Mr. BRENNAN. Well, I could see at one time he came to the window and he sat sideways on the window sill. That was previous to President Kennedy getting there. And I could see practically his whole body, from his hips up. But at the time that he was firing the gun, a possibility from his belt up.
Mr. BELIN. How much of the gun do you believe that you saw?
Mr. BRENNAN. I calculate 70 to 85 percent of the gun.
Mr. BELIN. Do you know what direction the gun was pointing.
Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.
Mr. BELIN. And what direction was the gun pointing when you saw it?
Mr. BRENNAN. At somewhat 30 degrees downward and west by south.
Mr. BELIN. Do you know down what street it was pointing?
Mr. BRENNAN. Yes. Down Elm Street toward the railroad underpasses.
Mr. BELIN. Now, up to the time of the shots, did you observe anything else that you have not told us about here that you can think of right now?
Mr. BRENNAN. Well, not of any importance. I don't remember anything else except-- Mr. BELIN. Let me ask you this. How many shots did you hear?
Mr. BRENNAN. Positively two. I do not recall a second shot-- Mr. BELIN. By a second shot, you mean a middle shot between the time you heard the first noise and the last noise?
Mr. BRENNAN. Yes; that is right. I don't know what made me think that there was firecrackers throwed out of the Book Store unless I did hear the second shot, because I positively thought the first shot was a backfire, and subconsciously must have heard a second shot, but I do not recall it. I could not swear to it.
Mr. BELIN. Could you describe the man you saw in the window on the sixth floor?
Mr. BRENNAN. To my best description, a man in his early thirties, fair complexion, slender but neat, neat slender, possibly 5-foot 10.
Mr. BELIN. About what weight?
Mr. BRENNAN. Oh, at--I calculated, I think, from 160 to 170 pounds.
After all that Brennan did not see the large scope mounted on the top of the rifle? How could he describe the rifle and not see the scope? Mighty FISHY thoughts!! He only heard two shots? HUMM mighty fishy!!
Mr. BELIN. A white man? Mr. EUINS - The man in the window. I could see his hand, and I could see his other hand on the trigger, and one hand was on the barrel thing.
Mr. SPECTER - All right.
Now, at the time the second shot was fired, where were you looking then?
Mr. EUINS - I was still looking at the building, you know, behind this--I was looking at the building.
Mr. SPECTER - Looking at anything special in the building?
Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. I was looking where the barrel was sticking out.
Mr. SPECTER - How many shots did you hear altogether?
Mr. EUINS - I believe there was four, to be exact.
Mr. SPECTER - Now, where were you looking at the time of the third shot, if you remember?
Mr. EUINS - After he shot the first two times, I was just standing back here. And then after he shot again, he pulled the gun back in the window. And then all the police ran back over here in the track vicinity.
Mr. SPECTER - All right.
Now, when the third shot occurred, Amos, let me ask you again, where were you looking then?
Mr. EUINS - I was still down here, looking up at the building.
Mr. SPECTER - What did you see in the building?
Mr. EUINS - I seen a bald spot on this man's head, trying to look out the window. He had a bald spot on his head. I was looking at the bald spot. I could see his hand, you know the rifle laying across in his hand. And I could see his hand sticking out on the trigger part. And after he got through, he just pulled it back in the window.
Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull it back in the window?
Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir.
Mr. SPECTER - And were you still standing at point B?
Mr. EUINS - Yes.
Mr. SPECTER - When he pulled it back in the window?
Mr. EUINS - I was still behind here, yes.
Mr. SPECTER - Where were you when you heard what you described as the fourth shot?
Mr. EUINS - The first shot I was standing here.
Mr. SPECTER - Now you are referring to 366. Put an "L" on 366 where you were standing at the first shot.
Mr. EUINS - Right here. (Witness marking.)
Mr. EUINS - And then as I looked up there, you know, he fired another shot, you know, as I was looking. So I got behind this fountain thing right in there, at this point B.
Mr. SPECTER - At point B, on 365?
Mr. EUINS - I got behind there. And then I watched, he did fire again. Then he started looking down towards my way, and then he fired again.
Mr. SPECTER - The question I have for you now is where were you when he fired on that fourth time.
Mr. EUINS - I was still behind point B.
Mr. SPECTER - You were still at point B when he fired the fourth time?
Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. Then he pulled the gun back in the window.
Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull the gun back in the window after the fourth shot?
Mr. EUINS - Yes; he just come back like this.
Mr. SPECTER - Did you watch what he did after that?
Mr. EUINS - No, sir; because after he had pulled it back in the window, I ran this way, and went across the tracks.
Mighty FISHY Euins don't remember the scope either? And he heard four shots too? He saw the rifle sticking out the window about three feet. He saw both hands, the trigger and the "receiving group" but he can't see a 16" scope?
> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, I could see at one time he came to the window and he sat
> sideways on the window sill. That was previous to President Kennedy getting
> there. And I could see practically his whole body, from his hips up. But at
> the time that he was firing the gun, a possibility from his belt up.
> Mr. BELIN. How much of the gun do you believe that you saw?
> Mr. BRENNAN. I calculate 70 to 85 percent of the gun.
> Mr. BELIN. Do you know what direction the gun was pointing.
> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.
> Mr. BELIN. And what direction was the gun pointing when you saw it?
> Mr. BRENNAN. At somewhat 30 degrees downward and west by south.
> Mr. BELIN. Do you know down what street it was pointing?
> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes. Down Elm Street toward the railroad underpasses.
> Mr. BELIN. Now, up to the time of the shots, did you observe anything else
> that you have not told us about here that you can think of right now?
> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, not of any importance. I don't remember anything else
> except--
> Mr. BELIN. Let me ask you this. How many shots did you hear?
> Mr. BRENNAN. Positively two. I do not recall a second shot--
> Mr. BELIN. By a second shot, you mean a middle shot between the time you
> heard the first noise and the last noise?
> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes; that is right. I don't know what made me think that there
> was firecrackers throwed out of the Book Store unless I did hear the second
> shot, because I positively thought the first shot was a backfire, and
> subconsciously must have heard a second shot, but I do not recall it. I
> could not swear to it.
> Mr. BELIN. Could you describe the man you saw in the window on the sixth
> floor?
> Mr. BRENNAN. To my best description, a man in his early thirties, fair
> complexion, slender but neat, neat slender, possibly 5-foot 10.
> Mr. BELIN. About what weight?
> Mr. BRENNAN. Oh, at--I calculated, I think, from 160 to 170 pounds.
> After all that Brennan did not see the large scope mounted on the top of
> the rifle? How could he describe the rifle and not see the scope? Mighty
> FISHY thoughts!! He only heard two shots? HUMM mighty fishy!!
> Mr. BELIN. A white man? Mr. EUINS - The man in the window. I could see his
> hand, and I could see his other hand on the trigger, and one hand was on the
> barrel thing.
> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
> Now, at the time the second shot was fired, where were you looking then?
> Mr. EUINS - I was still looking at the building, you know, behind this--I
> was looking at the building.
> Mr. SPECTER - Looking at anything special in the building?
> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. I was looking where the barrel was sticking out.
> Mr. SPECTER - How many shots did you hear altogether?
> Mr. EUINS - I believe there was four, to be exact.
> Mr. SPECTER - Now, where were you looking at the time of the third shot, if
> you remember?
