and only apply it where needed.
I don't use undercoating.
The price IS way too low.
> About 15 years ago, I painted a Corvette for a friend of mine. He knows
> how to prep cars, and that car is one of the few I ever painted that I
> did not prep. The car turned out great, and my friend told every one
> who painted it. I regret doing it now, because for years people would
> hound me about painting cars for them!
Everytime people ask me who painted my El Camino, and I answer that I did,
they don't believe me. Who would belive some 20 year old surfer punk has
the skills to produce a dead-nuts straight show quality paint job?? But
when they're convinced, they all want me to paint something. I've painted
a lot of cars because of that, and made some decent money, to boot.
Too much work. Just tell him to use a little more hardener in his bondo
next time ;o)
'Wulff
Got Balls?
First off, I am not a professional body man. I have worked in body
shops, and fame shops. In body shops I started off as the shop boy, and
worked my way up to an Estimator. Then went on to other body shops at
that level.
Second, I basically only do body work for my self, on a limited basis.
This means that the EPA does not pay attention to what I do. It also
means, I do not have to keep up with the current regulations.
With that said, I can say they are getting a lot stricter, and in
California they are real strict. But the specifics of which I cannot
say, as I am no longer in that trade.
Disclaimer: Before any one blasts me for not keeping the air clean, my
spray booth is triple filtered. Which unless I am wrong, meets or
exceeds the current Ohio EPA rules. I use one of the newer gravity feed
spray guns, and the newer environment friendly PPG paints.
************************************************************************
Got Balls?
bmk...@yahoo.com
Got Balls?
> deeper clear and brighter colors . We did a Cobra a while back for a guy
> who was always competing with a friend what ever one had the other got .
> So when he gets the same Cobra as his buddy he wanted it the same
> colors. His freinds car was shot with PPG we only shoot Glasurit there
> was NO comparison for depth of color or luster when these car were side
> by side.
> CLASSIC AUTO WORKS
> SEMA/SRMA
Mike:
It seams to me that every painter has a paint of preference. Mine is
PPG, which I always have good luck with. I also like some of the House
of Kolor paints, but lacquer is a bitch to blend if you have to respray
an area.
************************************************************************
Got Balls?
bmk...@yahoo.com
Got Balls?
> as well. Works excellent. Sand the panel, apply extra primer (with the
> GUN) to the spots with dark primer.
You use a spray gun to do it, I use a spray can. Same result.
> > Also, in the hand of someone who knows how to use a spray can, spray
> > can primer is good for priming small areas that need it. Lets say I
> > just welded a new dog leg in to a fender, and that is the only area I
> > need to primer. I could use a good sandable primer that would work with
> > the paint I was using, and do the small area. After a few coats, and
> > some sanding I could apply a bit more. After that I could prep the area
> > for paint. I have done repairs like that, blended the paint just right,
> > and not been able to tell that the area was ever damaged. Most good
> > paint makers do make spray can primer just for this reason. Who wants
> > to dirty the paint cup, and clean the spray gun for a small area repair?
>
> You're splitting hairs, Balls. I meant for the whole car, of course. I'm
> guilty of using spray can primer for small spot repairs as well.
Splitting hairs, who me? He he he.
> > Not to mention, that some things are not needed in large batches, and
> > keep well in spray cans. Stuff like under coating for example. I
> > usually buy it in spray cans, and only apply it where needed.
>
> I don't use undercoating.
I do. In Ohio it can save one from rust, or as much rust. Not only
does it get nice and humid here, but in the winter they salt the roads.
If I lived in the South on the coast, I would under coat cars there.
<snip>
> Everytime people ask me who painted my El Camino, and I answer that I did,
> they don't believe me. Who would belive some 20 year old surfer punk has
> the skills to produce a dead-nuts straight show quality paint job?? But
> when they're convinced, they all want me to paint something. I've painted
> a lot of cars because of that, and made some decent money, to boot.
I can understand. I started painting car years ago. And have a bad
habit of staying with women that drive cars that are painted colors that
I really like, so I go out and paint one of my cars to match. Like when
I did the IROC, I did not tell the GF that I was going to paint the car
the same Twilight Blue Metallic as her 98 Century. You should have seen
the look on her face when I pulled up in the IROC! She about died!
She even pulled the IROC up next to her Century and could not see any
difference in the color. Which was exactly what I was going for. She
never thought an old Red Neck like me could do work like that.:)
'Wulff
>Wulff just have to disagree on clears the European paints have a much
>deeper clear and brighter colors .
I'm not sure I understand,You disagree with me on clears yet I said
that I really liked Standox.......I thought that was a European
formulation.
Even DuPonts newer hibuild clear has a lot more depth than the old 3
coat system which surprised me when I first used it.
