Where was Oswald going when he left his rooming house?

[Canuck]

Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
(shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
regularly ate, btw.)?

Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" at
http://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)

- prwhitmey

[bigdog]

Only Oswald knew where he was going and why. Since he didn't tell us
that, we will never know. Tippit might have asked him that and we know
where that got him. We're left to play guessing games.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck <prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Hi Peter,

Yes, I have.

He was going to kill Walker. He had to catch a connecting bus at a
nearby bus stop on W.Jefferson Blvd.

If he wasn't planning on catching a bus, he would have had no need to
request a transfer when he left the bus in Dallas shortly after the
assassintion.

Any theory that doesn't account for the transfer is ignoring strong
evidence that Oswald had plans to go somewhere by bus after leaving
the rooming house.

That's some connection you're building there - Markham worked at a
restaurant where Jack Ruby ate.
The conspiracy is starting to become much clearer now. ;D
Seriously, though, of what pertinence is factoids like that? None that
I can see.

And in the article you wrote, I'm confused: Did Small's truck work on
11/22 or not? You say they were headed back to North Carolina when...
**they became stranded in Dallas due to mechanical problems with their
old truck**. Since they were very low on money at the time, it was
decided that Mrs. Small would find work in Dallas while Mr. Small
attempted to **repair the truck** sufficiently so that they could
continue their trip home, hopefully in time for Christmas in 1963
(they arrived in Dallas a few weeks prior to the assassination). They
were allowed to park their truck, which had sleeping facilities in the
back, on the property of a mechanic. On November 22, 1963, Cecil set
out **in his truck** for Western Auto on Main Street in downtown
Dallas..."

It sounds like he was driving the truck on 11/22 to get the parts
necessary to repair the truck that he couldn't drive due to mechanical
problems with the truck he was driving.

Do I have that right?

And then, there's this: "Small did describe his experience to other
members of the family, and sometime in the late sixties, two FBI
agents interviewed Small, suggesting that he should get a job and stop
worrying about the matter. [in other words, they didn't find him
credible - Hank] ... It is also plausible that Small feared for his
life as reports quickly came in indicating that Oswald had taken a
taxi driven by William Whaley (the most senior taxi driver in his
company and a Teamsters Union member, who died on duty several years
later in a car accident [5]). He might have felt it was safer to
simple keep the information to himself until he got back to the
security of his home in North Carolina."

So he told family members and possibly the FBI about it, and yet he
told no one because he might have feared for his life? Can you even
establish that Small knew about Whaley's death? If not, the whole
'maybe he feared for his life' scenario has no leg to stand on (it's
really just conjecture on your part with no evidence to support it in
any case).

I stopped after this bizarre scenario you paint: I highlighted the
pertinent parts:

"The most significant aspect of Small's account is the discussion he
*ALLEGEDLY* had with Oswald related to *POSSIBLY* exchanging guns.
*IF* this really occurred, it would provide an innocent explanation
for Oswald having picked up his .38 revolver at the rooming house. *IT
IS POSSIBLE* that Oswald was on his way to rendezvous with Small when
he was questioned by Tippit, who *MIGHT HAVE* noticed the gun, causing
Oswald to panic. It is also *POSSIBLE* that Oswald and Small had
already met and were in the process of making a trade when Tippit
showed up, especially if Small *HAPPENED TO BE* short, heavy-set with
black, curly hair. Such a description was given by several witnesses
to the Tippit murder, and Acquilla Clemons, who was ignored by the
Warren Commission, told Mark Lane that this man had shot Tippit,
gesturing to a man fitting Oswald's description to leave the scene.
[6] *IF*, in fact, Cecil Small shot Tippit with his long-barreled .38,
that would explain why he did not contact the Dallas Police about
having picked up Oswald."

So let me get this straight: Small didn't contact the police because
maybe he shot Tippit? But Small did tell family members all about it
and did talk to the FBI about the incident? And of course, Small had
no motive for shooting Tippit. And there's no evidence Small shot
Tippit, whereas the shells recovered at the scene matched Oswald's
gun. And don't even think to suggest that Small gave the gun back to
Oswald after the shooting; as why would Small shoot Tippit, and why
would Oswald accept the gun back? You can conjecture all you want, but
all you really have is a guy telling a story.

If somebody gunned down a cop in your presence, would you take the gun
and flee? If you were an innocent man, and stopped for questioning by
an officer of the law, would you pull out a gun and shoot him dead, or
just answer his questions?

Sheez. The lengths you conspiracy people go to try to absolve Oswald
of the crimes is truly over the top.

Your scenario is unbelievable. For a believable scenario, consult the
Warren Report.

Hank

[pjsp...@aol.com]

He was going to Ruby's apartment.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

Ok, I lied, I read a little further and saw this bizarre claim:

"Since there was no written record of Oswald's interrogation, we have
no idea whether Oswald himself indicated how he got to Oak Cliff on
Nov. 22. "

WRONG. Oswald admitted in custody that he took a bus and a cab.

We know this because of the written records of Oswald's interrogation
included as an appendix in the Warren Report. Are you familiar with
that documentation?

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0314b.htm
"...during this conversation he [Oswald] told me he reached his home
by cab..." (typewritten report prepared by Captain Fritz of the DPD)

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0323a.htm
"... he left the bus and rode a city cab to his
apartment..." (typewritten report of FBI Agent Bookhout)

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0325b.htm
"... he got off the bus and took a cab to his home..." (typewritten
report of Secret Service Agent Kelley)

In addition, after a little legwork, the DPD located Whaley and
interviewed him. Whaley remembered Oswald because of the silver
bracelet on his wrist.

Mr. BALL. I have here a bracelet which is marked 383. Take a look at
it and tell me if you have ever seen it before.
Mr. WHALEY. Yes, sir; as near as I can tell that is the bracelet he
was wearing the day I carried him, the shiny bracelet I was talking
about.
Mr. BALL. You mentioned the fact that the man who sat in the front
seat of your cab, which you drove from the Greyhound Station on Lamar
Street over to 500 North Beckley, had an identification bracelet on
him.
Mr. WHALEY. Yes, it looked like an identification bracelet. It looks
like this one, sir, it was shiny, I couldn't tell exactly whether that
was the bracelet or not.
Mr. BALL. But it looks like one of them?
Mr. WHALEY. Yes, sir; it looks like it.
Mr. BALL. Offer this in evidence.
Representative FORD. So admitted.

(Commission Exhibit No. 383 was withdrawn and a photograph of the
bracelet was received as Commission Exhibit No. 383-A.)

Representative FORD. What hand or what arm did he have it on?
Mr. WHALEY. He had it on the arm next to me, which was the left arm.
Representative FORD. Was it protruding below the sleeve or jacket?
Mr. WHALEY. His coatsleeve was like this when he stretches his arm out
it was short, that is when I saw it.
Representative FORD. Where was his hand when you saw it, if you can
recollect it?
Mr. WHALEY. Well, just moving. You know you catch any bright object,
why you notice it, that is how I noticed it. He was just moving his
hand around. When the old lady stuck her head in the door and asked me
to call her a cab. why he reached over to the door to open it like he
told her she could have that one but she decided that she would wait
for the next one because he already had that one. And that is when I
saw it, sir. In the picture, I believe, I don't think he had it on in
that picture in the paper the next morning.
Representative FORD. This is something you clearly noticed while he
was riding in the car with you?
Mr. WHALEY. Yes, sir; I noticed it; yes, sir. I always notice
watchbands, unusual watchbands, and identification bracelets like
these, because I make them myself. I made this one.
Representative FORD. In other words, you have a particular interest in
them?
Mr. WHALEY. Yes, I particularly notice things like that.
Representative FORD. Did you notice anything unusual about it?
Mr. WHALEY. No, sir, it was just a common stretchband identification
bracelet. A lot of them are made of chain links and not stretchbands.
Stretchbands are unusual because there is very few of them.
Representative FORD. In other words, this was an unusual band?
Mr. WHALEY. Yes, sir; this one was a stretchband like the one you
showed me.
Representative FORD. It is sort of a hobby with you to make these
kinds of wristbands?
Mr. WHALEY. Yes, sir; I make watchbands like that.

http://jfkassassination.net/russ/testimony/whaley2.htm

So let's review: Small's account has only his word for it. No
corroboration.
On the other hand, that Oswald admitted in custody he took a cab to
get to the roominghouse is noted in the reports of a member of the
DPD, a member of the FBI, and a member of the Secret Service. Further,
they found the cab driver in question, and he was able to affirm he
recognized the bracelet Oswald wore because it was a hobby of his. So
is there any doubt Oswald took the cab? Not really.

Why you want to promote the Small story is beyond me.

If I were you, I would be claiming that was some other Peter Whitmey
who wrote that article.

Hank

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck <prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Quoting from your article: "Small pulled over to ask directions from a
young man carrying some books, who was walking down Main St. The
pedestrian assured Small that he was going the right way, and at the same
time, asked for a ride, introducing himself as 'Lee Harvey Oswald.' "

Oswald never referred to himself as "Lee Harvey Oswald", Just "Lee
Oswald". Do you give your middle name to strangers when introducing
yourself? I don't.

Oswald didn't carry any books on the bus, nor was he seen with books when
confronted by Baker and Truly on the second floor of the TSBD just after
the shooting. Oswald had no books at the theatre. So what happened to
these books? Were any recovered from Oswald's room at the roominghouse?

Clearly, Small figured a guy who was just at the "Texas School Book
Depository" must have gotten some books while he was there, so he adds
this little detail to his entirely fictitious account to make it seem more
believable.

I have seen nothing in Small's account to make it appear believable. Nor
have I seen anything in your treatment of this story to make that
treatment credible.

Hank

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck <prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:

You wrote: "(It should be pointed out that there was no photo of
Oswald published until the following morning, but, of course, he was
shown on live television numerous times.)"

There was a morning paper (Dallas Morning News) and an evening paper
(Dallas Times Herald) in Dallas in those days.

Perhaps the evening paper had a photo of Oswald?

Hank

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck <prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck <prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Finally (I promise), you wrote, "The news report was attributed to the
Associated Press and was an edited version of a more detailed report
published the day before in the Winston-Salem Journal, written by
Charlie Peek of the paper's "Northwest Bureau." [2] Its headline read:
"DYING WORDS: Oswald Was Innocent, N.C. Man Says." According to Peek's
account, based on interviews with Mrs. Cecil Small and her niece,
Betty Donoghue, the late Mr. Small had claimed for many years that he
gave Lee Harvey Oswald a ride from Dealey Plaza to the Oak Cliff area
of Dallas, Texas, on November 22, 1963. According to the Warren
Commission, of course, Oswald had taken a taxi to his rooming house,
after getting off a bus that had bogged down in traffic. No reference
was made to such an allegation in the 26 volumes of the Warren
Report."

Your final sentence above, following immediately the claim by the
Warren Commission that Oswald took a taxi, makes it sound like the
taxi allegation had no supporting evidence.in the 26 volumes. As we've
seen, that's untrue, as Oswald admitted in custody that he took a
cab.

Perhaps it's just poor writing on your part, but I think you meant
this:

"... the late Mr. Small had claimed for many years that he gave Lee
Harvey Oswald a ride from Dealey Plaza to the Oak Cliff area of
Dallas, Texas, on November 22, 1963. No reference was made to such an
allegation in the 26 volumes of the Warren Report. According to the
Warren Commission, of course, Oswald had taken a taxi to his rooming
house, after getting off a bus that had bogged down in traffic."

However, given that you yourself noted that Small never reported the
supposed encounter to the Dallas Police, not sure why you would note
that the allegation doesn't appear in the WC volumes, unless you're
suggesting the Warren Commissioners should have been mind-readers.