> Mr. EUINS - After he shot the first two times, I was just standing back
> here. And then after he shot again, he pulled the gun back in the window.
> And then all the police ran back over here in the track vicinity.
> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
> Now, when the third shot occurred, Amos, let me ask you again, where were
> you looking then?
> Mr. EUINS - I was still down here, looking up at the building.
> Mr. SPECTER - What did you see in the building?
> Mr. EUINS - I seen a bald spot on this man's head, trying to look out the
> window. He had a bald spot on his head. I was looking at the bald spot. I
> could see his hand, you know the rifle laying across in his hand. And I
> could see his hand sticking out on the trigger part. And after he got
> through, he just pulled it back in the window.
> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull it back in the window?
> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir.
> Mr. SPECTER - And were you still standing at point B?
> Mr. EUINS - Yes.
> Mr. SPECTER - When he pulled it back in the window?
> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind here, yes.
> Mr. SPECTER - Where were you when you heard what you described as the fourth
> shot?
> Mr. EUINS - The first shot I was standing here.
> Mr. SPECTER - Now you are referring to 366. Put an "L" on 366 where you were
> standing at the first shot.
> Mr. EUINS - Right here. (Witness marking.)
> Mr. EUINS - And then as I looked up there, you know, he fired another shot,
> you know, as I was looking. So I got behind this fountain thing right in
> there, at this point B.
> Mr. SPECTER - At point B, on 365?
> Mr. EUINS - I got behind there. And then I watched, he did fire again. Then
> he started looking down towards my way, and then he fired again.
> Mr. SPECTER - The question I have for you now is where were you when he
> fired on that fourth time.
> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind point B.
> Mr. SPECTER - You were still at point B when he fired the fourth time?
> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. Then he pulled the gun back in the window.
> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull the gun back in the window after the
> fourth shot?
> Mr. EUINS - Yes; he just come back like this.
> Mr. SPECTER - Did you watch what he did after that?
> Mr. EUINS - No, sir; because after he had pulled it back in the window, I
> ran this way, and went across the tracks.
> Mighty FISHY Euins don't remember the scope either? And he heard four shots
> too? He saw the rifle sticking out the window about three feet. He saw both
> hands, the trigger and the "receiving group" but he can't see a 16" scope?
> Fishy. Mighty fishy!!!
---------
How Many shots were fired President Kennedy?
Most people say three. Supposedly, one (the first) shot missed, one
shot hit JFK in the neck, passed through Connally and became the
alleged magic-bullet. And the third was the fatal shot that hit the
president in the head.
The Warren Wizards said: "The consensus among the witnesses at the
scene was that three shots were fired. However, some heard only two
shots. The most convincing evidence relating to the number of shots
was provided by the presence on the sixth floor of three spent
cartridges. This led the Commission to conclude that there were three
shots...." WR 110-111.
But, later they said, "The physical and other evidence examined by
the Commission compels the conclusion that AT LEAST TWO SHOTS WERE
FIRED... It is possible that the assassin carried an EMPTY SHELL IN
THE RIFLE and fired only two shots ...." WR 111
Summing up. One shot missed the car completely and there is no
record of recovering any of its remains. One shot allegedly passed
through Kennedy and Connally and magically remained near pristine and
ended up at Parkland Hospital. This bullet weighed 161 grains before
it was fired at the motorcade. When recovered it weighed 158.6 grains
which means that very little was lost in its destructive journey.
A fragment weighing 0.5 grains was recovered from Connally's arm.
Audrey Bell, the operating nurse, stated that there were four or five
fragments "anywhere from three to four millimeters in length and a
couple of millimeters wide " These fragments disappeared at the
autopsy.
In addition, what happened to the fragment found in Connally's leg
wound? Also , there was a fragment in the governor's chest that was
never recovered. He died with fragments still in his body that weighed
more that the alleged two to three missing grains from C-399 that was
described as near pristine. And the Warrens say , about pristine, "The
Governor's wrist wound WAS NOT CAUSED BY A PRISTINE BULLET." p.94
So this leaves one bullet and it had to be the fatal projectile that
removed part of the president's skull and much of his brains.
After the coup, two bullet fragments were found in the Lincoln.
According to Warren , the two fragments weighed 44.6 and 21.0 grains
respectively."The heavier fragment was a portion of a bullet's nose
area... the lighter fragment consisted of a bullet's base... the two
fragments were both mutilated, and it was not possible to determine
from the fragments themselves whether they comprised the base and nose
of one bullet or of two separate bullets."
If one bullet missed the car completely and one ended up at Parkland
almost pristine, the last bullet had to be the bullet that hit JFK in
the head and both fragments were from the same projectile.
I KINDA think that, with the angle of the neck shot, the above
fragments would remain in the car, ergo,the remains of the single
bullet ,and the head shot bullet probably ended up in tiny bits in
Dealey Plaza.
Some say that Tague was hit by the first MISSED shot, but he heard
shots before he was hit by a very tiny fragment. So, he was probably
hit by a fragment from the third shot instead of the ALLEGED MISSED
FIRST SHOT.
I personally do not believe there was a missed shot. If I were the
master-mind of the coup, I would be sure to provide evidence that
would assure the connection to the rifle and its owner, And since I
could not rely on the future condition of the bullets actually fired
at the occupants of the limousine, I would fire a bullet through the
barrel of the murder weapon before 11-22-63 and be sure to leave it
where it would be found.
Enter Jack Ruby and the Parkland slug.
As Ass't. DA Alexander said, "The single bullet is like the
Immaculate Conception. Either you believe it or you don't."
I do believe that a single bullet transited both men thus the single
bullet, but I will never believe that the Parkland bullet is one and
the same bullet. I believe that the JFK /Connally bullet remained in
the car and the Parkland bullet was planted on the wrong stretcher, at
Parkland, by Jack Ruby, when he failed to plant it in the limousine
in Dealey Plaza because the car went on to the hospital
I would agree that there were three shots fired. At least it would be
hard to argue that 90% of the witnesses
...
> On Oct 2, 3:27 pm, "Research" <questio...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, I could see at one time he came to the window and he sat
>> sideways on the window sill. That was previous to President Kennedy getting
>> there. And I could see practically his whole body, from his hips up. But at
>> the time that he was firing the gun, a possibility from his belt up.
>> Mr. BELIN. How much of the gun do you believe that you saw?
>> Mr. BRENNAN. I calculate 70 to 85 percent of the gun.
>> Mr. BELIN. Do you know what direction the gun was pointing.
>> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.
>> Mr. BELIN. And what direction was the gun pointing when you saw it?
>> Mr. BRENNAN. At somewhat 30 degrees downward and west by south.
>> Mr. BELIN. Do you know down what street it was pointing?
>> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes. Down Elm Street toward the railroad underpasses.
>> Mr. BELIN. Now, up to the time of the shots, did you observe anything else
>> that you have not told us about here that you can think of right now?
>> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, not of any importance. I don't remember anything else
>> except--
>> Mr. BELIN. Let me ask you this. How many shots did you hear?
>> Mr. BRENNAN. Positively two. I do not recall a second shot--
>> Mr. BELIN. By a second shot, you mean a middle shot between the time you
>> heard the first noise and the last noise?
>> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes; that is right. I don't know what made me think that there
>> was firecrackers throwed out of the Book Store unless I did hear the second
>> shot, because I positively thought the first shot was a backfire, and
>> subconsciously must have heard a second shot, but I do not recall it. I
>> could not swear to it.
>> Mr. BELIN. Could you describe the man you saw in the window on the sixth
>> floor?
>> Mr. BRENNAN. To my best description, a man in his early thirties, fair
>> complexion, slender but neat, neat slender, possibly 5-foot 10.
>> Mr. BELIN. About what weight?
>> Mr. BRENNAN. Oh, at--I calculated, I think, from 160 to 170 pounds.
>> After all that Brennan did not see the large scope mounted on the top of
>> the rifle? How could he describe the rifle and not see the scope? Mighty
>> FISHY thoughts!! He only heard two shots? HUMM mighty fishy!!
>> Mr. BELIN. A white man? Mr. EUINS - The man in the window. I could see his
>> hand, and I could see his other hand on the trigger, and one hand was on the
>> barrel thing.
>> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
>> Now, at the time the second shot was fired, where were you looking then?
>> Mr. EUINS - I was still looking at the building, you know, behind this--I
>> was looking at the building.
>> Mr. SPECTER - Looking at anything special in the building?
>> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. I was looking where the barrel was sticking out.
>> Mr. SPECTER - How many shots did you hear altogether?
>> Mr. EUINS - I believe there was four, to be exact.
>> Mr. SPECTER - Now, where were you looking at the time of the third shot, if
>> you remember?
>> Mr. EUINS - After he shot the first two times, I was just standing back
>> here. And then after he shot again, he pulled the gun back in the window.
>> And then all the police ran back over here in the track vicinity.
>> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
>> Now, when the third shot occurred, Amos, let me ask you again, where were
>> you looking then?
>> Mr. EUINS - I was still down here, looking up at the building.
>> Mr. SPECTER - What did you see in the building?
>> Mr. EUINS - I seen a bald spot on this man's head, trying to look out the
>> window. He had a bald spot on his head. I was looking at the bald spot. I
>> could see his hand, you know the rifle laying across in his hand. And I
>> could see his hand sticking out on the trigger part. And after he got
>> through, he just pulled it back in the window.
>> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull it back in the window?
>> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir.
>> Mr. SPECTER - And were you still standing at point B?
>> Mr. EUINS - Yes.
>> Mr. SPECTER - When he pulled it back in the window?
>> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind here, yes.
>> Mr. SPECTER - Where were you when you heard what you described as the fourth
>> shot?
>> Mr. EUINS - The first shot I was standing here.
>> Mr. SPECTER - Now you are referring to 366. Put an "L" on 366 where you were
>> standing at the first shot.
>> Mr. EUINS - Right here. (Witness marking.)
>> Mr. EUINS - And then as I looked up there, you know, he fired another shot,
>> you know, as I was looking. So I got behind this fountain thing right in
>> there, at this point B.
>> Mr. SPECTER - At point B, on 365?
>> Mr. EUINS - I got behind there. And then I watched, he did fire again. Then
>> he started looking down towards my way, and then he fired again.
>> Mr. SPECTER - The question I have for you now is where were you when he
>> fired on that fourth time.
>> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind point B.
>> Mr. SPECTER - You were still at point B when he fired the fourth time?
>> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. Then he pulled the gun back in the window.
>> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull the gun back in the window after the
>> fourth shot?
>> Mr. EUINS - Yes; he just come back like this.
>> Mr. SPECTER - Did you watch what he did after that?
>> Mr. EUINS - No, sir; because after he had pulled it back in the window, I
>> ran this way, and went across the tracks.
>> Mighty FISHY Euins don't remember the scope either? And he heard four shots
>> too? He saw the rifle sticking out the window about three feet. He saw both
>> hands, the trigger and the "receiving group" but he can't see a 16" scope?
>> Fishy. Mighty fishy!!!
> ---------
> How Many shots were fired President Kennedy?
> Most people say three. Supposedly, one (the first) shot missed, one
> shot hit JFK in the neck, passed through Connally and became the
> alleged magic-bullet. And the third was the fatal shot that hit the
> president in the head.
> The Warren Wizards said: "The consensus among the witnesses at the
> scene was that three shots were fired. However, some heard only two
> shots. The most convincing evidence relating to the number of shots
> was provided by the presence on the sixth floor of three spent
> cartridges. This led the Commission to conclude that there were three
> shots...." WR 110-111.
> But, later they said, "The physical and other evidence examined by
> the Commission compels the conclusion that AT LEAST TWO SHOTS WERE
> FIRED... It is possible that the assassin carried an EMPTY SHELL IN
> THE RIFLE and fired only two shots ...." WR 111
> Summing up. One shot missed the car completely and there is no
> record of recovering any of its remains. One shot allegedly passed
Well, some WC defenders think that the missed shot hit the curb near Tague. One even thinks it hit the traffic light above Elm Street.
> through Kennedy and Connally and magically remained near pristine and
> ended up at Parkland Hospital. This bullet weighed 161 grains before
> it was fired at the motorcade. When recovered it weighed 158.6 grains
> which means that very little was lost in its destructive journey.
We do not know how much that particular bullet weighed before it was fired. What if ALL the missing weight is what was taken out for testing?
> A fragment weighing 0.5 grains was recovered from Connally's arm.
> Audrey Bell, the operating nurse, stated that there were four or five
> fragments "anywhere from three to four millimeters in length and a
> couple of millimeters wide " These fragments disappeared at the
> autopsy.
You seem a little confused here. No fragments from Connally disappeared at the autopsy. It is illegal do to an autopsy on a person while he is still living. Even Dr. Frankenstein did not violate that rule.
> In addition, what happened to the fragment found in Connally's leg
> wound? Also , there was a fragment in the governor's chest that was
All those fragments are still in Connally's body, but we are not allowed to examine them. Got to maintain the cover-up or else we'll have mushroom clouds over Washington.
> never recovered. He died with fragments still in his body that weighed
> more that the alleged two to three missing grains from C-399 that was
> described as near pristine. And the Warrens say , about pristine, "The
> Governor's wrist wound WAS NOT CAUSED BY A PRISTINE BULLET." p.94
We don't know that for a fact, but a lot of people suspect it.
> So this leaves one bullet and it had to be the fatal projectile that
> removed part of the president's skull and much of his brains.
> After the coup, two bullet fragments were found in the Lincoln.
> According to Warren , the two fragments weighed 44.6 and 21.0 grains
> respectively."The heavier fragment was a portion of a bullet's nose
> area... the lighter fragment consisted of a bullet's base... the two
> fragments were both mutilated, and it was not possible to determine
> from the fragments themselves whether they comprised the base and nose
> of one bullet or of two separate bullets."
> If one bullet missed the car completely and one ended up at Parkland
> almost pristine, the last bullet had to be the bullet that hit JFK in
> the head and both fragments were from the same projectile.
That is the box the WC put itself into.
> I KINDA think that, with the angle of the neck shot, the above
> fragments would remain in the car, ergo,the remains of the single
> bullet ,and the head shot bullet probably ended up in tiny bits in
> Dealey Plaza.
If you think the two Large fragments came from one shot other than the head shot, your need to diagram your theory. Use my drawing of the limousine.