As for the colors,I never really got to see a wide range since the
only cars I was doing were BMW's and Mercedes,but I did find out that
PPG,Glassurit,Standox and Sikkens all supplied package stock for these
cars.
I never really could see a major difference in clarity when any of
these products were used with the Standox or DuPont hibuild.
I worked at a shop about 8 years ago that specialized in total resto's
and show cars,we started with CIL\ICI but dumped it quick because of
their yellowing clear and solvent popping hibuild,we then went to
Sikkens but hated the weak clear and the screwy mettalics.
Then it was Glassurit and DuPont,For me , DuPont was a better all
around product as I was able to figure out a whole whack of tricks
with it (the reps still shake their heads when they see me<G>)
I just found that Glassurit had a great finish but was less forgiving.
Hehe.....try spraying a full size winnibago in tricoat in a standard
size crossflow in Glas.one ladder,no scaffold.
I think the main thing is we get comfortable with one type of paint
and then get kind of stuck to it, I haven't tried the newest version
of Glas, as well as you may not have tried DuPont's new Chromapremier
system.
Chances are if You and I could paint 4 cars exactly the same way each
using both products I doubt the finishes would be noticeably
different.
Then again I always keep an open mind : )
We did a Cobra a while back for a guy
>who was always competing with a friend what ever one had the other got .
>So when he gets the same Cobra as his buddy he wanted it the same
>colors. His freinds car was shot with PPG we only shoot Glasurit there
>was NO comparison for depth of color or luster when these car were side
>by side.
>Mike Shambarger
>CLASSIC AUTO WORKS
>SEMA/SRMA
For reasons I can't recall,I never liked PPG.
Reminds me of post-lead Sherwin williams.
Ciao....
Gear Head
for that,
> > as well. Works excellent. Sand the panel, apply extra primer (with
the
> > GUN) to the spots with dark primer.
>
Suuuurrrrrrre... I belive you ;)
> > I don't use undercoating.
>
> I do. In Ohio it can save one from rust, or as much rust. Not only
> does it get nice and humid here, but in the winter they salt the roads.
> If I lived in the South on the coast, I would under coat cars there.
I scrape off all that rotten undercoating that traps dirt, salt, and then
rust. Then paint the underside with a good epoxy primer then good paint.
It's clean, doesn't trap dirt, and won't rust.
> I can understand. I started painting car years ago. And have a bad
> habit of staying with women that drive cars that are painted colors that
> I really like, so I go out and paint one of my cars to match. Like when
> I did the IROC, I did not tell the GF that I was going to paint the car
> the same Twilight Blue Metallic as her 98 Century. You should have seen
> the look on her face when I pulled up in the IROC! She about died!
> She even pulled the IROC up next to her Century and could not see any
> difference in the color. Which was exactly what I was going for. She
> never thought an old Red Neck like me could do work like that.:)
Then you get a new GF and have to repaint the car. Vicious circle :)
Bigjfig
a) you get what you pay for in almost all cases. that's not just cars, it's
just about anything. Yes, someone out there will say, "but i got my such and
such painted for 1000 bucks". Long and short is, those guys are rare, if you
make out, great, but i'll bet the vast majority of us would get screwed by the
low price guys, and those that "can make it mint real cheap". Undoubtedly
corners will be cut.
b) as far as "helping" out, i have done this, but only after checking with the
body guy first and what should be removed and what is best to leave to them.
again, the key is "communication". some guys don't mind that you are involved,
others want you to pay and that's it. depends on the shop, and in my belief the
skill level of the owner.
c) there have been articles on how to choose a good restoration shop and body
shop, i think these are worth reading or at least brushing up on for almost
everyone that looks to get work done. It's like your doctor or dentist, you go
to who you trust and feel will do a good job, and when they retire from the
business, you're at a loss because you've been going there so many years...
d) The key in using bondo (and i'm by no means an expert) would be to minimize
its use, as mike pointed out. I can recall someone at GM telling me that even
they use bondo to fill seams and gaps at the factory. I'm sure this is true,
years ago lead was probably used, but now it's illegal to use it. I looked at
a 1979 trans am recently where the driver's door had some obvious repair work
to it, and it was probably just poor metal work underneath, because the magnet
didn't stick to the panel. Had the work been of the thinner variety, well,
i'll bet it would stick even with the bondo.
just my opinion....
Joe with 1980 Turbo Trans Am (26k original)
Got Balls?
First off, STOP CALLING PLASTIC BODY FILLER BONDO! Bondo is a brand
name, not the name of the type of filler.
Second, Almost all car makers use some sort of filler in cars, and any
one who has ever striped a car down to bare metal will know this.
