More WC Dishonesty
John McAdams
<dav...@removethisglobalnetisp.net> wrote:
>"Ben Holmes" <bnho...@rain.org> wrote in message news:aih0e...@drn.newsguy.com...
>> In article <aifqf...@enews3.newsguy.com>, "Jean says...
>> >
>> >"Ben Holmes" <bnho...@rain.org> wrote in message
>> >news:r37hku8gasm5or641...@4ax.com...
>> >> On 31 Jul 2002 09:22:19 -0700, jer...@my-deja.com (GMcNally) wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >ama...@quik.com (Anthony Marsh)
>> >> >
>> >> >Marsh wrote: "I can believe that she [Walthers] saw something without
>> >> >having to believe everything she said. No, I don't believe the second
>> >> >man was wearing a
>> >> >brown suit coat. Just as I believe that Brennan saw the shooter, but
>> >> >he did not see the man from the waist up because he was standing up."
>> >> >
>> >> >All she saw was a vertical patch of brown - she took that to be a suit
>> >> >coat and assumed a man was in the coat.
>> >> >
>> >> >But she saw only the patch of brown and no head/face, no hands, no
>> >> >nothing.
>> >> >
>> >> >But what she didn't see are boxes - and indeed in the very location
>> >> >she indicated there was a vertical stack of brown boxes.
>> >> >
>> >> >She very obviously saw this stack of boxes and "interpreted" the patch
>> >> >of brown incorrectly.
>> >>
>> >> As I've previously pointed out, while it's *possible* that one witness
>> >> can confuse some boxes with a person - (I don't believe it, I just
>> >> recognize that it's within the realm of possibility) - you are going
>> >> to have a REALLY hard time trying to convince everyone that Rowland,
>> >> Henderson, and Powell ALSO confused some boxes with a person.
>> >
>> > No one has made that argument.
>>
>> No... but *I* going to make it. I find it difficult to believe that a number of
>> people, all looked at the 6th floor within 10-15 minutes of each other, saw two
>> people, and saw DIFFERENT two people.
>>
>> If one person saw a box - they ALL did.
>
> Gee, you have lost me there. You're claiming
>that Rowland, e.g., saw a box that looked like an
>elderly black man wearing a loud plaid shirt? Some box!
>
>>
>> >I don't understand your point. Only Walther thought
>> >the boxes were a man. Neither Rowland, Henderson, nor
>> >Powell described anyone wearing a "brown suit coat" on
>> >the 6th floor.
>>
>> Nor does Edwards and Fischer describe a rifle, as I recall. Should we then
>> reject their accounts as not being identical with Brennan?
>
> As I said before, Edwards and Fischer didn't
>look up there after the shooting started, Brennan did.
>That's why Brennan saw a weapon and they didn't.
>There is no contradiction there whatsover. They also
>saw the same things *before* the shooting started --
>a white male in the SN, all by himself, surrounded
>by boxes. Their testimony is consistent. Now, please
>name one person who saw what Walther described.
>Of course, you can't, because there's no such person.
>
>>
>>
>> >> And then explain why the WC felt it unnecessary to re-question or have
>> >> testimony from 3 people who saw the alleged assassin within minutes of
>> >> the assassination. That is, after all, the point of my assertion of
>> >> WC dishonesty.
>> >
>> > Which 3 people? Rowland *did* testify. Henderson
>> >didn't necessarily see "the alleged assassin" -- she saw no weapon.
>>
>> Ah! So you WOULD agree that Edwards and Fischer didn't see the same man as
>> Brennan!! So we are left with only one witness to the assassin! How convenient
>> for the LN crowd!
>
> Huh? Where'd you get that, pray tell? Of course
>Edwards, Fischer and Brennan all saw the same man. Fischer
>even testified that he thought it *could* have been Oswald, but he
>wasn't certain. (Rowland said much the same thing.) Even
>Walther didn't rule Oswald *out* as the man with the gun.
>
>>
>> I think such reasoning is silly, however.
>
> Whew, I agree with that!
>
>>
>> And Walther's *did* see a weapon - so your reasoning above *doesn't* explain why
>> the WC did not request the FBI to re-question her at the very *least*. They
>> SHOULD have called her in to testify. Failure to get the testimony of EVERY
>> eyewitness who saw the possible assassin within minutes of the assassination was
>> virtually criminal obstruction of justice - as far as I'm concerned. It's not
>> defensible.
>
> Feel better now? Walther was reinterviewed by
>a reporter. We know what she would've testified to, unless
>she changed her story, and if she had testified, why should
>the WC have accepted *her* testimony, when no one
>else saw the same thing?
>
>>
>> And the WC demonstrated it's dishonesty at this point.
>
> How about all the conspiracy tomes that talk about
>Walther and never mention that she's the only witness
>on record who saw a brown suit coat in the SN window and
>NO BOXES?
>
>>
>> >Powell was unknown to the WC, so far as I know.