Raymond <Bluerhy...@aol.com> wrote:
> How Many shots were fired President Kennedy?
> Most people say three. Supposedly, one (the first) shot missed, one
> shot hit JFK in the neck, passed through Connally and became the
> alleged magic-bullet. And the third was the fatal shot that hit the
> president in the head.
> The Warren Wizards said: "The consensus among the witnesses at the
> scene was that three shots were fired. However, some heard only two
> shots. The most convincing evidence relating to the number of shots
> was provided by the presence on the sixth floor of three spent
> cartridges. This led the Commission to conclude that there were three
> shots...." WR 110-111.
> But, later they said, "The physical and other evidence examined by
> the Commission compels the conclusion that AT LEAST TWO SHOTS WERE
> FIRED... It is possible that the assassin carried an EMPTY SHELL IN
> THE RIFLE and fired only two shots ...." WR 111
I find it interesting that you did not quote the next three sentences:
**********
Soon after the three empty cartridges were found, officials at the scene decided that three shots were fired, and that conclusion was widely circulated by the press. The eyewitness testimony may be subconsciously colored by the extensive publicity given the conclusion that three shots were fired. Nevertheless, the preponderance of the evidence, in particular the three spent cartridges, led the Commission to conclude that there were three shots fired.
**********
> Summing up. One shot missed the car completely and there is no
> record of recovering any of its remains. One shot allegedly passed
> through Kennedy and Connally and magically remained near pristine and
> ended up at Parkland Hospital.
Oh yes, there's the "magically remained near pristine" myth again. Let's see if that's really true:
Sure doesn't look "nearly pristine" to me. I am superbly confident that if I stopped at least ten people at random on the street and didn't tell them that this photo had anything to do with the JFK assassination, most of them upon looking at it would more likely than not use a word such as "deformed" or something of similar meaning. I doubt a single one of them would utter the word "pristine" or any other word of similar meaning.
Since I live in east Texas, and there are a lot of hunters around here, I could also show this photo to them without telling them this has anything to do with the JFK assassination. I very much doubt any of them will call it "pristine" either, even by preceding that with the word "nearly." In fact, I think none of them will utter the word "pristine" in any context, unless it is "not at all pristine."
It also looks perfectly consistent with what it has been claimed to have done. The bullet entered JFK's back near the base of his neck and exited the front of his throat. In its passage through his body it struck no hard bone directly, though it seems to have nicked one of his vertebrae.
Thus one should not expect any significant damage to the bullet from that.
The passage through JFK's body first would also slow down the velocity of the bullet significantly. It also caused the bullet to tumble, because the entry in Connally's back was elongated, not circular. If the bullet had hit Connally in the back directly, without having struck or passed through anything else first, it would be far less likely to be tumbling, as there wouldn't be any credible evidence to explain that, and the entrance would be circular, like the one in JFK's back was.
In its passage through Connally's torso the bullet did indeed smash through one of his ribs. Had the bullet struck the rib nose first, and also without its velocity being reduced by passage through JFK first, then yes, I might expect fragmentation or much more serious damage to the bullet. But since the bullet was slowed down considerably before it entered Connally, and furthermore did not enter his body nose first, there is no credible evidence that it struck his rib nose first either.
It then exited his chest, its velocity having been slowed even more by the additional passage through Connally's torso, and slammed through his right wrist bones. But again, this would have been at a slower velocity than if the only person the bullet had gone through had been Connally alone, and again with the tumbling aspect there is no credible evidence that it hit his wrist nose first either. So once again, it is unreasonable to expect more damage than what appears in photos of the bullet. Finally the bullet's velocity had been slowed down so much by passing through JFK, then through Connally's torso, then through his wrist, that it was traveling only fast enough to go a little way into his left thigh.
> This bullet weighed 161 grains before
> it was fired at the motorcade.
How do you know that, when the bullet was never weighed before it was fired at the motorcade? They may have weighed similar bullets to get an estimate, but even bullets from the same batch made by the same company can often vary in weight by at least a few grains.
> When recovered it weighed 158.6 grains
> which means that very little was lost in its destructive journey.
As one would expect, given that the bullet was traveling at a lower velocity before it struck any hard bone directly than it would have if it had hit Connally only, and was furthermore tumbling on top of that, so it may well have not struck any bone nose first either.
> A fragment weighing 0.5 grains was recovered from Connally's arm.
> Audrey Bell, the operating nurse, stated that there were four or five
> fragments "anywhere from three to four millimeters in length and a
> couple of millimeters wide " These fragments disappeared at the
> autopsy.
Bullet fragments from Connally's arm disappeared at the autopsy of JFK?
Could you give us a source for that, please? Thanks.
> In addition, what happened to the fragment found in Connally's leg
> wound? Also , there was a fragment in the governor's chest that was
> never recovered. He died with fragments still in his body that weighed
> more that the alleged two to three missing grains from C-399 that was
> described as near pristine.
I'm still wondering how you know how many grains were missing from CE 399 when no human who has ever lived knows for certain precisely how many grains the bullet weighed before it was fired? And you also say that it was "described as near pristine." Described that way by whom?
People who have never seen all of the photographs ever taken of it?
> And the Warrens say , about pristine, "The
> Governor's wrist wound WAS NOT CAUSED BY A PRISTINE BULLET." p.94
Of course it wasn't. And since CE 399 is not even remotely close to pristine, this is perfectly consistent. And again I find it interesting that you didn't quote what immediately follows:
**********
A bullet is pristine immediately on exiting from a rifle muzzle when it moves in a straight line with a spinning motion and maintains its uniform trajectory with but a minimum of nose surface striking the air through which it passes. When the straight line of flight of a bullet is deflected by striking some object, it starts to wobble or become irregular in flight, a condition called yaw. A bullet with yaw has a greater surface exposed to the striking material or air, since the target or air is struck not only by the nose of the bullet, its smallest striking surface, but also by the bullet's sides.
**********
And then two paragraphs later:
**********
The conclusion that the Governor's wrist was not struck by a pristine bullet was based upon the following: (1) greater damage was inflicted on the test material than on the Governor's wrist; (2) the test material had a smaller entry wound and a larger exit wound, characteristic of a pristine bullet, while the Governor's wrist had a larger entry wound as compared with its exit wound, indicating a bullet which was tumbling; (3) cloth was carried into the wrist wound, which is characteristic of an irregular missile; (4) the partial cutting of a radial nerve and tendon leading to the Governor's thumb further suggested that the bullet which struck him was not pristine, since such a bullet would merely push aside a tendon and nerve rather than catch and tear them; (5) the bullet found on the Governor's stretcher probably did not pass through the wrist as a pristine bullet because its nose was not considerably flattened, as was the case with the pristine bullet which struck the simulated wrist; and (6) the bullet which caused the Governor's thigh injury and then fell out of the wound had a "very low velocity, " whereas the pristine bullets fired during the tests possessed a very high exit velocity.
**********
Note carefully the use of "tumbling" and "very low velocity."
> So this leaves one bullet and it had to be the fatal projectile that
> removed part of the president's skull and much of his brains.
Indeed.
> After the coup,
What coup?
> two bullet fragments were found in the Lincoln.