So maybe you meant this:

"... the late Mr. Small had claimed for many years that he gave Lee
Harvey Oswald a ride from Dealey Plaza to the Oak Cliff area of
Dallas, Texas, on November 22, 1963. There is no known evidence that
confirms or even supports the late Cecil Small's story. According to
the Warren Commission, of course, Oswald had taken a taxi to his
rooming house, after getting off a bus that had bogged down in
traffic. The Warren Commission version of events is supported by the
driver of the cab who was located after the assassination, as well as
Oswald's admission in custody that he took a cab to his roominghouse,
as noted in the reports filed by Captain Will Fritz of the Dallas
Police, Agent Kelley of the Secret Service, and Agent Bookhout of the
FBI."

All the best.
Hank

[Bud]

On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck <prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:

I think the right question is where was the nearest bus or train
that would take Oswald to Walker`s neighborhood in Dallas.

[Anthony Marsh]

Fun to guess, isn't it? Don't get your fingernails all dirty by looking
through dusty old newspapers.
Now, if you are going to make up some hokey theory about the all knowing
conspiracy then shouldn't they have published his photo BEFORE the
assassination?

[Reserch]

"bigdog" <jecorb...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f1261f31-4fbd-496a...@n19g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...

He was waiting on the DPD to transport him. Mrs. Roberts did not say he
got on a bus. She said he was at the bus stop waiting. And she saw and
heard a DPD patrol car near the drive way. But didn't say Oswald she saw
him get into it. But a nosey old woman would have waited to see what the
patrol car was waiting for. Or if they had picked up Oswald. The police
and the FBI left out what parts of her statements that didn't match the
alone theory.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

> assassination?- Hide quoted text -
>

Not my theory there was some all-knowing conspiracy.
Perhaps you meant to address this to Peter?
It's his article. He should have researched this, doncha think?

[markusp]

On Wednesday, March 28, 2012 10:54:20 AM UTC-5, Canuck wrote:
> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> regularly ate, btw.)?

It's all speculative. IMO, all of his actions subsequent to looking down
Baker's sidearm while still on the 2nd floor of the TSBD are best
explained as those of someone in a controlled panic, right after
experiencing a personal epiphany that the POTUS had indeed been shot. If
we look at his actions from that perspective, the only bits of logic that
pop out are his decision to go past his rooming house in the cab, and then
walking back to it. He had to see if any authorities or other persons were
there, unless he wanted to see if Earlene was home.

Oswald must have been within earshot of Roy Truly vouching for him as an
employee in the TSBD. The quandary there then can be: If he had just heard
Truly vouch for him as an employee, why would he suspect that authorities
had already investigated enough to find that address at the rooming house?

~Mark

[Hans Trayne]

LHO was killing time waiting for DPD to clear out of the TSBD. He
could have had the cabbie wait for him if he planned on immediately
returning to work. If no announcement of the rifle having being found
had been made I believe he would have returned to the building and
attempted to slip the rifle out of it. LHO had to know once his
absense from work was reported DPD would be looking for him to ask him
why he left work after the shooting.
The pistol was to use on DPD once they confronted him again. Tippit
was the 1st DPD to confront LHO and LHO murdered him to avoid arrest.
I think JFK was his only target that day and Tippit was a fate thing.

[Anthony Marsh]

Train? What if the nearest bus was in Dealey Plaza? What good would that
do? If his goal was only to kill Walker he could have told the cab
driver to wait for him, run in to get the revolver and then taken the
cab to Walker's house.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

Not far from the Tippit shooting site - on West Jefferson.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

And he needed the bus transfer why?

Any idea?

[Anthony Marsh]

Tippit was not the first DPD to confront Oswald. Baker had his revolver
pointed at his belly. Why didn't Oswald put up a struggle so that he
could be shot, you know suicide by cop?

[Anthony Marsh]

Just trying to help you.
Since you think publishing Oswald's photo immediately after the shooting
would have been helpful.
Again my point stands. You refuse to do any research.

[Anthony Marsh]

Silly. Are you doing this on purpose or is it natural?

[Anthony Marsh]

He didn't need it. It was given out routinely.

[Bud]

On Mar 30, 1:29 am, Anthony Marsh <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 3/29/2012 1:07 AM, Bud wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com>  wrote:
> >> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> >> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> >> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> >> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> >> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> >> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> >> regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> >> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
> >> article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>
> >> - prwhitmey
>
> >    I think the right question is where was the nearest bus or train
> > that would take Oswald to Walker`s neighborhood in Dallas.
>
> Train? What if the nearest bus was in Dealey Plaza? What good would that
> do?

None, if he didn`t have his handgun.

> If his goal was only to kill Walker he could have told the cab
> driver to wait for him, run in to get the revolver and then taken the
> cab to Walker's house.

He didn`t even want to risk having the cab drop him at the
boardinghouse, you know that.

[Bud]

On Mar 30, 1:33 am, "Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)"

Really? Do you know the bus number and how close that would take
him?

I wondered (and did a little looking into the possibility) that
Oswald was heading to the zoo, where there were a lot of buses and a
train (Santa Fe, which ran up into Walker`s neck of the woods, now
light rail). In order to get to the zoo you have to take the bridge
(or underpass) at Marsalis Ave over (or under) Thorton Freeway, and he
was heading directly towards that from the boardinghouse if I remember
correctly.

[bigdog]

On Mar 30, 1:16 am, "Reserch" <questio...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "bigdog" <jecorbett1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message

A fine example of runaway speculation. You have nothing to support
your silly assumption that Oswald was waiting for the DPD to pick him
up. If that were true, why would he wait only a few seconds for them
before taking off on foot? Why would he have even left the house until
he saw them arrive? The only way this would have made any sense would
be if the police car had stopped in front of his house, honked the
horn, and Oswald came out and got in the car. But that isn't what
happened. We know Oswald was on foot when TIppit confronted him.
Imagination has always been a substitute for evidence in CT World.

Nobody left out Earlene Roberts statement. The WC included it. They
just didn't leap to your silly assumption that Oswald was waiting for
a ride from the DPD.

[bigdog]

On Mar 30, 1:23 am, markusp <markina...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Wednesday, March 28, 2012 10:54:20 AM UTC-5, Canuck wrote:
> > Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> > Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> > to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> > (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> > to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> > to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> > regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> It's all speculative. IMO, all of his actions subsequent to looking down
> Baker's sidearm while still on the 2nd floor of the TSBD are best
> explained as those of someone in a controlled panic, right after
> experiencing a personal epiphany that the POTUS had indeed been shot.

I don't think that came as a surprise to him.

> If
> we look at his actions from that perspective, the only bits of logic that
> pop out are his decision to go past his rooming house in the cab, and then
> walking back to it. He had to see if any authorities or other persons were
> there, unless he wanted to see if Earlene was home.
>

A pretty good guess.

> Oswald must have been within earshot of Roy Truly vouching for him as an
> employee in the TSBD. The quandary there then can be: If he had just heard
> Truly vouch for him as an employee, why would he suspect that authorities
> had already investigated enough to find that address at the rooming house?
>

He would have no idea how long it would take them to make him the
prime suspect. He had to know by leaving work without being authorized
to do so would look suspiscious. It was just a matter of time before
they discovered he was missing. Oswald had no idea how much time that
would take so he wasn't taking any chances.

[bigdog]

On Mar 30, 1:33 am, "Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)"
<hsienz...@Aol.com> wrote:

I hadn't thought of that angle before, but it is worth considering. Of
course we'll never know.

[James K. Olmstead]

"Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)" <hsie...@Aol.com> wrote in message
news:f33acec9-b3d8-4c10...@i18g2000vbx.googlegroups.com...

Hey Joe: How ya been btw. I will have a hard time calling you Hank so bear
with me ok.

On the bus transfer. It made "immediate sense" for him to ask for it
getting off the bus, even if
he had no plans to "use it" although there were several buses he could use
it on, if that was his
goal. I think too much time is spent in speculation on the "transfer".
There are three examples
in this thread alone, illustrating such speculation, that can not be
established:

1. To meet up with Small, who only had a story to tell, with no solid
supporting evidence, much like Baker's love affair
2. To shoot Walker...who was out of town...however some of his associates in
question, were in Dallas and in the
area of JDT's patrol.

3. To meet with Ruby, the man who is so upset over the events that he later
kills Oswald. Although I do believe there
is a greater Ruby/Oswald connection, then presented, I have strong doubts
LHO would head to see Ruby at 501 N. Ewing.

However, he could be heading to 501 N. Ewing, apt E, which is in the same
building Ruby lives, in a round about manner
to avoid being followed. It's possible he could catch a bus that would take
him closer to Apt E ,in the direction headed and
use the "transfer" to do so.

The man who lived at 501 N. Ewing, apt E, was a "Marxist Defector" (Korean
War POW) who had recently purchased
at Browning semi automatic rifle, from Sears in Arlington for $75.99 and at
times had worked for Ruby. The man was
Thomas R. Peasner, who had known associates, who lived across the street
from the Paines.

Btw the SN of the rifle is known but the "notes" do not show all the numbers
clearly.....SN R706278 is my best guess. He used
a "bad check" in at least one rifle purchase, at this time there might be
another rifle from Montgomery Wards to consider. It is
the "bad check" issue that brought him into consideration, by the FBI.

501 N. Ewing is the last known address of Peasner, he may not have been
there on Nov 22....I honestly don't know
for sure. I'm making NO CLAIM at this time against Peasner of any
connection to killing JFK, until several factors are verified.

There is a much stronger "connection" here then a solid connection between
these two "Marxist Defectors" both being in Dallas, but that
is to follow as research is confirmed. Both men are dead, so it's very
difficult to ask questions concerning motive and intent.

Yes, at this time this is "speculation" on my part....but it is based on
facts and facts that I hope to pull together even tighter
very shortly after my trip to D.C. in a week or so. This research is only
about a year old and I feel it is critical. I would
very much like your opinion on it as it progresses, I hope you and others
will follow. This work is based on Greg Parker's finding
a critical link. That link is solid and in the public domain, I just want
to find the actual document in support, if a copy is available at GWU
or elsewhere. If I can't find it at GWU, the Archives or Library of
Congress, I hope to get someone like McAdamsor McKnight, who is in
a great spot to help get involved

To add to the speculation....What if Lee, while on the bus decided to act
against somebody for the actions, he knew he would
be blamed for, got a transfer, got off the bus, went to an area in the clear
of traffic (bus station), caught a cab to his rooming house, got his gun
and headed to "get" the man responsible, much like Ruby did later against
Oswald, because Lee knew he would be arrested and be the "Patsy" for the
crime,
using the "transfer" to do so. BTW he got of where he did to see if he
could see a specific car parked in front of a house on Neely.

jko

[Hans Trayne]

LHO leaving work after the pistol in his gut confrontation by Officer
Baker & arming his person suggests to me he was the shooter. Had he had
his pistol with him I have no doubt in my mind Baker would have died
before Tippit did. I wonder if LHO saw Baker dismount his motorcycle and
run in to the TSBD and if this is what prompted him to didtch the rifle
and get his butt off the 6th floor. It's possible. LHO had no way of
knowing how many DPD and others would enter the building and what kind of
search would be conducted. He might have felt the officers would quickly
search for an armed person and leave when none was found.

The rifle hidden between the boxes is what would tie LHO to the crime,
regardless if DPD or his boss or co-workers discovered it. Without the
rifle in the hands of law authorities LHO could easily slip out of any
accusation to the crime. I suspect had the rifle not been found LHO would
have returned to work Monday as if nothing that happened concerned him and
slipped the weapon out of the building then (if not sooner during the
weekend).

I have read theories that LHO armed his person and was going after someone
who double crossed him. That, like all the countless other theories have
not been proven and the double-crosser has not gone public as of this
date, 2012.

[Hans Trayne]

On Mar 30, 2:27 pm, bigdog <jecorbett1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Some additional comments FWIW. Oswald's post-shooting actions suggest to
me PPP (piss poor planning). The crime itself is not as complicated as
people have made it over the years. I beieve LHO thought he could fire at
JFK and in the confusion law enforcement would not catch him in the act or
immediately afterwards. Since any given warehouse has "secret" hiding
places known to the employees, LHO may have planed on hiding the weapon
somewhere other than where he ditched it. He ditched it because he needed
to get his butt of the 6th floor. Had he wanted a shootout he could have
stayed on the 6th floor; he had been trained by the marines to use a rifle
as a weapon with or without ammo plus he still had one round in the
chamber. Hiding the weapon tells me he did not want the weapon found,
otherwise, he would have left it in the nest.