Weather the filler is lead, plastic, putty, epoxy, or what have you,
it's there. The amount used by the factory verys, I have seen cars with
a lot from the factory, and some with almost none.
Third, the magnate test is useless. For all you know that part of the
body might have been repaired with aluminum. Not to mention Fiber
glass, or in a few years, carbon fiber.
Do you realize that by taking a magnate to a car, you are scratching
the paint? Or do you have your magnate wrapped in a clean soft cloth?
************************************************************************
Got Balls?
bmk...@yahoo.com
Take a magnate to my car, and I will not be responsible for the large
wholes that appear in your body.
CLASSICA
> but they had the best Candys' around.
> I make my own candys with Standox dye now and wouldn't mind comparing
> them to the old standby.
>
> In response to your other reply.....up here we are being pushed
> towards using HVLP gravity guns and single non-catalyzed products are
> being phased out.
> HVLP's are too slow in my opinion and getting rid of our single stage
> primer means we have to mix batches every time we break an edge.(major
> pain on flat rate).
> I was just asking because I was under the impression that you guys
> used Laquer a hell of a lot longer than we did since it doesn't hold
> up to our weather very well.
> (and for those who didn't listen to the 2 minute lecture in the US
> schools pertaining to Canada.....We don't live in freakin' igloos
> dammit!!!!)
> Dunno where that came from but it felt good anyhow <G>
>
> Ciao....
> Cogito cogito,ergo cogito sum.
>
> 'Wulff
slow check out some other some of these will really hose some paint on.
House OF Color is still around but has sold about a year ago to a big
paint co. ( can't remember there name but they've never done automotive
paint before) guess Jon is still brewing up paint and going back to what
he wants to do Bikes & Rods. And we ain't dumb we know you all live in
log cabins!
Mike Shambarger
PS at least with the new water born paints if you screw up you ca just
hose it down.
'Wulff
wrote:
>Got Balls? <bmk...@yahoo.com> wrote in article <367DEB...@yahoo.com>...
>> Gear Head wrote:
>> >
>> > Got Balls? <bmk...@yahoo.com> wrote in article
>> <snip>
>> > It's called a "spotting dye" by a lot of paint guys. I use it
>for that,
>> > as well. Works excellent. Sand the panel, apply extra primer (with
>the
>> > GUN) to the spots with dark primer.
>>
>> You use a spray gun to do it, I use a spray can. Same result.
>
> Suuuurrrrrrre... I belive you ;)
You'd be surprised at what can be done with a spraycan (filled with a
real paint,not the k-mart type) and a shitload of wetsanding and
polishing ; )
>> > I don't use undercoating.
>>
>> I do. In Ohio it can save one from rust, or as much rust. Not only
>> does it get nice and humid here, but in the winter they salt the roads.
>> If I lived in the South on the coast, I would under coat cars there.
>
> I scrape off all that rotten undercoating that traps dirt, salt, and then
>rust. Then paint the underside with a good epoxy primer then good paint.
>It's clean, doesn't trap dirt, and won't rust.
Yes, but which do you think will be safer against rocks beating the
crap out of the underside? Rubberized undercoating or straight paint?
Personally I don't undercoat cars that weren't done at the
factory,originally unless its completely stripped off to metal.
Doesn't make sense to me to put a heavy sealant over panels that most
likely have moisture in their pores, Seems to me those tend to rust
quicker.
to each his own I guess.
ciao......
Gear Head
<367e0ea5...@news.edm.shaw.wave.ca>...
> On Mon, 21 Dec 1998 01:15:22 -0500, Got Balls? <bmk...@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> Is House of Kolor still around? I haven't ordered from them in years
> but they had the best Candys' around.
I think they are still around, yes.
> I make my own candys with Standox dye now and wouldn't mind comparing
> them to the old standby.
>
> In response to your other reply.....up here we are being pushed
> towards using HVLP gravity guns and single non-catalyzed products are
> being phased out.
> HVLP's are too slow in my opinion and getting rid of our single stage
> primer means we have to mix batches every time we break an edge.(major
> pain on flat rate).
HVLP is nice, though. Beats the hell out of the old guns where you use 3
gallons of paint to spray a fender :)
Gear Head
> Mike:
>
> It seams to me that every painter has a paint of preference. Mine is
> PPG, which I always have good luck with. I also like some of the House
> of Kolor paints, but lacquer is a bitch to blend if you have to respray
> an area.
> ************************************************************************
> Got Balls?
> bmk...@yahoo.com
Yep, I like PPG, too. I like their Delstar enamels. I really like
Classic Corvette White, DAR 8631.