> According to Warren , the two fragments weighed 44.6 and 21.0 grains
> respectively."The heavier fragment was a portion of a bullet's nose
> area... the lighter fragment consisted of a bullet's base... the two
> fragments were both mutilated, and it was not possible to determine
> from the fragments themselves whether they comprised the base and nose
> of one bullet or of two separate bullets."
> If one bullet missed the car completely and one ended up at Parkland
> almost pristine,
I read you post and agree with what you said. Thanks for intrest in my thoughts. You answer, even though intriging, did not answer the question. The question was, was there any other witnesses who saw the rifle in the window? Cause I don't think there was only three shot. I do think the assassin's nest a ploy and the MC was a throw down. But proving it is the million dollar answer.
I also find it curious that only two (so far) witnesses out of the over 3 hundred looked up to the depository. Hundreds of people stood on the corner around the building and only two looked up. I can't believe in only 3 shots and that these shots came from the dep. Many of the people the WC claimed heard 3 shots from the dep was not even asked. Some of these witneses claimed the FBI had them sign blank affidavids and when they found out the affidavids were falsified, it was to late.
All the evidence around the MC can be discredited. Oswald had to die to keep him out of court. The circumstantial evidence of the case would not hold up. The bent shell is only one example. The "eye" witnesses who did not see the large scope mounted on the rifle is another issue. They described they saw the shooter's finger on the trigger. But they did not see the scope? I personally think the shooter, if there really was one, used an automatic rifle without a scope. I say automatic because the shots sound timing were to close together to be a bolt-action. The second and third shots were reported to almost on top of each other. The dictabelt showed them 1/2 second apart. Could have been from the dep but I rather think from two different directions. And I also think the dictabelt was a fake, to cover up the fact that there was a conspiracy and shots were fired from different directions. I'm not saying Oswald was a patsy. It might have been him in the window, but with help from the knoll.
> I read you post and agree with what you said. Thanks for intrest in my
> thoughts. You answer, even though intriging, did not answer the question.
> The question was, was there any other witnesses who saw the rifle in the
> window? Cause I don't think there was only three shot. I do think the
> assassin's nest a ploy and the MC was a throw down. But proving it is the
> million dollar answer.
Your question is nonsense. People seeing a rifle in the window does not prove it was fired and does not rule out a second rifle from somewhere else. That's why we pushed for the HSCA and their tests PROVED that three shots were fired from the sniper's nest and one shot was fired from the grassy knoll.
Maybe more refined tests could even prove that it was Oswald's rifle that fired all three shots. But in the meantime the recovered bullet and fragments were fired from Oswald's rifle.
> I also find it curious that only two (so far) witnesses out of the over 3
> hundred looked up to the depository. Hundreds of people stood on the
Only two did WHAT? Looked up? Saw the rifle? Maybe many more did, but were never questioned.
> corner around the building and only two looked up. I can't believe in only
> 3 shots and that these shots came from the dep. Many of the people the WC
> claimed heard 3 shots from the dep was not even asked. Some of these
> witneses claimed the FBI had them sign blank affidavids and when they
> found out the affidavids were falsified, it was to late.
Something like that. I'd like to see you document whatever you think you are claiming.
> All the evidence around the MC can be discredited. Oswald had to die to
> keep him out of court. The circumstantial evidence of the case would not
> hold up. The bent shell is only one example. The "eye" witnesses who did
Not true. Remember where this case would be tried. Dallas, Texas. Wade had 25 convictions out of 26 cases. Wade could have convicted a ham sandwich.
> not see the large scope mounted on the rifle is another issue. They
> described they saw the shooter's finger on the trigger. But they did not
> see the scope? I personally think the shooter, if there really was one,
> used an automatic rifle without a scope. I say automatic because the shots
Never rely on witnesses.
> sound timing were to close together to be a bolt-action. The second and
> third shots were reported to almost on top of each other. The dictabelt
The acoustical evidence rules out an automatic.
> showed them 1/2 second apart. Could have been from the dep but I rather
You know nothing about the Dictabelt. Those two shots separated by less than a second are not from the same weapon. They are from two weapons in two different locations. Try reading the evidence before setting out to dream up wacky theories.
> think from two different directions. And I also think the dictabelt was a
> fake, to cover up the fact that there was a conspiracy and shots were
> fired from different directions. I'm not saying Oswald was a patsy. It
> might have been him in the window, but with help from the knoll.
So your brilliant conspirators cover up their conspiracy by planting a fake Dictabelt which proves conspiracy? Boy are these guys brilliant. So Nixon planted a fake WH tape of an innocent conversation which had dozens of erasures over 18-1/2 minutes only to MAKE it look like he was destroying evidence of conspiracy?
Ah ha, but what he didn't know is that the real conversation was accidentally duplicated on an early part of the tape via printthtough!
You know, that aside to Haldeman where he said, "God damn it, I covered up for Helms when he killed Kennedy and now God damn it, he's going to cover up for me."
> > So this leaves one bullet and it had to be the fatal projectile that
> > removed part of the president's skull and much of his brains.
> Indeed.
> > After the coup,
> What coup?
President Kennedy was much more conservative than VP Johnson. If LBJ
was the mastermind behind this assassination, as some CTs believe,
then this was a Liberal coup to overthrow a Conservative Democrat.
> In article
> <4ae338f7-39e5-44a8-9880-263ff9516...@w3g2000yqe.googlegroups.com>,
> Raymond <Bluerhy...@aol.com> wrote:
>> How Many shots were fired President Kennedy?
>> Most people say three. Supposedly, one (the first) shot missed, one
>> shot hit JFK in the neck, passed through Connally and became the
>> alleged magic-bullet. And the third was the fatal shot that hit the
>> president in the head.
>> The Warren Wizards said: "The consensus among the witnesses at the
>> scene was that three shots were fired. However, some heard only two
>> shots. The most convincing evidence relating to the number of shots
>> was provided by the presence on the sixth floor of three spent
>> cartridges. This led the Commission to conclude that there were three
>> shots...." WR 110-111.
>> But, later they said, "The physical and other evidence examined by
>> the Commission compels the conclusion that AT LEAST TWO SHOTS WERE
>> FIRED... It is possible that the assassin carried an EMPTY SHELL IN
>> THE RIFLE and fired only two shots ...." WR 111
> I find it interesting that you did not quote the next three sentences:
> **********
> Soon after the three empty cartridges were found, officials at the scene
> decided that three shots were fired, and that conclusion was widely
> circulated by the press. The eyewitness testimony may be subconsciously
> colored by the extensive publicity given the conclusion that three shots
> were fired. Nevertheless, the preponderance of the evidence, in particular
> the three spent cartridges, led the Commission to conclude that there were
> three shots fired.
So even the WC admits the bias in the sampling, but YOU don't?
BTW, the acoustical evidence PROVES that there were exactly three shots fired from the sniper's nest. No need for guessing.
> **********
>> Summing up. One shot missed the car completely and there is no
>> record of recovering any of its remains. One shot allegedly passed
>> through Kennedy and Connally and magically remained near pristine and
>> ended up at Parkland Hospital.
> Oh yes, there's the "magically remained near pristine" myth again. Let's
> see if that's really true:
> Sure doesn't look "nearly pristine" to me. I am superbly confident that
> if I stopped at least ten people at random on the street and didn't tell
So when ballistics experts say that it is nearly pristine they must be liars and you, a non-shooter, are more expert than the WC experts?