In short, when Officer Baker quickly entered the TSBD it screwed LHO's
plans up (whatever they may have been) in getting the wepon broken down
and out of the building.

Leaving and arming himself is not something an innocent person would do
IMO. It suggests to me that the person is expecting contact with law
enforcement and has the ability to use deadly force, something LHO did not
have when Officer Baker confronted him. He did have that ability when
Tippit confronted him and LHO used it.

A lot of folks tend to overlook that a city bus was parked at the Commerce
Street-Houston St. intersection (seen in the Bronson film) just after the
shooting and the Greyhound bus station is just a short walk from Dealey
Plaza (it's where LHO got his cab) so escaping Dallas seems to be not
LHO's priority after the shooting. Arming himself was. I suspect LHO might
have simply wandered around, visited a Library, zoo, whatever to kill time
until he could know if the rifle had been found by law enforcement.
Somewhere I read he was going to kill Marina. PPP is wandering around
trying to figure out a next move. LHO's actions reek of PPP. He had to
have suspected DPD would come looking for him for being absent from work b
ecause of the possibility he might have been taken hostage by the shooter
if for no other reason.

If you worked in a building where the police suspected gunfire from
originating would you immediately rush home and arm yourself? How about if
you had just shot someone and your weapon was in the building and you knew
it was just a matter of time before law enforcement found it?

[Hans Trayne]

On Mar 30, 2:27 pm, bigdog <jecorbett1...@yahoo.com> wrote:

LHO might have gotten some sympathy from DPD if he had told them he got
scared after the assassination and went & got his pistol because he was
afraid the shooter was still in the building (he should have omitted the
'work was finished for the day' stuff and claimed he was returning to
work). Something like that. I don't buy it and I doubt DPD would have
bought it either with an officer lying dead by his squad car as a result
of LHO's pistol. Besides lying about the rifle being his, he never gave
DPD an explaination why he was armed when arrested at the theatre.

Like I wrote earlier, LHO's actions suggest he didn't have a plan on what
to do after he shot at JFK. Unlike the Walker shooter where police were
not immediately on the scene, in the assassination aftermath a DPD officer
(Baker) rushed into the building in a matter of seconds after the final
shot. I don't believe LHO had made allowances for this and it messed up
whatever he had planned to do to break down his rifle and hide it
somewhere where officers would not find it (carton of books or large
shipping boxes). We know he had the weapon stashed somewhere that was not
noticed prior to the shooting, it's after the shooting where the weapon is
discovered.

The more people complicate this crime the more it leads right back to LHO
IMO.

[bigdog]

You might be right. Oswald might have been resigned to his fate and
figured it would end in a shootout with the cops. Where that happened
probably wouldn't have made a difference to him. Of course, we wil never
know. Surely his primary target was JFK. He could have had a shootout with
the cops any time he wanted. Bringing his pistol with him to the TSBD
would have risked foiling his primary objective with no benefit ot offset
the risk.

> I wonder if LHO saw Baker dismount his motorcycle and
> run in to the TSBD and if this is what prompted him to didtch the rifle
> and get his butt off the 6th floor. It's possible.

I doubt that although that's possible. He seems to have paused briefly at
the window but I think he would have been watching the limo racing away.
He probably would have guessed the TSBD would be quickly surrounded and
that he needed to get out of Dodge ASAP regardless of what he saw. It
would have been impractical to take the rifle with him if he wanted to
make a getaway. He had one bullet left in it which he could have used on
Baker had he chosen to take it with him, but apparently he thought better
of it.

> LHO had no way of
> knowing how many DPD and others would enter the building and what kind of
> search would be conducted. He might have felt the officers would quickly
> search for an armed person and leave when none was found.
>

Again we are guessing, but my guess is that he would have figured that
somebody saw him shooting and the building would be quickly surrounded and
secured. His only chance was to get out before that happened.

> The rifle hidden between the boxes is what would tie LHO to the crime,
> regardless if DPD or his boss or co-workers discovered it. Without the
> rifle in the hands of law authorities LHO could easily slip out of any
> accusation to the crime. I suspect had the rifle not been found LHO would
> have returned to work Monday as if nothing that happened concerned him and
> slipped the weapon out of the building then (if not sooner during the
> weekend).
>

I don't think Oswald had any expectations of getting away with it. I think
he was surprised to make it as far as he did. He wasn't stupid. One way or
another, he probably knew he would be trading his life for JFK's. He just
wasn't going to make it easy for the DPD to take him alive. Jack Ruby did
for him what he expected the DPD would do instead.

> I have read theories that LHO armed his person and was going after someone
> who double crossed him. That, like all the countless other theories have
> not been proven and the double-crosser has not gone public as of this
> date, 2012.

If you are talking about a co-conspirator who double crossed him, I doubt
that. There is no reason to believe he had any co-conspirator or any
reason to believe he thought he had been double crossed. You can't prove
such a person didn't exist any more than you can prove unicorns don't
exist, there just isn't any compelling reason to believe that either do.

A few days ago I read the theory that he might have been heading for
General Walker in hopes of winning the assassin's Daily Double. I don't
think that can be dismissed. He had already tried to kill Walker once so
why not try to take another crack at Walker before the cops caught up with
him. All fun things to ponder with the realization that we will never know
for sure what he had in mind when he walked away from the sniper's nest.

[bigdog]

It suggests to me that he didn't much care what happened if he was
able to complete his mission.

> The crime itself is not as complicated as
> people have made it over the years.

It couldn't be any simpler. Stick a rifle out a window and shoot a guy
a short distance away.

>I beieve LHO thought he could fire at
> JFK and in the confusion law enforcement would not catch him in the act or
> immediately afterwards. Since any given warehouse has "secret" hiding
> places known to the employees, LHO may have planed on hiding the weapon
> somewhere other than where he ditched it. He ditched it because he needed
> to get his butt of the 6th floor. Had he wanted a shootout he could have
> stayed on the 6th floor; he had been trained by the marines to use a rifle
> as a weapon with or without ammo plus he still had one round in the
> chamber. Hiding the weapon tells me he did not want the weapon found,
> otherwise, he would have left it in the nest.

No matter where he hid the rifle, it was going to be found. It was only a
matter of time. Oswald had to calculate whether the additional time it
would have taken to put it in a better hiding place was worth the
additional risk that the building would get sealed off before he could
getaway. With only one bullet left, he couldn't have had much of a
shootout, plus he wouldn't know in advance how many of those bullets he
would need to finish off JFK. I think from the moment he took his last
shot at JFK he was improvising. Given that he successfully escaped from
the scene of the crime, I don't think we should second guess his choices.

>
> In short, when Officer Baker quickly entered the TSBD it screwed LHO's
> plans up (whatever they may have been) in getting the wepon broken down
> and out of the building.
>

I don't think taking the weapon with him ever entered his mind. I
could be wrong. That happened once before.

> Leaving and arming himself is not something an innocent person would do
> IMO. It suggests to me that the person is expecting contact with law
> enforcement and has the ability to use deadly force, something LHO did not
> have when Officer Baker confronted him. He did have that ability when
> Tippit confronted him and LHO used it.
>

Precisely.

> A lot of folks tend to overlook that a city bus was parked at the Commerce
> Street-Houston St. intersection (seen in the Bronson film) just after the
> shooting and the Greyhound bus station is just a short walk from Dealey
> Plaza (it's where LHO got his cab) so escaping Dallas seems to be not
> LHO's priority after the shooting.

That bus might not have been going Oswald's way. That might explain why he
chose to board Cecil McWatters bus a few blocks away. In addition to the
bus station, the train station was also just a few blocks away. The tracks
on the overpass lead right into that station. The scheduled departures for
either Greyhound or train might not have synced up with the timing of the
shooting and it is likely those departures would have been postponed to
prevent the assassin from escaping that way.

> Arming himself was. I suspect LHO might
> have simply wandered around, visited a Library, zoo, whatever to kill time
> until he could know if the rifle had been found by law enforcement.
> Somewhere I read he was going to kill Marina. PPP is wandering around
> trying to figure out a next move. LHO's actions reek of PPP. He had to
> have suspected DPD would come looking for him for being absent from work b
> ecause of the possibility he might have been taken hostage by the shooter
> if for no other reason.
>

Again, he should have had not expectations that the rifle wouldn't be
found or that he wouldn't quickly become the #1 suspect.

> If you worked in a building where the police suspected gunfire from
> originating would you immediately rush home and arm yourself? How about if
> you had just shot someone and your weapon was in the building and you knew
> it was just a matter of time before law enforcement found it?

Whatever Oswald had in mind, I don't think it was that he had a
snowball's chance in hell of getttng away with it.

[Anthony Marsh]

> scared after the assassination and went& got his pistol because he was

> afraid the shooter was still in the building (he should have omitted the

Silly. An armed cop stopped him. If the shooter was still there the
armed cop would get him.

> 'work was finished for the day' stuff and claimed he was returning to
> work). Something like that. I don't buy it and I doubt DPD would have

There was no further work to return to.

> bought it either with an officer lying dead by his squad car as a result
> of LHO's pistol. Besides lying about the rifle being his, he never gave
> DPD an explaination why he was armed when arrested at the theatre.
>

Yes, he did. He said you know how us Texas boys are about our guns.

> Like I wrote earlier, LHO's actions suggest he didn't have a plan on what
> to do after he shot at JFK. Unlike the Walker shooter where police were
> not immediately on the scene, in the assassination aftermath a DPD officer
> (Baker) rushed into the building in a matter of seconds after the final
> shot. I don't believe LHO had made allowances for this and it messed up

Yes, seconds. How many? How many minutes did it take for the police to
arrive at Walker's house or the church goers to coming running out of
the church when they heard a shot?

> whatever he had planned to do to break down his rifle and hide it
> somewhere where officers would not find it (carton of books or large
> shipping boxes). We know he had the weapon stashed somewhere that was not
> noticed prior to the shooting, it's after the shooting where the weapon is
> discovered.
>

If he had a plan he could have put the rifle in a box and shipped it to
China.

[Anthony Marsh]

There was only one round left in the rifle? How would the shooter know he
wouldn't immediately be set upon by the three men on the floor below who
clearly heard the rifle above them? One bullet, three strong men.

> In short, when Officer Baker quickly entered the TSBD it screwed LHO's
> plans up (whatever they may have been) in getting the wepon broken down
> and out of the building.
>

Silly. Most WC defenders claim that Oswald was already in the process of
leaving the TSBD when Baker intercepted him.

> Leaving and arming himself is not something an innocent person would do
> IMO. It suggests to me that the person is expecting contact with law

Arming himself is exactly what most Texans do. I like your idea that
only criminals arm themselves with a revolver. Can we use that in the
Florida right to kill case?

> enforcement and has the ability to use deadly force, something LHO did not
> have when Officer Baker confronted him. He did have that ability when
> Tippit confronted him and LHO used it.
>

Same for Ruby then.

> A lot of folks tend to overlook that a city bus was parked at the Commerce
> Street-Houston St. intersection (seen in the Bronson film) just after the
> shooting and the Greyhound bus station is just a short walk from Dealey
> Plaza (it's where LHO got his cab) so escaping Dallas seems to be not
> LHO's priority after the shooting. Arming himself was. I suspect LHO might

Why should he be trying to escape when he did nothing wrong. Does
everyone try to escape when they leave work?

> have simply wandered around, visited a Library, zoo, whatever to kill time
> until he could know if the rifle had been found by law enforcement.

Take in a movie?

> Somewhere I read he was going to kill Marina. PPP is wandering around

No, you didn't.
You are making up crap again.