Gear Head
> Disclaimer: Before any one blasts me for not keeping the air clean, my
> spray booth is triple filtered. Which unless I am wrong, meets or
> exceeds the current Ohio EPA rules. I use one of the newer gravity feed
> spray guns, and the newer environment friendly PPG paints.
Lol. I've sprayed whole cars in my BACK YARD with an old Binks siphon
feed gun. Now if I have to spray a car, I have access to spray booths.
But the EPA would shit little green apples if they saw the billowing clouds
of overspray pouring up into the air when I did that :)
'Wulff
>'Wulff wrote:
>>
>> On Mon, 21 Dec 1998 01:15:22 -0500, Got Balls? <bmk...@yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > It seams to me that every painter has a paint of preference. Mine is
>> >PPG, which I always have good luck with. I also like some of the House
>> >of Kolor paints, but lacquer is a bitch to blend if you have to respray
>> >an area.
>> >************************************************************************
>> >Got Balls?
>> >bmk...@yahoo.com
>>
>> Is House of Kolor still around? I haven't ordered from them in years
>> but they had the best Candys' around.
>> I make my own candys with Standox dye now and wouldn't mind comparing
>> them to the old standby.
>>
>> In response to your other reply.....up here we are being pushed
>> towards using HVLP gravity guns and single non-catalyzed products are
>> being phased out.
>> HVLP's are too slow in my opinion and getting rid of our single stage
>> primer means we have to mix batches every time we break an edge.(major
>> pain on flat rate).
>> I was just asking because I was under the impression that you guys
>> used Laquer a hell of a lot longer than we did since it doesn't hold
>> up to our weather very well.
>> (and for those who didn't listen to the 2 minute lecture in the US
>> schools pertaining to Canada.....We don't live in freakin' igloos
>> dammit!!!!)
>> Dunno where that came from but it felt good anyhow <G>
>>
>> Ciao....
>> Cogito cogito,ergo cogito sum.
>>
>> 'Wulff
>Most states in the US have mandated HVLP guns but if you think there to
>slow check out some other some of these will really hose some paint on.
>House OF Color is still around but has sold about a year ago to a big
>paint co. ( can't remember there name but they've never done automotive
>paint before) guess Jon is still brewing up paint and going back to what
>he wants to do Bikes & Rods. And we ain't dumb we know you all live in
>log cabins!
>Mike Shambarger
>PS at least with the new water born paints if you screw up you ca just
>hose it down.
Hehe.....Yeah,and I had to rent a beaver to get a cable modem
installed in my "cabin" ;)
The HVLP's aren't mandatory yet but the move is coming,the ones I
tried out put out enough product but I wasn't impressed with the
atomization.
I tend to spray quite a bit faster than the norm so I like high
pressure and volume,I also double pass each area(one fast,one slow),It
seems the first pass tacks up immediately because of the high pressure
and the second heavy pass locks on better allowing more material in
less coats.
My paint rep agrees that i'll hate most HVLP's I try but he did find
one that's supposed to be perfect for my style,......time will tell i
guess.
It took me a lot of years to get all my bad habits,now I got to make
new ones <sigh>.
I've talked to a few guys that have used the water based systems and
the general consensus was that it wasn't bad paint but just useless
for any flat rate shop without good baking stands and a bitch when it
came to humidity etc.
I don't think anyone in this city uses it anymore.
Ciao......
Chris David
There are alot of ways to go about it..
I myself I sent my car to a sandblasting booth after striping it down to a
shell....
My feeling on this is doit right the first time take your time and spend a
few $$$$
I have a few ideas that might help you...
Check out the pic's on my web site...
http://www.cbd.net/stormbringer/index.htm
Hope this helps you out...
STORMBRINGER
>On 15 Dec 1998 16:54:05 , Paul Hubrich wrote:
>>NavySeal wrote:
>>>
>>> Hey guys,
>>>
>>> Just a question from a guy tryin to budget for his future resto job, my
>>> first actually
>>>
>>> How much is it to get a first gen camaro painted, including the engine
>>> compartment?
>>> Just a q so i can figure how long i have to wait before i get it.
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> NavySeal_01
>>
>>Like someone else posted, it can range from $500 to $5000.
>>
>>For $500 you can get somebody to scuff & shoot a quick coat of cheap
>>enamel, but you won't be happy with the results.
>>
>>For $5000 you can get the car stripped to bare metal and completely
>>redone in a flawless base/clear finish, but then you'll be afraid to
>>drive it.
>>
>>For about halfway in between you should be able to get a decent paint
>>job that might not win any shows, but will sure turn a lot of heads.
>>
>>Of course, any major body work that's needed will push the price up
>>accordingly.
>>
>>Good luck with your project - I sure love the looks of those first gen
>>camaros!!
>>.