> them that this photo had anything to do with the JFK assassination, most
> of them upon looking at it would more likely than not use a word such as
> "deformed" or something of similar meaning. I doubt a single one of them
> would utter the word "pristine" or any other word of similar meaning.
> Since I live in east Texas, and there are a lot of hunters around here, I
> could also show this photo to them without telling them this has anything
> to do with the JFK assassination. I very much doubt any of them will call
> it "pristine" either, even by preceding that with the word "nearly." In
> fact, I think none of them will utter the word "pristine" in any context,
> unless it is "not at all pristine."
And when the WC experts actually hold CE 399 in their own hands and call it nearly pristine they are liars?
> It also looks perfectly consistent with what it has been claimed to have
> done. The bullet entered JFK's back near the base of his neck and exited
No, it doesn't. Not to do everything that the WC asked of it.
> the front of his throat. In its passage through his body it struck no
> hard bone directly, though it seems to have nicked one of his vertebrae.
Well, now, how many centuries did it take for you to admit that? Show me where in the WC they admitted that it nicked one of his vertebrae. FAIL
> Thus one should not expect any significant damage to the bullet from that.
No one claimed any significant damage to the bullet from that.
> The passage through JFK's body first would also slow down the velocity of
> the bullet significantly. It also caused the bullet to tumble, because
No, only 129 fps according to the WC tests. But maybe you think the WC lied about that.
> the entry in Connally's back was elongated, not circular. If the bullet
Another WC myth. An elongated wound does not prove that the bullet was tumbling.
> had hit Connally in the back directly, without having struck or passed
> through anything else first, it would be far less likely to be tumbling,
> as there wouldn't be any credible evidence to explain that, and the
> entrance would be circular, like the one in JFK's back was.
Wrong. You think the bullet which hit Kennedy's head directly was not tumbling and yet that entrance wound is supposedly exactly as elongated as Connally's back wound. I have made this point a million times and no WC defender will dare touch it or admit it.
> In its passage through Connally's torso the bullet did indeed smash
> through one of his ribs. Had the bullet struck the rib nose first, and
> also without its velocity being reduced by passage through JFK first, then
> yes, I might expect fragmentation or much more serious damage to the
> bullet. But since the bullet was slowed down considerably before it
> entered Connally, and furthermore did not enter his body nose first, there
> is no credible evidence that it struck his rib nose first either.
You can imagine any scenario you wish, but you can't prove any of them.
> It then exited his chest, its velocity having been slowed even more by the
> additional passage through Connally's torso, and slammed through his right
> wrist bones. But again, this would have been at a slower velocity than if
> the only person the bullet had gone through had been Connally alone, and
> again with the tumbling aspect there is no credible evidence that it hit
> his wrist nose first either. So once again, it is unreasonable to expect
> more damage than what appears in photos of the bullet. Finally the
What does a real wound ballistics expert say?
My Thoughts re President J. F. Kennedy Assassination
By Joseph R. Dolce, MD, FACS
I am the Chief Consultant for the US Army in wound ballistics at the Edgewood Arsenal and Aberdeen Proving Ground in Maryland. I have been dealing with high velocity missles for the Army for the past twenty?five years and I feel that there are no forensic pathologists in this country who have had the experience I have had with this type of missile. The forensic pathologist in civilian life, deals primarily with homicides caused by slow velocity missiles.
I appeared before the investigating team of the Warren Commission at the VA Building in Washington, D.C. on April 21, 1964. At that time, I reviewed all the X?rays and Zapruder film along with Governor Connaley [sic], his wife and his doctors. At that time, Governor Connaley sat on my right, while reviewing the Zapruder films and he (Governor Connaley) specifically told me, that he did not know that his wrist was injured until he reacted fully from anesthestia [sic] and noted a plaster cast on his right hand and forearm ? but, in an interview with Life magazine ? he goes on to say how his wrist was injured.
I am disturbed as to why I was not asked by the Warren Commission to give final testimony, even though Doctors Olivier and Dzimean [sic], to whom I serve as their Consultant were called, to give final testimony. I had advised these doctors to conduct certain experiments at Edgewood ? which they did ? and their findings were not consistent with their testimony.
Dr. Olivier accepts Dr. Gregory?s impression of what was the entrance and what was the exit wounds of Connaley?s right wrist, in spite of the fact, that his experiments on ten (10) cadaver wrists proved just the opposite ? yet, he is willing to accept the conclusions of Gregory, who has no wound ballistic experience. This is extremely important, as he then tries to fit the yaw and the tumbling effects to coincide with Gregory?s interpretations ? this is wrong and this is the part of the investigation that has been criticized so bitterly in medical circles. Personally, I strongly believe that the wrist wound in a separate and distinct wound made by one of the shots by Oswald. Also ? this bullet is not deformed and yet, the bullets that struck the cadaver wrists are badly deformed, and these same bullets did not go through a neck or through a chest wall. In the experiments on ten cadaver wrists, all the exit wounds are larger than the entrance wounds ? this is a known fact ? yet, Dr. Olivier chose to accept Gregory?s thoughts of Connaley?s wound as just the opposite.
I feel that the first bullet fired by Oswald went through the President?s neck and caused him to become paralyzed even though the bullet did not strike the spine. This is due to the fact that you can have an injury to the spinal cord with high velocity missiles without the missiles striking the cord, because of the large temporary cavity produced by high velocity missiles. I can demonstrate amd [sic] prove this fact by several films which we have developed at the Edgewood Arsenal. The autopsy should have included a section of the cervical spinal cord, which I am sure would have demonstrated a hemorrhage.
I am convinced that the one bullet theory is wrong, because of the fact, that one bullet striking the President?s neck, the Governor?s chest and wrist, should be badly deformed, as our experiments at the Edgewood Arsenal proved. There never was a bullet in Governor Connaley?s left thigh, but just a small fragment which I feel came from the third bullet which struck J.F.K. in the head. My
...
On Friday, October 12, 2012 5:38:12 PM UTC-4, Anthony Marsh wrote:
>That's why we pushed for the HSCA and their tests PROVED that
> three shots were fired from the sniper's nest and one shot was fired
> from the grassy knoll.
They proved that experts can hear any damn thing they want in static. Are these also the experts who proved that Hargis was the only cop wearing gloves, or is that just another of your copyrighted theories?
> On 10/11/2012 10:50 PM, Research wrote:
>> I read you post and agree with what you said. Thanks for intrest in my
>> thoughts. You answer, even though intriging, did not answer the question.
>> The question was, was there any other witnesses who saw the rifle in the
>> window? Cause I don't think there was only three shot. I do think the
>> assassin's nest a ploy and the MC was a throw down. But proving it is the
>> million dollar answer.
> Your question is nonsense. People seeing a rifle in the window does not > prove it was fired and does not rule out a second rifle from somewhere > else. That's why we pushed for the HSCA and their tests PROVED that three > shots were fired from the sniper's nest and one shot was fired from the > grassy knoll.
> Maybe more refined tests could even prove that it was Oswald's rifle that > fired all three shots. But in the meantime the recovered bullet and > fragments were fired from Oswald's rifle.
>> I also find it curious that only two (so far) witnesses out of the over 3
>> hundred looked up to the depository. Hundreds of people stood on the
> Only two did WHAT? Looked up? Saw the rifle? Maybe many more did, but were > never questioned.