> trying to figure out a next move. LHO's actions reek of PPP. He had to
> have suspected DPD would come looking for him for being absent from work b
> ecause of the possibility he might have been taken hostage by the shooter
> if for no other reason.
>

Shouldn't the DPD have been looking for him for shooting at General
Walker? Or did they give him a pass on that one?

> If you worked in a building where the police suspected gunfire from
> originating would you immediately rush home and arm yourself? How about if

He didn't immediately rush home.
He stayed around long enough to be confronted by Baker. If he was guilty
he could have run out the back door.

> you had just shot someone and your weapon was in the building and you knew
> it was just a matter of time before law enforcement found it?
>

If you knew you we being framed for murder, what would you do?

[Anthony Marsh]

> Baker& arming his person suggests to me he was the shooter. Had he had

> his pistol with him I have no doubt in my mind Baker would have died

Well, he did have a Coke bottle in his hand when Baker stopped him.
Maybe he could have killed Baker with the Coke bottle. But Oswald did
nothing suspicious when stopped by Baker.

> before Tippit did. I wonder if LHO saw Baker dismount his motorcycle and
> run in to the TSBD and if this is what prompted him to didtch the rifle
> and get his butt off the 6th floor. It's possible. LHO had no way of

Interesting speculation. You really think that the shooter is going to
stick around watching the scene for 30 seconds and not trying to hide
the rifle and get away? Add those extra 30 seconds to the WC timing of
the Baker encounter.

> knowing how many DPD and others would enter the building and what kind of
> search would be conducted. He might have felt the officers would quickly
> search for an armed person and leave when none was found.
>

Yeah, the police always storm the building and find the shooter still
holding the rifle. What TV show was that?

> The rifle hidden between the boxes is what would tie LHO to the crime,

How could the rifle possibly tie Oswald to the crime? He had bought it
under an alias and the DPD was too stupid to figure that out.

> regardless if DPD or his boss or co-workers discovered it. Without the
> rifle in the hands of law authorities LHO could easily slip out of any
> accusation to the crime. I suspect had the rifle not been found LHO would

Is the rifle the only thing they could use to link Oswald to the crime?
Couldn't they bribe some witnesses to say they saw Oswald shooting from
that window? Couldn't they beat a confession out of him? Couldn't they
threaten his wife into testifying against him? Threaten her with
deportation or taking away her children.

> have returned to work Monday as if nothing that happened concerned him and
> slipped the weapon out of the building then (if not sooner during the
> weekend).
>
> I have read theories that LHO armed his person and was going after someone
> who double crossed him. That, like all the countless other theories have
> not been proven and the double-crosser has not gone public as of this
> date, 2012.
>

Hmm, that would assume that he knew who was framing him.
Not just some generic government office.

[Anthony Marsh]

Yes, so did Givens which is why they put out an APB on Givens instead of
Oswald.

>

[Anthony Marsh]

When Oswald played hookey from school in New York didn't he always go to
the zoo? His only friends were the animals.

[Anthony Marsh]

On 3/30/2012 3:24 PM, Bud wrote:
> On Mar 30, 1:29 am, Anthony Marsh<anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 3/29/2012 1:07 AM, Bud wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
>>>> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
>>>> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
>>>> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
>>>> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
>>>> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
>>>> regularly ate, btw.)?
>>
>>>> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
>>>> article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>>
>>>> - prwhitmey
>>
>>> I think the right question is where was the nearest bus or train
>>> that would take Oswald to Walker`s neighborhood in Dallas.
>>
>> Train? What if the nearest bus was in Dealey Plaza? What good would that
>> do?
>
> None, if he didn`t have his handgun.
>

Why does he need a revolver to take the train? What's he going to do,
hijack the train to Cuba? Oh, you mean like taking the revolver on his
trip to Mexico and visiting the Soviet Embassy?

>> If his goal was only to kill Walker he could have told the cab
>> driver to wait for him, run in to get the revolver and then taken the
>> cab to Walker's house.
>
> He didn`t even want to risk having the cab drop him at the
> boardinghouse, you know that.
>

That's why he went past the boarding house to see if it was being staked
out. That's why I got off the bus one stop beyond my apartment when we
were on strike to see if the hired thugs had staked it out. They had and I
got in the back way from another apartment and they didn't even know I was
there.

[Canuck]

On Mar 28, 8:58 pm, "Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)"

<hsienz...@Aol.com> wrote:
> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck <prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> > Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> > to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> > (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> > to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> > to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> > regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> > Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
> > article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>
> > - prwhitmey
>

> Quoting from your article: "Small pulled over to ask directions from a
> young man carrying some books, who was walking down Main St. The
> pedestrian assured Small that he was going the right way, and at the same
> time, asked for a ride, introducing himself as 'Lee Harvey Oswald.' "
>
> Oswald never referred to himself as "Lee Harvey Oswald", Just "Lee
> Oswald". Do you give your middle name to strangers when introducing
> yourself? I don't.
>
That had occurred to me too. However, he was interviewed about this
event years later, and by then Oswald was usually referred to as "Lee
Harvey Oswald", not "Lee Oswald", just as MLK's convicted killer is
referred to as "James Earl Ray" not "James Ray".

> Oswald didn't carry any books on the bus, nor was he seen with books when
> confronted by Baker and Truly on the second floor of the TSBD just after
> the shooting. Oswald had no books at the theatre. So what happened to
> these books? Were any recovered from Oswald's room at the roominghouse?
>
Oswald did check out numerous books from the library, the last of
which possibly were found at the roominghouse. Being a loner and a
bookworm, it's possible he read during his lunch and coffee breaks at
the TSBD.

> Clearly, Small figured a guy who was just at the "Texas School Book
> Depository" must have gotten some books while he was there, so he adds
> this little detail to his entirely fictitious account to make it seem more
> believable.


>
> I have seen nothing in Small's account to make it appear believable. Nor
> have I seen anything in your treatment of this story to make that
> treatment credible.
>
> Hank

[Canuck]

On Mar 28, 8:59 pm, "Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)"

<hsienz...@Aol.com> wrote:
> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck <prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> > Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> > to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> > (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> > to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> > to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> > regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> > Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
> > article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>
> > - prwhitmey
>

> Finally (I promise), you wrote, "The news report was attributed to the
> Associated Press and was an edited version of a more detailed report
> published the day before in the Winston-Salem Journal, written by
> Charlie Peek of the paper's "Northwest Bureau." [2] Its headline read:
> "DYING WORDS: Oswald Was Innocent, N.C. Man Says." According to Peek's
> account, based on interviews with Mrs. Cecil Small and her niece,
> Betty Donoghue, the late Mr. Small had claimed for many years that he
> gave Lee Harvey Oswald a ride from Dealey Plaza to the Oak Cliff area
> of Dallas, Texas, on November 22, 1963. According to the Warren
> Commission, of course, Oswald had taken a taxi to his rooming house,
> after getting off a bus that had bogged down in traffic. No reference
> was made to such an allegation in the 26 volumes of the Warren
> Report."
>
> Your final sentence above, following immediately the claim by the
> Warren Commission that Oswald took a taxi, makes it sound like the
> taxi allegation had no supporting evidence.in the 26 volumes. As we've
> seen, that's untrue, as Oswald admitted in custody that he took a
> cab.
>

Yes, my last sentence in the paragraph was misleading. I should have
stated:

"No reference was made to Small's allegation in the 26 volumes of the
Warren Report." - prwhitmey

[Canuck]

On Mar 28, 8:50 pm, "Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)"

<hsienz...@Aol.com> wrote:
> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck <prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> > Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> > to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> > (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> > to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> > to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> > regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> > Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
> > article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>
> > - prwhitmey
>

> Hi Peter,
>
> Yes, I have.
>
> He was going to kill Walker. He had to catch a connecting bus at a
> nearby bus stop on W.Jefferson Blvd.
>
> If he wasn't planning on catching a bus, he would have had no need to
> request a transfer when he left the bus in Dallas shortly after the
> assassintion.
>
> Any theory that doesn't account for the transfer is ignoring strong
> evidence that Oswald had plans to go somewhere by bus after leaving
> the rooming house.
>
> That's some connection you're building there - Markham worked at a
> restaurant where Jack Ruby ate.
> The conspiracy is starting to become much clearer now. ;D
> Seriously, though, of what pertinence is factoids like that? None that
> I can see.
>
> And in the article you wrote, I'm confused: Did Small's truck work on
> 11/22 or not? You say they were headed back to North Carolina when...
> **they became stranded in Dallas due to mechanical problems with their
> old truck**. Since they were very low on money at the time, it was
> decided that Mrs. Small would find work in Dallas while Mr. Small
> attempted to **repair the truck** sufficiently so that they could
> continue their trip home, hopefully in time for Christmas in 1963
> (they arrived in Dallas a few weeks prior to the assassination). They
> were allowed to park their truck, which had sleeping facilities in the
> back, on the property of a mechanic.  On November 22, 1963, Cecil set
> out **in his truck** for Western Auto on Main Street in downtown
> Dallas..."
>
> It sounds like he was driving the truck on 11/22 to get the parts
> necessary to repair the truck that he couldn't drive due to mechanical
> problems with the truck he was driving.
>
> Do I have that right?
>
> And then, there's this: "Small did describe his experience to other
> members of the family, and sometime in the late sixties, two FBI
> agents interviewed Small, suggesting that he should get a job and stop
> worrying about the matter. [in other words, they didn't find him
> credible - Hank] ... It is also plausible that Small feared for his
> life as reports quickly came in indicating that Oswald had taken a
> taxi driven by William Whaley (the most senior taxi driver in his
> company and a Teamsters Union member, who died on duty several years
> later in a car accident [5]). He might have felt it was safer to
> simple keep the information to himself until he got back to the
> security of his home in North Carolina."
>
> So he told family members and possibly the FBI about it, and yet he
> told no one because he might have feared for his life? Can you even
> establish that Small knew about Whaley's death? If not, the whole
> 'maybe he feared for his life' scenario has no leg to stand on (it's
> really just conjecture on your part with no evidence to support it in
> any case).
>
> I stopped after this bizarre scenario you paint: I highlighted the
> pertinent parts:
>
> "The most significant aspect of Small's account is the discussion he
> *ALLEGEDLY* had with Oswald related to *POSSIBLY* exchanging guns.
> *IF* this really occurred, it would provide an innocent explanation
> for Oswald having picked up his .38 revolver at the rooming house. *IT
> IS POSSIBLE* that Oswald was on his way to rendezvous with Small when
> he was questioned by Tippit, who *MIGHT HAVE* noticed the gun, causing
> Oswald to panic. It is also *POSSIBLE* that Oswald and Small had
> already met and were in the process of making a trade when Tippit
> showed up, especially if Small *HAPPENED TO BE* short, heavy-set with
> black, curly hair. Such a description was given by several witnesses
> to the Tippit murder, and Acquilla Clemons, who was ignored by the
> Warren Commission, told Mark Lane that this man had shot Tippit,
> gesturing to a man fitting Oswald's description to leave the scene.
> [6] *IF*, in fact, Cecil Small shot Tippit with his long-barreled .38,
> that would explain why he did not contact the Dallas Police about
> having picked up Oswald."
>
> So let me get this straight: Small didn't contact the police because
> maybe he shot Tippit? But Small did tell family members all about it
> and did talk to the FBI about the incident? And of course, Small had
> no motive for shooting Tippit. And there's no evidence Small shot
> Tippit, whereas the shells recovered at the scene matched Oswald's
> gun. And don't even think to suggest that Small gave the gun back to
> Oswald after the shooting; as why would Small shoot Tippit, and why
> would Oswald accept the gun back? You can conjecture all you want, but
> all you really have is a guy telling a story.
>
> If somebody gunned down a cop in your presence, would you take the gun
> and flee? If you were an innocent man, and stopped for questioning by
> an officer of the law, would you pull out a gun and shoot him dead, or
> just answer his questions?
>
> Sheez. The lengths you conspiracy people go to try to absolve Oswald
> of the crimes is truly over the top.
>
> Your scenario is unbelievable. For a believable scenario, consult the
> Warren Report.
>
> Hank

You raise some good points. I probably should have filed the article I
received anonymously in my waste paper basket and not contacted Small's
niece. I have to admit I got carried away in my speculation. Btw, the
woman who interviewed Small (which is available from the JFK archives) was
a psychology instructor at a college in Raleigh and was working on a book
about the assassination. However, her house burned down and with it all
her work on the subject. I refuse to speculate that the fire was
intentionally set. - Peter R. Whitmey

[Bud]

On Mar 31, 10:39 pm, Anthony Marsh <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 3/30/2012 3:24 PM, Bud wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mar 30, 1:29 am, Anthony Marsh<anthony.ma...@comcast.net>  wrote:
> >> On 3/29/2012 1:07 AM, Bud wrote:
>
> >>> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com>    wrote:
> >>>> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> >>>> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> >>>> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> >>>> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> >>>> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> >>>> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> >>>> regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> >>>> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
> >>>> article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>
> >>>> - prwhitmey
>
> >>>     I think the right question is where was the nearest bus or train
> >>> that would take Oswald to Walker`s neighborhood in Dallas.
>
> >> Train? What if the nearest bus was in Dealey Plaza? What good would that
> >> do?
>
> >    None, if he didn`t have his handgun.
>
> Why does he need a revolver to take the train?