>>
>> Not what Jerry is asserting now... (Not that I seriously expect you to try to
>> back up his assertions)
>
> I'm not sure right now what his "assertions" were, but he
>may be referring to the same FBI report I found mentioned online
>investigating the view from the jail. I've found that report, btw,
>and include it below.
>
>>
>> According to Summers, the WC *did* know that the Jail was located where it had a
>> perfect view, and completely ignored that fact.
>
> And Summers presented what evidence to back this
>up? Zippo, right?
Given what you posted below, Summers could not have "known" this,
although he might have *believed* it.
>
>>If the chief investigative body
>> for the assassination, the FBI, didn't know this, they had morons working the
>> investigation. I don't believe that to be the case. They *could* have, had
>> they desired, gotten much more information than they did. Once again, it's
>> simply a pattern of deliberately refusing to investigate... on both the WC,
>> *and* the FBI's part.
>
> I've found the FBI document online courtesy
>of "JFK place," submitted by Joseph Backus. Here 'tis:
>
>QUOTE:
>
>>>>>
> Document # 124-10027-10235 Is a 25 page document from Robert P. Gemberling
>to SAC, Dallas. It is dated January 1/27/65.
>
>[....]
>
>On December 1, 1964 Fay Leon Blunt, Dallas, Texas, phoned the FBI at Washington, D.C.
>stating that 17 individuals in the Hospital Ward of the 5th floor of the Dallas County
>Jail had witnessed the assassination of President Kennedy on November 22, 1963; however,
>Blunt stated that none of these witnesses have ever been interviewed.
>
>The following investigation was conducted by Special Agent Richard J. Burnett.
>
>On December 14, 1964 Sheriff Bill Decker, Dallas County Sheriffs Office, Dallas, Texas
>advised that thorough investigation was conducted at the Dallas County Jail immediately
>subsequent to the assassination and no witnesses to same were located among inmates.
>
>Chief Jailer Ernest Lloyd Holman, Dallas County Jail, Dallas, Texas, on December 14, 1964,
>personally escorted Special Agent Richard J. Burnett through the hospital section of the
>County Jail on the fifth floor where white inmates with a mental history are confined. The
>mental inmates are kept in a large tank type cell which has one barred double window
>overlooking the scene of the assassination. The view from this window would have seen the
>President at the time of being struck by the assassin's bullets, but the window in the
>Texas School Book Depository from which the shots were fired is not visible from this cell
>area.
>
>The hospital section for white prisoners on the fifth floor also has another large cell
>area in the northwest corner, which has west windows overlooking the site of the
>President's car at the time of the assassination, and another window on the north side of
>the building which overlooks the TSBD, including the window from which the shots were
>fired by the assassin.
>
>However, Chief Jailer Holman advised that this large cell area is used only on weekends by
>persons serving their three-day sentences for "Driving While Intoxicated" charges and is
>not occupied until late on Friday nights as Texas law states any part of a day constitutes
>a full day's credit on drunk sentences. Thus, Holman noted that persons serving such "DWI"
>sentences report late on Friday's night to gain credit for one full day. Holman further
>advised that no "DWI" prisoners were in this cell at the time of the assassination.
>
>It is noted that the north corner jail window (which overlooks the TSBD and the window of
>the TSBD from which assassin's window were fired) is very dirty and is backed by an iron
>mesh type grid guard. The view from this particular window is very distorted and it is
>believed by Holman to be impossible to identify anyone from this window, including the
>President in his car which would have been rounding the corner of Houston onto Elm Street
>approaching the Triple Underpass seconds before the shooting.
>
>Both Sheriff Decker and Holman pointed out that anyone who would have been confined in the
>hospital section on the fifth floor of the jail at the time of the assassination would
>have been a mental case and the reliability of such a person would be highly questionable.
>Holman noted that it would be a most difficult and time consuming task at this late date
>to attempt to determine just who was confined in the Hospital Ward at the time of the
>assassination. Furthermore, Holman pointed out that such persons, if identified, have
>since been either released or sent to other State mental places of incarceration.
>
>Holman and Chief Identification Officer James H. Kitching advised that Fay Leon Blunt
>(complainant in this matter) is well-known to them as a person completely unreliable who
>has been arrested on several occasions in the past on lunacy charges. Both stated they
>would place no confidence whatsoever in any information furnished by him. Kitching pulled
>Blunt's arrest record and noted that Blunt was not incarcerated in the Dallas county Jail
>at the time of the assassination.
><<<<
>UNQUOTE
>
Splendid, Jean!
I have a virtually identical document which is an Airtel from SAC
Dallas to Director, FBI dated 12/15/64. It is Archives Record Number
124-10058-10043.
The version I have was reviewed by the ARRB on 12/13/95, and
apparently became available at the Archives on 1/29/96 (at least
that's the date on the RIF).
The current status is listed as "released with deletions." But I
don't see any deletions!
It seems the FBI, in 1965, cribbed from their earlier report.
.John
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