>> corner around the building and only two looked up. I can't believe in >> only
>> 3 shots and that these shots came from the dep. Many of the people the WC
>> claimed heard 3 shots from the dep was not even asked. Some of these
>> witneses claimed the FBI had them sign blank affidavids and when they
>> found out the affidavids were falsified, it was to late.
> Something like that. I'd like to see you document whatever you think you > are claiming.
>> All the evidence around the MC can be discredited. Oswald had to die to
>> keep him out of court. The circumstantial evidence of the case would not
>> hold up. The bent shell is only one example. The "eye" witnesses who did
> Not true. Remember where this case would be tried. Dallas, Texas. Wade had > 25 convictions out of 26 cases. Wade could have convicted a ham sandwich.
I can believe it. Dallas runs one of theose kangaroo courts. Where many still exist today. Hell, they just arrested a local coroner in my area, just like they been doing all over the country. For falsefing evidence.
>> not see the large scope mounted on the rifle is another issue. They
>> described they saw the shooter's finger on the trigger. But they did not
>> see the scope? I personally think the shooter, if there really was one,
>> used an automatic rifle without a scope. I say automatic because the >> shots
> Never rely on witnesses.
>> sound timing were to close together to be a bolt-action. The second and
>> third shots were reported to almost on top of each other. The dictabelt
> The acoustical evidence rules out an automatic.
Do you mean the dictabelt that was said to be faked?
>> showed them 1/2 second apart. Could have been from the dep but I rather
> You know nothing about the Dictabelt. Those two shots separated by less > than a second are not from the same weapon. They are from two weapons in > two different locations. Try reading the evidence before setting out to > dream up wacky theories.
What two rifles? That's it you proved the conspiracy. Get out the trumpets!
>> think from two different directions. And I also think the dictabelt was a
>> fake, to cover up the fact that there was a conspiracy and shots were
>> fired from different directions. I'm not saying Oswald was a patsy. It
>> might have been him in the window, but with help from the knoll.
> So your brilliant conspirators cover up their conspiracy by planting a > fake Dictabelt which proves conspiracy? Boy are these guys brilliant. So > Nixon planted a fake WH tape of an innocent conversation which had dozens > of erasures over 18-1/2 minutes only to MAKE it look like he was > destroying evidence of conspiracy?
Hey I'm not the one who said it was faked. It was "experts" like, humm, yourself.
> Ah ha, but what he didn't know is that the real conversation was > accidentally duplicated on an early part of the tape via printthtough!
Printthought isn't even a word, much less a mechanical anomility.
> You know, that aside to Haldeman where he said, "God damn it, I covered up > for Helms when he killed Kennedy and now God damn it, he's going to cover > up for me."
Then why didn't this event make the news? And why wasn't Haldeman and Helms arrested and tried for the assassination? Cause this never happened.
> On Thursday, October 11, 2012 9:01:57 PM UTC-4, Anthony Marsh wrote:
>> How about a Modified Single Bullet Theory (copyright Anthony Marsh 1995)
> where one bullet goes through JFK's torso and then Connally's torso and
> then another bullet hits Connally's wrist after the head shot?
> Oh, you copyrighted that, did you? I must owe you a dime for every time I
> say that was the shot at Zapruder frame 322.
No, I don't have a copyright on frame 322.
I do have a copyright on my computer map of Dealey Plaza, but it is free to copy and share.
> "Anthony Marsh" <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:507856b7$1@mcadams.posc.mu.edu...
>> On 10/11/2012 10:50 PM, Research wrote:
>>> I read you post and agree with what you said. Thanks for intrest in my
>>> thoughts. You answer, even though intriging, did not answer the question.
>>> The question was, was there any other witnesses who saw the rifle in the
>>> window? Cause I don't think there was only three shot. I do think the
>>> assassin's nest a ploy and the MC was a throw down. But proving it is the
>>> million dollar answer.
>> Your question is nonsense. People seeing a rifle in the window does not
>> prove it was fired and does not rule out a second rifle from somewhere
>> else. That's why we pushed for the HSCA and their tests PROVED that three
>> shots were fired from the sniper's nest and one shot was fired from the
>> grassy knoll.
>> Maybe more refined tests could even prove that it was Oswald's rifle that
>> fired all three shots. But in the meantime the recovered bullet and
>> fragments were fired from Oswald's rifle.
>>> I also find it curious that only two (so far) witnesses out of the over 3
>>> hundred looked up to the depository. Hundreds of people stood on the
>> Only two did WHAT? Looked up? Saw the rifle? Maybe many more did, but were
>> never questioned.
>>> corner around the building and only two looked up. I can't believe in
>>> only
>>> 3 shots and that these shots came from the dep. Many of the people the WC
>>> claimed heard 3 shots from the dep was not even asked. Some of these
>>> witneses claimed the FBI had them sign blank affidavids and when they
>>> found out the affidavids were falsified, it was to late.
>> Something like that. I'd like to see you document whatever you think you
>> are claiming.
>>> All the evidence around the MC can be discredited. Oswald had to die to
>>> keep him out of court. The circumstantial evidence of the case would not
>>> hold up. The bent shell is only one example. The "eye" witnesses who did
>> Not true. Remember where this case would be tried. Dallas, Texas. Wade had
>> 25 convictions out of 26 cases. Wade could have convicted a ham sandwich.
> I can believe it. Dallas runs one of theose kangaroo courts. Where many
> still exist today. Hell, they just arrested a local coroner in my area,
> just like they been doing all over the country. For falsefing evidence.
>>> not see the large scope mounted on the rifle is another issue. They
>>> described they saw the shooter's finger on the trigger. But they did not
>>> see the scope? I personally think the shooter, if there really was one,
>>> used an automatic rifle without a scope. I say automatic because the
>>> shots
>> Never rely on witnesses.
>>> sound timing were to close together to be a bolt-action. The second and
>>> third shots were reported to almost on top of each other. The dictabelt
>> The acoustical evidence rules out an automatic.
> Do you mean the dictabelt that was said to be faked?
>>> showed them 1/2 second apart. Could have been from the dep but I rather
>> You know nothing about the Dictabelt. Those two shots separated by less
>> than a second are not from the same weapon. They are from two weapons in
>> two different locations. Try reading the evidence before setting out to
>> dream up wacky theories.
> What two rifles? That's it you proved the conspiracy. Get out the
> trumpets!
>>> think from two different directions. And I also think the dictabelt was a
>>> fake, to cover up the fact that there was a conspiracy and shots were
>>> fired from different directions. I'm not saying Oswald was a patsy. It
>>> might have been him in the window, but with help from the knoll.
>> So your brilliant conspirators cover up their conspiracy by planting a
>> fake Dictabelt which proves conspiracy? Boy are these guys brilliant. So
>> Nixon planted a fake WH tape of an innocent conversation which had dozens
>> of erasures over 18-1/2 minutes only to MAKE it look like he was
>> destroying evidence of conspiracy?
> Hey I'm not the one who said it was faked. It was "experts" like, humm,
> yourself.
>> Ah ha, but what he didn't know is that the real conversation was
>> accidentally duplicated on an early part of the tape via printthtough!
> Printthought isn't even a word, much less a mechanical anomility.
"Anomility"?!
You maybe mean "anomaly"?