Who said he did?

> What's he going to do,
> hijack the train to Cuba?

If his lucky streak continued that he might have tried to hijack a
plane, but only after killing Walker.

> Oh, you mean like taking the revolver on his
> trip to Mexico and visiting the Soviet Embassy?
>
> >> If his goal was only to kill Walker he could have told the cab
> >> driver to wait for him, run in to get the revolver and then taken the
> >> cab to Walker's house.
>
> >    He didn`t even want to risk having the cab drop him at the
> > boardinghouse, you know that.
>
> That's why he went past the boarding house to see if it was being staked
> out. That's why I got off the bus one stop beyond my apartment when we
> were on strike to see if the hired thugs had staked it out. They had and I
> got in the back way from another apartment and they didn't even know I was
> there.

Probably because they weren`t even there. Do you still sometimes
think they might be?

[Bud]

No, they hated him too.

[Anthony Marsh]

On 4/1/2012 8:48 AM, Bud wrote:
> On Mar 31, 10:39 pm, Anthony Marsh<anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 3/30/2012 3:24 PM, Bud wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Mar 30, 1:29 am, Anthony Marsh<anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>> On 3/29/2012 1:07 AM, Bud wrote:
>>
>>>>> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
>>>>>> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
>>>>>> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
>>>>>> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
>>>>>> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
>>>>>> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
>>>>>> regularly ate, btw.)?
>>
>>>>>> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
>>>>>> article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>>
>>>>>> - prwhitmey
>>
>>>>> I think the right question is where was the nearest bus or train
>>>>> that would take Oswald to Walker`s neighborhood in Dallas.
>>
>>>> Train? What if the nearest bus was in Dealey Plaza? What good would that
>>>> do?
>>
>>> None, if he didn`t have his handgun.
>>
>> Why does he need a revolver to take the train?
>
> Who said he did?
>

You did. You said he wanted to go home and get his revolver and then
take a train to Walker's house.

>> What's he going to do,
>> hijack the train to Cuba?
>
> If his lucky streak continued that he might have tried to hijack a
> plane, but only after killing Walker.
>

Maybe he'd try to hijack a bus to Cuba under your theory.

>> Oh, you mean like taking the revolver on his
>> trip to Mexico and visiting the Soviet Embassy?
>>
>>>> If his goal was only to kill Walker he could have told the cab
>>>> driver to wait for him, run in to get the revolver and then taken the
>>>> cab to Walker's house.
>>
>>> He didn`t even want to risk having the cab drop him at the
>>> boardinghouse, you know that.
>>
>> That's why he went past the boarding house to see if it was being staked
>> out. That's why I got off the bus one stop beyond my apartment when we
>> were on strike to see if the hired thugs had staked it out. They had and I
>> got in the back way from another apartment and they didn't even know I was
>> there.
>
> Probably because they weren`t even there. Do you still sometimes
> think they might be?
>

They were there and they did not get me.
I am no longer involved in labor strikes. I retired.

[bigdog]

We like to give our assassins the honor of including their middle name
when referring to them. John Booth just doesn't have the same ring to it.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 30, 3:23 pm, Anthony Marsh <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 3/30/2012 1:17 AM, Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon) wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mar 29, 9:48 am, Anthony Marsh<anthony.ma...@comcast.net>  wrote:

> >> On 3/28/2012 11:59 PM, Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon) wrote:
>
> >>> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com>    wrote:
> >>>> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> >>>> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> >>>> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> >>>> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> >>>> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> >>>> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> >>>> regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> >>>> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
> >>>> article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>
> >>>> - prwhitmey
>

> >>> You wrote: "(It should be pointed out that there was no photo of
> >>> Oswald published until the following morning, but, of course, he was
> >>> shown on live television numerous times.)"
>
> >>> There was a morning paper (Dallas Morning News) and an evening paper
> >>> (Dallas Times Herald) in Dallas in those days.
>
> >>> Perhaps the evening paper had a photo of Oswald?
>
> >>> Hank
>
> >> Fun to guess, isn't it? Don't get your fingernails all dirty by looking
> >> through dusty old newspapers.
> >> Now, if you are going to make up some hokey theory about the all knowing
> >> conspiracy then shouldn't they have published his photo BEFORE the
> >> assassination?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > Not my theory there was some all-knowing conspiracy.
> > Perhaps you meant to address this to Peter?
> > It's his article. He should have researched this, doncha think?
>
> Just trying to help you.
> Since you think publishing Oswald's photo immediately after the shooting
> would have been helpful.
> Again my point stands. You refuse to do any research.- Hide quoted text -
>

Again, NOT MY ARTICLE.
If the guy (Peter Whitmey) who wrote the article wants to support his
claims, you might want to tell him to do the research, not me.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 30, 3:23 pm, Anthony Marsh <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:

> On 3/30/2012 1:34 AM, Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon) wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mar 28, 11:50 pm, "pjspe...@AOL.COM"<pjspe...@AOL.COM>  wrote:
> >> On Mar 28, 8:54 am, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com>  wrote:

>
> >>> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> >>> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> >>> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> >>> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> >>> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> >>> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> >>> regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> >>> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
> >>> article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>
> >>> - prwhitmey
>

> >> He was going to Ruby's apartment.
>
> > And he needed the bus transfer why?
>
> > Any idea?
>

> He didn't need it. It was given out routinely.- Hide quoted text -

He ASKED for the bus transfer. Why did he ask for it?

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

The problem is the rifle would eventually be found, even if it took all
weekend.Whenever it was found, it would be traced to Oswald's PO BOX, and
then to Oswald directly. Oswald could not know how quickly it would be
found, nor how quickly it could be traced to him. Thus, whatever his plan,
time was of the essence. That is why he took the cab PAST his rooming
house (to scope it out to see if the police had arrived yet) and that is
why he only spent a few minutes inside, grabbing his revolver and a
jacket.

Wherever he was going afterward, it included plans for a bus trip, as he
asked for and received a bus transfer in his earlier travels that day.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 30, 3:28 pm, "James K. Olmstead" <jolmst...@neo.rr.com> wrote:
> "Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)" <hsienz...@Aol.com> wrote in messagenews:f33acec9-b3d8-4c10...@i18g2000vbx.googlegroups.com...

So your theory is, if I understand this correctly, an innocent man
decided he was being framed for the murder of the president, and
instead of turning himself in to the DPD and cooperating, decided
instead to go shoot the man he believed responsible for framing him?

Do I have that right?

How did Lee know who was responsible? How did LHO know he was being
framed? On what evidence he had available to him at the time?

And you say this is just like Ruby, but Ruby wasn't attempting to
shoot Oswald to avenge his framing, Ruby shot Oswald to avenge the
shooting of the President.

You also make an unsourced, totally undocumented claim that "he got
(out of the cab) where he did to see if he could see a specific car
parked in front of a house on Neely (Street)"
I would ask for the evidence for that, but it's a total aside, as is
your entire mention of Thomas Peasner and his rifles.


Hank

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 31, 12:12 am, Hans Trayne <trayn...@gmail.com> wrote:

I don't think so. The timing was such that it would have been tight
getting Oswald to the second floor and into the lunch room just in time
for Baker to get there. At the time of the final shot, Baker was still on
Houston, and he only gunned his engine after that final shot. By the time
Baker gets in front of the TSBD, the gunman was gone from the window,
according to witnesses. Nobody said the gunman lingered in the window that
long. So Oswald's plan was to hide the rifle, delaying its discovery,
while he went back to the roominghouse to get the revolver. On the way,
thinking on the fly, he has enough sense to ask for a bus transfer -
clearly, because he has plans to take another bus in the near future (the
transfer is only good for a couple of hours from the time it is issued).

> LHO had no way of
> knowing how many DPD and others would enter the building and what kind of
> search would be conducted. He might have felt the officers would quickly
> search for an armed person and leave when none was found.
>
> The rifle hidden between the boxes is what would tie LHO to the crime,
> regardless if DPD or his boss or co-workers discovered it. Without the
> rifle in the hands of law authorities LHO could easily slip out of any
> accusation to the crime. I suspect had the rifle not been found LHO would
> have returned to work Monday as if nothing that happened concerned him and
> slipped the weapon out of the building then (if not sooner during the
> weekend).
>
> I have read theories that LHO armed his person and was going after someone
> who double crossed him. That, like all the countless other theories have
> not been proven and the double-crosser has not gone public as of this

> date, 2012.- Hide quoted text -
>

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

> snowball's chance in hell of getttng away with it.- Hide quoted text -
>
> Exactly why I feel he felt he had nothing to lose by shooting Walker that weekend as well.
"They can only fry you once."

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

Absurd suggestions.

The rifle is the key piece of evidence linking Oswald to the crime.
Without the rifle the police don't even have Oswald as a suspect.

Why would they do any of the above against Oswald, instead of Frazier
or Truly, or Billy Lovelady, for example?

You also forget that Marina could not testify against her husband at
any trial, so your final suggestion above is a non-starter.

>
> > have returned to work Monday as if nothing that happened concerned him and
> > slipped the weapon out of the building then (if not sooner during the
> > weekend).
>
> > I have read theories that LHO armed his person and was going after someone
> > who double crossed him. That, like all the countless other theories have
> > not been proven and the double-crosser has not gone public as of this
> > date, 2012.
>
> Hmm, that would assume that he knew who was framing him.

> Not just some generic government office.- Hide quoted text -
>

It also assumes he was being framed.
More likely, he knew exactly who shot the president, because that guy
was Oswald.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

> out. ...

Exactly. So he couldn't tell the cab driver to wait at the roominghouse
for him to come back out for the very reason that he had to take it beyond
the roominghouse and walk back.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

> Warren Report." - prwhitmey- Hide quoted text -
>

Again, wouldn't even that be more than a tad misleading?

Especially since the Warren Commission had no way of knowing a damn
thing about Small, since he never reported his alleged 'sighting" of
Oswald to the police at any time?

Were the Warren Commissioners expected to be mind-readers?

Hank

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

> intentionally set.  - Peter R. Whitmey- Hide quoted text -
>
>

lol. But you didn't hesitate to mention it here. If you don't find it
pertinent, why'd you mention the woman who interviewed Small? Clearly,
Small lived a long time and didn't die a mysterious death. I guess
mentioning the house fire is the next best thing you got.

Hank

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

But this was on the day of the assassination that he met Oswald, not
years later.
You are saying that Small might be adding details to something that
wasn't there originally?
I agree wholeheartedly. I find the entire story incredible -
especially the part where he doesn't come forward for years.
And never does report it to the police.

>
> > Oswald didn't carry any books on the bus, nor was he seen with books when
> > confronted by Baker and Truly on the second floor of the TSBD just after
> > the shooting. Oswald had no books at the theatre. So what happened to
> > these books? Were any recovered from Oswald's room at the roominghouse?
>
> Oswald did check out numerous books from the library, the last of
> which possibly were found at the roominghouse.  Being a loner and a
> bookworm, it's possible he read during his lunch and coffee breaks at
> the TSBD.
>
>

Not the question. I asked about any evidence Oswald had any books with
him *that day* - as stated to in the story told by Small.
Especially on the bus or when he entered his roominghouse.
The story you cite reeks of being made entirely out of whole cloth.
I really find it hard to believe you find any of it credible.

[Bud]

On Apr 1, 6:16 pm, "Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)"

It`s a good question that probably can`t be answered for sure. Heres two
thoughts... It didn`t hurt to have it. Oswald really didn`t know what the
situation was and might be willing to board any bus in any direction to
get him from the area. Better to have it and not need it than have a use
for it and not have it. The other is a bit crafty, the woman who got off
was trying to make her way to the airport. I`m sure if she was stopped she
would offer the transfer as evidence she was on the bus. Oswald could use
it in much the same way, and if he was stopped he would be able to say "I
just got off that bus, ask that lady, she got off when I did. Heres my
transfer".

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

Oswald wasn't arrested because there was an APB on him.
Oswald was arrested because he was suspected of shooting a police
officer.
On the other hand, once Givens was found and brought in for
questioning, it soon became clear there was no evidence implicating
Givens in either crime, and Givens was released.
Not so for Oswald. The more evidence came in, the more it implicated
Oswald. And Oswald didn't help his cause any by lying in custody.

Hank

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 31, 9:59 pm, Anthony Marsh <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 3/31/2012 12:12 AM, Hans Trayne wrote:
>
>
>
> > The rifle hidden between the boxes is what would tie LHO to the crime,
>
> How could the rifle possibly tie Oswald to the crime? He had bought it
> under an alias and the DPD was too stupid to figure that out.

Duh, maybe because it was shipped to his PO BOX?
They could figure out the owner from that alone.
Maybe because photos were found later that tied him to the rifle?
And maybe because the fragments found in the limo (and the nearly
whole bullet found at Parkland) were ballistically traceable to that
rifle, to the exclusion of all other weapons in the world?

But before any of that occurred, they visited the Paine residence on
the afternoon of the assassination - and found that the rifle,
normally hidden in the blanket in the Paine garage - was missing from
the blanket.
Let's see if we can figure this out.
We have a blanket missing a rifle belonging to Oswald.
And we have a rifle belonging to Oswald found on the sixth floor.

Coincidence? I think not.

Hank

[Bud]

You are making stuff up. I never said he needed his revolver to take
the train.

>You said he wanted to go home and get his revolver and then
> take a train to Walker's house.

That bears some resemblance to my speculation.

> >> What's he going to do,
> >> hijack the train to Cuba?
>
> >    If his lucky streak continued that he might have tried to hijack a
> > plane, but only after killing Walker.
>
> Maybe he'd try to hijack a bus to Cuba under your theory.

You think there are buses that go to Cuba?

> >> Oh, you mean like taking the revolver on his
> >> trip to Mexico and visiting the Soviet Embassy?
>
> >>>> If his goal was only to kill Walker he could have told the cab
> >>>> driver to wait for him, run in to get the revolver and then taken the
> >>>> cab to Walker's house.
>
> >>>     He didn`t even want to risk having the cab drop him at the
> >>> boardinghouse, you know that.
>
> >> That's why he went past the boarding house to see if it was being staked
> >> out. That's why I got off the bus one stop beyond my apartment when we
> >> were on strike to see if the hired thugs had staked it out. They had and I
> >> got in the back way from another apartment and they didn't even know I was
> >> there.
>
> >    Probably because they weren`t even there. Do you still sometimes
> > think they might be?
>
> They were there and they did not get me.
> I am no longer involved in labor strikes. I retired.

Do you still find yourself looking out for them?

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 31, 9:56 pm, Anthony Marsh <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:

> On 3/31/2012 10:22 AM, Hans Trayne wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mar 30, 2:27 pm, bigdog<jecorbett1...@yahoo.com>  wrote:
> >> On Mar 30, 1:16 am, "Reserch"<questio...@hotmail.com>  wrote:
>
> >>> "bigdog"<jecorbett1...@yahoo.com>  wrote in message
>
> >>>news:f1261f31-4fbd-496a...@n19g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...

> >>> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com>  wrote:
>
> >>>> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> >>>> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> >>>> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> >>>> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> >>>> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> >>>> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> >>>> regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> >>>> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
> >>>> article "The Allegations of Cecil Small"
> >>>> athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>
> >>>> - prwhitmey
>

> >>> Only Oswald knew where he was going and why. Since he didn't tell us that,
> >>> we will never know. Tippit might have asked him that and we know where
> >>> that got him. We're left to play guessing games.
>
> >>> He was waiting on the DPD to transport him. Mrs. Roberts did not say he
> >>> got on a bus. She said he was at the bus stop waiting. And she saw and
> >>> heard a DPD patrol car near the drive way. But didn't say Oswald she saw
> >>> him get into it. But a nosey old woman would have waited to see what the
> >>> patrol car was waiting for. Or if they had picked up Oswald. The police
> >>> and the FBI left out what parts of her statements that didn't match the
> >>> alone theory.
>
> >> A fine example of runaway speculation. You have nothing to support
> >> your silly assumption that Oswald was waiting for the DPD to pick him
> >> up. If that were true, why would he wait only a few seconds for them
> >> before taking off on foot? Why would he have even left the house until
> >> he saw them arrive? The only way this would have made any sense would
> >> be if the police car had stopped in front of his house, honked the
> >> horn, and Oswald came out and got in the car. But that isn't what
> >> happened. We know Oswald was on foot when TIppit confronted him.
> >> Imagination has always been a substitute for evidence in CT World.
>
> >> Nobody left out Earlene Roberts statement. The WC included it. They
> >> just didn't leap to your silly assumption that Oswald was waiting for
> >> a ride from the DPD.
>

> > LHO might have gotten some sympathy from DPD if he had told them he got
> > scared after the assassination and went&  got his pistol because he was
> > afraid the shooter was still in the building (he should have omitted the
>
> Silly. An armed cop stopped him. If the shooter was still there the
> armed cop would get him.
>
> > 'work was finished for the day' stuff and claimed he was returning to
> > work). Something like that. I don't buy it and I doubt DPD would have
>
> There was no further work to return to.
>
> > bought it either with an officer lying dead by his squad car as a result
> > of LHO's pistol. Besides lying about the rifle being his, he never gave
> > DPD an explaination why he was armed when arrested at the theatre.
>
> Yes, he did. He said you know how us Texas boys are about our guns.

Nope. Oswald was from New Orleans, not Texas. The Texas part is a
figment of your imagination.
He never said what you claim above.

And, besides, that's not an explanation.
That's like a five-year-old saying "I broke the vase because I felt
like it" - it doesn't explain a damn thing.

Hank

[James K. Olmstead]

"Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)" <hsie...@Aol.com> wrote in message
news:e8101768-56aa-4876...@l7g2000vbw.googlegroups.com...

Not really. It's clear that Oswald was involved in events, so he was not
"innocent" of any wrong doing or involvement.

How did Lee know who was responsible? How did LHO know he was being
framed? On what evidence he had available to him at the time?

In the line of speculation...he would know who he was associated with.
He knew he would be framed, since it was in fact his rifle. He had alot
of "knowledge" of what he was doing and that "at the time" was all he had
to go on. His intent is the issue and nobody can decide what he intent
was.

And you say this is just like Ruby, but Ruby wasn't attempting to shoot
Oswald to avenge his framing, Ruby shot Oswald to avenge the shooting of
the President.

Don't you think that Oswald could be in the same frame of mind. Perhaps
Lee wanted to avenge the killer as well, or at least protect himself in
doing so.

You also make an unsourced, totally undocumented claim that "he got (out
of the cab) where he did to see if he could see a specific car parked in
front of a house on Neely (Street)" I would ask for the evidence for that,
but it's a total aside, as is your entire mention of Thomas Peasner and
his rifles.

It's not "a total aside" it is critical to the known actions. There were
two disgruntled Marxists with rifles in Dallas on Nov 22. Each with
backgrounds that "relate" (Military defections) and there is a solid
chance, although I admit that the house mentioned is not "confirmed"
belonging to or was associated to a U.S. Army, intelligence officer, who
was in Dealy Plaza at the time of the shooting and known to be "inside"
the TSBD afterwards.

jko


Hank

[bigdog]

On Mar 30, 3:28 pm, "James K. Olmstead" <jolmst...@neo.rr.com> wrote:
>
> To add to the speculation....What if Lee, while on the bus decided to act
> against somebody for the actions, he knew he would
> be blamed for, got a transfer, got off the bus, went to an area in the clear
> of traffic (bus station), caught a cab to his rooming house, got his gun
> and headed to "get" the man responsible, much like Ruby did later against
> Oswald, because Lee knew he would be arrested and be the "Patsy" for the
> crime,
> using the "transfer" to do so.  BTW he got of  where he did to see if he
> could see a specific car parked in front of a house on Neely.
>

> jko

There's been plenty of speculation in this thread already, so I'll
just focus on this one. If Oswald was innocent, why would he think
within minutes of the assassination that he was going to be set up as
the fall guy? What would he have known that would have told him to
leave the building? Why wouldn't he be just as bewildered at what had
happened as everyone else in the TSBD? If he was telling the truth
about what he was doing at the time of the shooting, how would he even
know the President had been shot? Why would he think he would be the
prime suspect? This theory has a lot of blanks to fill in.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Mar 31, 9:56 pm, Anthony Marsh <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 3/31/2012 10:22 AM, Hans Trayne wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mar 30, 2:27 pm, bigdog<jecorbett1...@yahoo.com>  wrote:
> >> On Mar 30, 1:16 am, "Reserch"<questio...@hotmail.com>  wrote:
>
> >>> "bigdog"<jecorbett1...@yahoo.com>  wrote in message
>
> >>>news:f1261f31-4fbd-496a...@n19g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...

> >>> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com>  wrote:

>
> >>>> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
> >>>> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
> >>>> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
> >>>> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
> >>>> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
> >>>> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
> >>>> regularly ate, btw.)?
>
> >>>> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
> >>>> article "The Allegations of Cecil Small"
> >>>> athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>
> >>>> - prwhitmey
>

> > Like I wrote earlier, LHO's actions suggest he didn't have a plan on what
> > to do after he shot at JFK. Unlike the Walker shooter where police were
> > not immediately on the scene, in the assassination aftermath a DPD officer
> > (Baker) rushed into the building in a matter of seconds after the final
> > shot. I don't believe LHO had made allowances for this and it messed up
>
> Yes, seconds. How many? How many minutes did it take for the police to
> arrive at Walker's house or the church goers to coming running out of
> the church when they heard a shot?
>
> > whatever he had planned to do to break down his rifle and hide it
> > somewhere where officers would not find it (carton of books or large
> > shipping boxes). We know he had the weapon stashed somewhere that was not
> > noticed prior to the shooting, it's after the shooting where the weapon is
> > discovered.
>
> If he had a plan he could have put the rifle in a box and shipped it to
> China.
>
>

Except that would delay his getaway from the TSBD, maybe leaving him
sealed in the TSBD while they searched it. If he had a plan, then his plan
included going back to the roominghouse and getting the revolver (since
that is what he did). Any impediments to that plan would not be part of
his plan.

And the rifle would still be in the building. Unless you think the
shipping dept in the TSBD was back to work that afternoon? So your silly
suggestion does nothing but delay Oswald's escape from the building.

Which clearly is why Oswald didn't bother to do that.

Hank

[Anthony Marsh]

On 4/1/2012 7:29 PM, Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon) wrote:
> On Mar 31, 9:59 pm, Anthony Marsh<anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 3/31/2012 12:12 AM, Hans Trayne wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> The rifle hidden between the boxes is what would tie LHO to the crime,
>>
>> How could the rifle possibly tie Oswald to the crime? He had bought it
>> under an alias and the DPD was too stupid to figure that out.
>
> Duh, maybe because it was shipped to his PO BOX?

And how many days would it take the DPD to figure that out? Oswald could
have been in Russia by then.

> They could figure out the owner from that alone.

It didn't help when they found his Hidell ID in his wallet.

> Maybe because photos were found later that tied him to the rifle?

If and only if the DPD were smart enough to ID the rifle in the photos as
HIS rifle to the exclusion of all the other rifles in the world. They
could not. Only the HSCA was smart enough to do that.

> And maybe because the fragments found in the limo (and the nearly
> whole bullet found at Parkland) were ballistically traceable to that
> rifle, to the exclusion of all other weapons in the world?
>

They should be if someone used his rifle to commit the assassination.

> But before any of that occurred, they visited the Paine residence on
> the afternoon of the assassination - and found that the rifle,
> normally hidden in the blanket in the Paine garage - was missing from
> the blanket.
> Let's see if we can figure this out.
> We have a blanket missing a rifle belonging to Oswald.
> And we have a rifle belonging to Oswald found on the sixth floor.
>
> Coincidence? I think not.
>

Could have been stolen.

> Hank
>

[Anthony Marsh]

On 4/1/2012 7:29 PM, Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon) wrote:

The point was that they were looking for a suspect in the shooting, not
specifically for Oswald.

> On the other hand, once Givens was found and brought in for
> questioning, it soon became clear there was no evidence implicating
> Givens in either crime, and Givens was released.

In fact they didn't want given for any crime. They wanted to question
him as a primary witness.

> Not so for Oswald. The more evidence came in, the more it implicated
> Oswald. And Oswald didn't help his cause any by lying in custody.
>

As it came in. Not immediately. And it didn't help the cops case to lie
about what Oswald said. The case could have been thrown out of court.
It didn't help the cops case to try to frame OJ Simpson. It ruined it.


> Hank
>

[Anthony Marsh]

Silly. He could have told the cab drive to wait right there for him and
checked to see if the police were already at the rooming house and if so
go back to the cab and tell him to drive to Mexico.

[Anthony Marsh]

Not quite. The police put out an APB on a suspect identified in the
window and armed with a .30-06. They were looking for a suspect not for
Oswald.

> Why would they do any of the above against Oswald, instead of Frazier
> or Truly, or Billy Lovelady, for example?
>

They were not looking for Oswald that soon.

> You also forget that Marina could not testify against her husband at
> any trial, so your final suggestion above is a non-starter.
>

It is not a matter of COULD NOT TESTIFY. It is COULD NOT BE FORCED TO
TESTIFY.

[Anthony Marsh]

>> Baker& arming his person suggests to me he was the shooter. Had he had

>> his pistol with him I have no doubt in my mind Baker would have died
>> before Tippit did. I wonder if LHO saw Baker dismount his motorcycle and
>> run in to the TSBD and if this is what prompted him to didtch the rifle
>> and get his butt off the 6th floor. It's possible. LHO had no way of
>> knowing how many DPD and others would enter the building and what kind of
>> search would be conducted. He might have felt the officers would quickly
>> search for an armed person and leave when none was found.
>>
>> The rifle hidden between the boxes is what would tie LHO to the crime,
>> regardless if DPD or his boss or co-workers discovered it. Without the
>> rifle in the hands of law authorities LHO could easily slip out of any
>> accusation to the crime. I suspect had the rifle not been found LHO would
>> have returned to work Monday as if nothing that happened concerned him and
>> slipped the weapon out of the building then (if not sooner during the
>> weekend).
>>
>> I have read theories that LHO armed his person and was going after someone
>> who double crossed him. That, like all the countless other theories have
>> not been proven and the double-crosser has not gone public as of this
>> date, 2012.
>
> The problem is the rifle would eventually be found, even if it took all
> weekend.Whenever it was found, it would be traced to Oswald's PO BOX, and
> then to Oswald directly. Oswald could not know how quickly it would be
> found, nor how quickly it could be traced to him. Thus, whatever his plan,

Then why would he even bother trying to hide it?

> time was of the essence. That is why he took the cab PAST his rooming
> house (to scope it out to see if the police had arrived yet) and that is
> why he only spent a few minutes inside, grabbing his revolver and a
> jacket.
>
> Wherever he was going afterward, it included plans for a bus trip, as he
> asked for and received a bus transfer in his earlier travels that day.
>

Maybe, maybe not. Maybe he just got the transfer routinely.

[Anthony Marsh]

Force of habit.

[Anthony Marsh]

Again, my point stands. You refuse to do any research. I am not
interested in Whitmey's theories.
YOU were the one who speculated that maybe Oswald's photo was in the
newspaper. You have no way to find out for yourself.

[Anthony Marsh]

On 4/1/2012 6:09 PM, bigdog wrote:
> On Mar 31, 10:51 pm, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> On Mar 28, 8:58 pm, "Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)"

>>
>>
>>
>> <hsienz...@Aol.com> wrote:
>>> On Mar 28, 11:54 am, Canuck<prwhit...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> Has any researcher or writer ever come up with an explanation for why
>>>> Oswald, upon leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00 pm, decided
>>>> to walk to the area in Oak Cliff where J.D. Tippit was murdered
>>>> (shortly before 1:12, when the next bus going downtown was scheduled
>>>> to reach 10th and Patton, which eyewitness Helen Markham was planning
>>>> to take to her job at the Eat Well restaurant - where Ruby and Craford
>>>> regularly ate, btw.)?
>>
>>>> Perhaps he was planning to meet up with Cecil Lee Small (see my
>>>> article "The Allegations of Cecil Small" athttp://www.kenrahn.com/JFK/The_critics/Whitmey/Small.html.)
>>
>>>> - prwhitmey
>>

>>> Quoting from your article: "Small pulled over to ask directions from a
>>> young man carrying some books, who was walking down Main St. The
>>> pedestrian assured Small that he was going the right way, and at the same
>>> time, asked for a ride, introducing himself as 'Lee Harvey Oswald.' "
>>
>>> Oswald never referred to himself as "Lee Harvey Oswald", Just "Lee
>>> Oswald". Do you give your middle name to strangers when introducing
>>> yourself? I don't.
>>
>> That had occurred to me too. However, he was interviewed about this
>> event years later, and by then Oswald was usually referred to as "Lee
>> Harvey Oswald", not "Lee Oswald", just as MLK's convicted killer is
>> referred to as "James Earl Ray" not "James Ray".
>>

>>> Oswald didn't carry any books on the bus, nor was he seen with books when
>>> confronted by Baker and Truly on the second floor of the TSBD just after
>>> the shooting. Oswald had no books at the theatre. So what happened to
>>> these books? Were any recovered from Oswald's room at the roominghouse?
>>
>> Oswald did check out numerous books from the library, the last of
>> which possibly were found at the roominghouse. Being a loner and a
>> bookworm, it's possible he read during his lunch and coffee breaks at
>> the TSBD.
>>
>

> We like to give our assassins the honor of including their middle name
> when referring to them. John Booth just doesn't have the same ring to it.
>
>


It's traditional to refer to criminals with their full names to avoid
confusing them with innocent people who share the same first and last
names.

[Anthony Marsh]

Oswald didn't do anything because he didn't have a plan because he
didn't need one.

[Anthony Marsh]

Mrs. Reid told him the President had been shot. All Oswald wanted to do
was drink a Coke.

[Anthony Marsh]

It's clear that Alfred Dreyfus was involved in intelligence, so I guess
that makes it ok to frame him too?

>
> How did Lee know who was responsible? How did LHO know he was being
> framed? On what evidence he had available to him at the time?
>

Sometimes the victim does not know the names but knows the organization.

> In the line of speculation...he would know who he was associated with.
> He knew he would be framed, since it was in fact his rifle. He had alot
> of "knowledge" of what he was doing and that "at the time" was all he had
> to go on. His intent is the issue and nobody can decide what he intent
> was.
>
>
> And you say this is just like Ruby, but Ruby wasn't attempting to shoot
> Oswald to avenge his framing, Ruby shot Oswald to avenge the shooting of
> the President.
>

Ridiculous. He was fed that story by his lawyer.

> Don't you think that Oswald could be in the same frame of mind. Perhaps
> Lee wanted to avenge the killer as well, or at least protect himself in
> doing so.
>

Silly. You think Oswald wanted to avenge the President by finding the real
killer? First time I heard that theory. Did you buy this from Judyth?

> You also make an unsourced, totally undocumented claim that "he got (out
> of the cab) where he did to see if he could see a specific car parked in
> front of a house on Neely (Street)" I would ask for the evidence for that,
> but it's a total aside, as is your entire mention of Thomas Peasner and
> his rifles.
>
> It's not "a total aside" it is critical to the known actions. There were
> two disgruntled Marxists with rifles in Dallas on Nov 22. Each with
> backgrounds that "relate" (Military defections) and there is a solid
> chance, although I admit that the house mentioned is not "confirmed"
> belonging to or was associated to a U.S. Army, intelligence officer, who
> was in Dealy Plaza at the time of the shooting and known to be "inside"
> the TSBD afterwards.
>

Name the two disgruntled Marxists.

> jko
>
>
> Hank
>
>
>

[Anthony Marsh]

I am just telling you the excuse that Oswald gave to Fritz.

[Anthony Marsh]

No, why should they still be paid by the company after the strike is
long over? They are hired as needed.

[James K. Olmstead]

"bigdog" <jecorb...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:e8906a22-248d-4839...@w5g2000yqi.googlegroups.com...

On Mar 30, 3:28 pm, "James K. Olmstead" <jolmst...@neo.rr.com> wrote:
>
> To add to the speculation....What if Lee, while on the bus decided to act
> against somebody for the actions, he knew he would
> be blamed for, got a transfer, got off the bus, went to an area in the
> clear
> of traffic (bus station), caught a cab to his rooming house, got his gun
> and headed to "get" the man responsible, much like Ruby did later against
> Oswald, because Lee knew he would be arrested and be the "Patsy" for the
> crime,
> using the "transfer" to do so. BTW he got of where he did to see if he
> could see a specific car parked in front of a house on Neely.
>
> jko

There's been plenty of speculation in this thread already, so I'll
just focus on this one. If Oswald was innocent, why would he think
within minutes of the assassination that he was going to be set up as
the fall guy?

Oswald is involved....but perhaps he is not the killer of JFK.

What would he have known that would have told him to
leave the building?

Something went wrong....nobody was supposed to die to his knowledge.

Why wouldn't he be just as bewildered at what had
happened as everyone else in the TSBD?

Because he was involved in the event planned.

If he was telling the truth
about what he was doing at the time of the shooting, how would he even
know the President had been shot?

Baker and Truly. Which brings up a point. Let me ask you a question. If
Oswald
was the shooter, how did he know that nobody was in the lunch room? He's
seen
coming out of it with a drink seconds after the shooting. If he ran down
the stairs
and into the lunchroom to hide how could he be sure nobody would see him do
so?
How would he explain his actions to anybody sitting in the lunch room as he
ran in?

Why would he think he would be the
prime suspect? This theory has a lot of blanks to fill in.

It's his rifle for one....he is part of what he thinks is "an incident"
where nobody gets
hurt but shots are fired. Oswald is a known street demonstrator associated
with Cuba.

Consider the arguement between JFK and LBJ the night before, LBJ's actions
in the
motorcade and JFK's own words about being shot from a building that mornng.
LBJ
who was out of the loop is upset.

The "incident" would lead to the "Second Planned Invasion of Cuba" as "Legal
Cover"
to do so. Somebody in on things was working in reality for Che (my honest
opinion).

JFK/LBJ would be taken to LBJ's ranch, where a new communication center had
been
built and the invasion of Cuba would begin. The Second Naval Armada was
primed and
ready just waiting for the word to act.

This plot, is based on RFK's faked kidnap plot of JFK's kids days before the
BOP's.
Four Cubans were involved in that plot and never charged. This
"speculation" is based
on consideration of why RFK felt guilty about JFK's death.

jko

[Bud]

Not every time someone imagines they are being followed they are.
This would apply after the strike as well as during it.

[markusp]

On Sunday, April 1, 2012 6:29:14 PM UTC-5, Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon) wrote:

> And Oswald didn't help his cause any by lying in custody.

Specifically, what lies did Oswald tell while in custody? From the few
hieroglyphic notes taken by Fritz, apparently the rule of relying on the
memories of those persons interrogating him should be met with at least as
much skepticism as any other discounted eyewitness.

Frankly, we cannot ever be certain of Oswald's truthfulness while in DPD
custody, not only because he's dead, but also because the DPD had just
experienced the tragic loss of one of their own.

~Mark

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

And James will never be able to fill them in. Like all CT's, all he's
got is speculation.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

On Apr 1, 10:25 pm, Anthony Marsh <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 4/1/2012 7:29 PM, Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon) wrote:
>
> > On Mar 31, 9:59 pm, Anthony Marsh<anthony.ma...@comcast.net>  wrote:
> >> On 3/31/2012 12:12 AM, Hans Trayne wrote:
>
> >>> The rifle hidden between the boxes is what would tie LHO to the crime,
>
> >> How could the rifle possibly tie Oswald to the crime? He had bought it
> >> under an alias and the DPD was too stupid to figure that out.
>
> > Duh, maybe because it was shipped to his PO BOX?
>
> And how many days would it take the DPD to figure that out? Oswald could
> have been in Russia by then.

It was traced to the PO box over the weekend of the assassination.
You are changing your tune. You originally questioned how the rifle
could possibly tie him to the crime, "How could the rifle possibly tie
Oswald to the crime?" is what you asked.
Now that's been answered, you want to commit a logical fallacy and
move the goalposts, and say he could be in Russia by then.

Nope, that is wrong too.

Oswald couldn't be in Russia by then because he didn't have a valid
visa for Russian.

>
> > They could figure out the owner from that alone.
>
> It didn't help when they found his Hidell ID in his wallet.

Not sure of your point. They found both his own and the phony ID in

his wallet.


>
> > Maybe because photos were found later that tied him to the rifle?
>
> If and only if the DPD were smart enough to ID the rifle in the photos as
> HIS rifle to the exclusion of all the other rifles in the world. They
> could not. Only the HSCA was smart enough to do that.

My point was that Oswald owned a rifle, and denied same in custody.
The photos show him in possession of a rifle.

>
> > And maybe because the fragments found in the limo (and the nearly
> > whole bullet found at Parkland) were ballistically traceable to that
> > rifle, to the exclusion of all other weapons in the world?
>
> They should be if someone used his rifle to commit the assassination.

The evidence indicates someone (OSWALD) did use his rifle to commit
the assassination. Your point is meaningless - unless you are
speculating that someone other than Oswald used the rifle. You have no
evidence of that, it is speculation only.

>
> > But before any of that occurred, they visited the Paine residence on
> > the afternoon of the assassination - and found that the rifle,
> > normally hidden in the blanket in the Paine garage - was missing from
> > the blanket.
> > Let's see if we can figure this out.
> > We have a blanket missing a rifle belonging to Oswald.
> > And we have a rifle belonging to Oswald found on the sixth floor.
>
> > Coincidence? I think not.
>
> Could have been stolen.

More Speculation - move to strike.
Doesn't advance the argument any.

>
>
>
> > Hank- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

Yep, and all roads led to Oswald. My point exactly. So why precisely
did you bring up the misdirection of Givens?

>
> > On the other hand, once Givens was found and brought in for
> > questioning, it soon became clear there was no evidence implicating
> > Givens in either crime, and Givens was released.
>
> In fact they didn't want given for any crime. They wanted to question
> him as a primary witness.

I did not say he was wanted for either crime. I said he was brought in
for questioning.
Your point isn't significant.

>
> > Not so for Oswald. The more evidence came in, the more it implicated
> > Oswald. And Oswald didn't help his cause any by lying in custody.
>
> As it came in. Not immediately. And it didn't help the cops case to lie
> about what Oswald said. The case could have been thrown out of court.
> It didn't help the cops case to try to frame OJ Simpson. It ruined it.

You are simply assuming what you have to prove.

Again, this has nothing to do with the point I raised.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

> go back to the cab and tell him to drive to Mexico.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

And Whaley wouldn't want to know why he drove a block or two past the
roominghouse and walked back?

While Oswald was in the roominghouse, Whaley could call his dispatcher
and say "I've got a guy acting suspiciously" (Whaley had already noted
the sirens when he was back at the bus station).

Could Oswald risk walking back to the cab and have Whaley deliver him
right to the police, because he was told the President just got shot?

I think Oswald wouldn't risk it, because he couldn't know what Whaley
would think or do while he was out of the cab.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

That has nothing to do with your original suggestions above that I
categorized as absurd.

>
> > Why would they do any of the above against Oswald, instead of Frazier
> > or Truly, or Billy Lovelady, for example?
>
> They were not looking for Oswald that soon.

Yes, I said that. I said the rifle linked him to the crime. You originally
questioned that: "How could the rifle possibly tie Oswald to the crime?"
is what you asked.

>
> > You also forget that Marina could not testify against her husband at
> > any trial, so your final suggestion above is a non-starter.
>
> It is not a matter of COULD NOT TESTIFY. It is COULD NOT BE FORCED TO
> TESTIFY.

A distinction without a difference.

>
>
>
>
>
> >>> have returned to work Monday as if nothing that happened concerned him and
> >>> slipped the weapon out of the building then (if not sooner during the
> >>> weekend).
>
> >>> I have read theories that LHO armed his person and was going after someone
> >>> who double crossed him. That, like all the countless other theories have
> >>> not been proven and the double-crosser has not gone public as of this
> >>> date, 2012.
>
> >> Hmm, that would assume that he knew who was framing him.
> >> Not just some generic government office.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > It also assumes he was being framed.
> > More likely, he knew exactly who shot the president, because that guy

> > was Oswald.- Hide quoted text -

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

Because an extra two to five seconds on his part might delay discovery
by an hour or two, giving him more time.
The delay of a few seconds to gain a few hours seems like a valid
tradeoff to me. And probably to Oswald as well.

>
> > time was of the essence. That is why he took the cab PAST his rooming
> > house (to scope it out to see if the police had arrived yet) and that is
> > why he only spent a few minutes inside, grabbing his revolver and a
> > jacket.
>
> > Wherever he was going afterward, it included plans for a bus trip, as he
> > asked for and received a bus transfer in his earlier travels that day.
>
> Maybe, maybe not. Maybe he just got the transfer routinely.

MAYBE? Got any evidence for that? Of course not.

He ASKED for it, and only when he decided to leave the bus. He did not
ask for it when he boarded the bus.
Since he clearly only decided to leave the bus when it got stuck in
traffic, he just as clearly only decided to ask for the transfer at
that time.
Now, the bus transfer is good for one trip on another bus, and only in
the next few hours. Clearly, when he asked for the transfer, he
decided he had some use for it.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

But this isn't about how we refer to Oswald.
It's about how Oswald supposedly introduced himself to Small.
Get back on track.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

> didn't need one.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

He did hide the rifle, Tony.
He did walk away from Dealey Plaza.
He did hop on a bus, get off the bus when it got stuck in traffic, and
took a cab to get to his roominghouse.
He did tell the cab driver an address past his roominghouse.
Clearly he had a plan.
Those are the actions of a mna thinking on his feet.
Not somebody without a plan. If he had no plan, he could have caught
the bust at Houston and Elm.
If he had no plan, he would have stayed on the bus.

He had a plan.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

> was drink a Coke.- Hide quoted text -
>


No, she didn't. You just made that up.
Well, you;ve said that before, so you didn't just make it up - but it
was equally untrue then, as well.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

I was responding to Whitmey's theory. And it was his article that
contained the original speculation.
I simply pointed him in a direction he could find more.

I am not interested in trying to prove Whitmey's theory correct or
incorrect. I think it's absurd on it's face.
It's up to him, not me, to provide documentation to support his
theories.

Get off my back. You have no reason to be calling me because I pointed
out something that might be of value to Peter.

[Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)]

lol.

Show he routinely asked for transfers and didn't use them

You are clearly simply assuming what you need to prove.

[James K. Olmstead]

"Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)" <hsie...@Aol.com> wrote in message

news:ef76f2e2-15c3-4405...@w5g2000vbv.googlegroups.com...

Sorry Joe or Hank, I have more then speculation, like fingerprints not
belonging to Oswald, never identified by offical investigation on key
items of evidence, such as the rifle, bag, box, curtain rods, and JDT's
patrol car. That evidence alone provides much more then most if not all
"published conspiracy theories". Any exculpatory evidence provides
grounds for further consideration of the case, and invalidates the
published WCR conclusions until conflicts are resolved.

jko

[Bud]

On Apr 2, 10:15 pm, "James K. Olmstead" <jolmst...@neo.rr.com> wrote:
> "Hank Sienzant (AKA Joe Zircon)" <hsienz...@Aol.com> wrote in messagenews:ef76f2e2-15c3-4405...@w5g2000vbv.googlegroups.com...

How does Oswald guilt or innocence hinge on him being the only one
to ever touch those items?

> That evidence alone provides much more then most if not all
> "published conspiracy theories".  Any exculpatory evidence provides
> grounds for further consideration of the case,

You`ve produced no "exculpatory evidence".

> and invalidates the
> published WCR conclusions until conflicts are resolved.

Nonsense.

> jko

[Anthony Marsh]

Great, you found Fritz's prints on the rifle. BFD.

[Anthony Marsh]

Not what I said at all. Stop putting words in my mouth.

[Anthony Marsh]

Are you blind? I just quoted Reid's WC testimony:

Mrs. REID. Well, I kept walking and I looked up and Oswald was coming in
the back door of the office. I met him by the time I passed my desk
several feet and I told him, I said, "Oh, the President has been shot, but
maybe they didn't hit him."

He mumbled something to me, I kept walking, he did, too. I didn't pay any
attention to what he said because I had no thoughts of anything of him
having any connection with it at all because he was very calm. He had
gotten a coke and was holding it in his hands and I guess the reason it
impressed me seeing him in there I thought it was a little strange that
one of -the warehouse boys would be up in the office at the time, not that
he had done anything wrong. The only time I had seen him in the office was
to come and get change and he already had his coke in his hand so he
didn't come for change and I dismissed him. I didn't think anything else.

Why is it that you WC defenders never know what's in the Warren Commission
volumes?

[Anthony Marsh]

> He did hide the rifle, Tony.
> He did walk away from Dealey Plaza.
> He did hop on a bus, get off the bus when it got stuck in traffic, and
> took a cab to get to his roominghouse.
> He did tell the cab driver an address past his roominghouse.
> Clearly he had a plan.
> Those are the actions of a mna thinking on his feet.
> Not somebody without a plan. If he had no plan, he could have caught
> the bust at Houston and Elm.
> If he had no plan, he would have stayed on the bus.
>
> He had a plan.
>
>
>

Not much of a plan. Not like the Walker shooting. Not like an escape plan.
If he has stayed on the bus he might be stuck in traffic for hours. What
address did Oswald give to Whaley?

[Anthony Marsh]

You said "We like." You didn't say, "Small said that Oswald said."

[Anthony Marsh]

That's why I said maybe, maybe not.
Don't ask me for evidence when I did not state a fact.

> He ASKED for it, and only when he decided to leave the bus. He did not
> ask for it when he boarded the bus.

Most people do not ask for a transfer when they board the bus. Usually
when they get off the bus.

> Since he clearly only decided to leave the bus when it got stuck in
> traffic, he just as clearly only decided to ask for the transfer at
> that time.
> Now, the bus transfer is good for one trip on another bus, and only in
> the next few hours. Clearly, when he asked for the transfer, he
> decided he had some use for it.
>

Maybe.