Or "abnormality"?
Or did these two words collide in your head, so you came up with something like Sarah Palin's "refudiate"?
> "Anthony Marsh" <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:507856b7$1@mcadams.posc.mu.edu...
>> On 10/11/2012 10:50 PM, Research wrote:
>>> I read you post and agree with what you said. Thanks for intrest in my
>>> thoughts. You answer, even though intriging, did not answer the question.
>>> The question was, was there any other witnesses who saw the rifle in the
>>> window? Cause I don't think there was only three shot. I do think the
>>> assassin's nest a ploy and the MC was a throw down. But proving it is the
>>> million dollar answer.
>> Your question is nonsense. People seeing a rifle in the window does not
>> prove it was fired and does not rule out a second rifle from somewhere
>> else. That's why we pushed for the HSCA and their tests PROVED that three
>> shots were fired from the sniper's nest and one shot was fired from the
>> grassy knoll.
>> Maybe more refined tests could even prove that it was Oswald's rifle that
>> fired all three shots. But in the meantime the recovered bullet and
>> fragments were fired from Oswald's rifle.
>>> I also find it curious that only two (so far) witnesses out of the over 3
>>> hundred looked up to the depository. Hundreds of people stood on the
>> Only two did WHAT? Looked up? Saw the rifle? Maybe many more did, but were
>> never questioned.
>>> corner around the building and only two looked up. I can't believe in
>>> only
>>> 3 shots and that these shots came from the dep. Many of the people the WC
>>> claimed heard 3 shots from the dep was not even asked. Some of these
>>> witneses claimed the FBI had them sign blank affidavids and when they
>>> found out the affidavids were falsified, it was to late.
>> Something like that. I'd like to see you document whatever you think you
>> are claiming.
>>> All the evidence around the MC can be discredited. Oswald had to die to
>>> keep him out of court. The circumstantial evidence of the case would not
>>> hold up. The bent shell is only one example. The "eye" witnesses who did
>> Not true. Remember where this case would be tried. Dallas, Texas. Wade had
>> 25 convictions out of 26 cases. Wade could have convicted a ham sandwich.
> I can believe it. Dallas runs one of theose kangaroo courts. Where many
> still exist today. Hell, they just arrested a local coroner in my area,
> just like they been doing all over the country. For falsefing evidence.
>>> not see the large scope mounted on the rifle is another issue. They
>>> described they saw the shooter's finger on the trigger. But they did not
>>> see the scope? I personally think the shooter, if there really was one,
>>> used an automatic rifle without a scope. I say automatic because the
>>> shots
>> Never rely on witnesses.
>>> sound timing were to close together to be a bolt-action. The second and
>>> third shots were reported to almost on top of each other. The dictabelt
>> The acoustical evidence rules out an automatic.
> Do you mean the dictabelt that was said to be faked?
You are still confused. No one said the Dictabelt is faked.
>>> showed them 1/2 second apart. Could have been from the dep but I rather
>> You know nothing about the Dictabelt. Those two shots separated by less
>> than a second are not from the same weapon. They are from two weapons in
>> two different locations. Try reading the evidence before setting out to
>> dream up wacky theories.
> What two rifles? That's it you proved the conspiracy. Get out the
> trumpets!
It was the acoustical evidence finding two rifles which proved the conspiracy.
>>> think from two different directions. And I also think the dictabelt was a
>>> fake, to cover up the fact that there was a conspiracy and shots were
>>> fired from different directions. I'm not saying Oswald was a patsy. It
>>> might have been him in the window, but with help from the knoll.
>> So your brilliant conspirators cover up their conspiracy by planting a
>> fake Dictabelt which proves conspiracy? Boy are these guys brilliant. So
>> Nixon planted a fake WH tape of an innocent conversation which had dozens
>> of erasures over 18-1/2 minutes only to MAKE it look like he was
>> destroying evidence of conspiracy?
> Hey I'm not the one who said it was faked. It was "experts" like, humm,
> yourself.
I did not state a fact, I asked an ironic question. Is this the very first time you have seen that rhetorical technique used? Are you really that uneducated?
And don't try to insult me by claiming that anyone else was smart enough to think of that solution.
>> Ah ha, but what he didn't know is that the real conversation was
>> accidentally duplicated on an early part of the tape via printthtough!
> Printthought isn't even a word, much less a mechanical anomility.
I didn't have a "t" at the end. And you need to get a better dictionary. Printthrough is what happens when you keep a reel to reel tape tightly wound up in storage for 20 years. The magnetized sections from one part of the tape partially magnetize the other part of the tape where they overlap. If you had studied anything about the acoustics you would have heard that for yourself in the very poor quality copies of the reel to reel tape may by Bowles. Exactly the same words are repeated at specific intervals before or after the original broadcast of the words. How many seconds depends on much tape was on the reel at that point. Steve Barber understands the principle of printthrough. The Gallery record he originally based his research on.
drummist1965
Post reply
More message actions
Apr 6
- show quoted text -
Of course they do. What else can we expect from conspiracy
theorists who can't accept the fact that it has been proven that it
was recorded on 11-22-63?
>
> Do you understand printthrough?
Of course I "understand printthrough". But "printthrough" occurs
only with magnetic tape, not plastic discs such as those used by the
DPD in 1963.
WIKI:
Backing thickness also affects print-through, the phenomenon of adjacent layers of tape wound on a reel picking up weak copies of the magnetic signal from each other. Print-through on analog tape causes unintended pre- and post-echoes on playback, and is generally not fully reversible once it has occurred.
>> You know, that aside to Haldeman where he said, "God damn it, I covered up
>> for Helms when he killed Kennedy and now God damn it, he's going to cover
>> up for me."
> Then why didn't this event make the news? And why wasn't Haldeman and
> Helms arrested and tried for the assassination? Cause this never happened.
Did I say anyone knew about this event? Why didn't Operation Northwoods make the news at the time?
Haldeman had nothing to do with the JFK assassination. He was just Nixon's messenger boy. Why is it that you don't know the basic facts about Watergate? Not born yet?
> On Friday, October 12, 2012 5:38:12 PM UTC-4, Anthony Marsh wrote:
>> That's why we pushed for the HSCA and their tests PROVED that
>> three shots were fired from the sniper's nest and one shot was fired
>> from the grassy knoll.
> They proved that experts can hear any damn thing they want in static. Are
> these also the experts who proved that Hargis was the only cop wearing
> gloves, or is that just another of your copyrighted theories?
Once again you prove that you know absolutely nothing about the acoustical evidence and refuse to do your homework.
No experts HEARD any shots on the tape. They were discovered mathematically by a correlation analysis.
Steve Barber is not an expert in anything but percussion and he was the one who proved that Hargis was the motorcycle cop wearing black gloves and I agree with him.
> > On Oct 2, 3:27 pm, "Research" <questio...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, I could see at one time he came to the window and he sat
> >> sideways on the window sill. That was previous to President Kennedy getting
> >> there. And I could see practically his whole body, from his hips up. But at
> >> the time that he was firing the gun, a possibility from his belt up.
> >> Mr. BELIN. How much of the gun do you believe that you saw?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. I calculate 70 to 85 percent of the gun.
> >> Mr. BELIN. Do you know what direction the gun was pointing.
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.
> >> Mr. BELIN. And what direction was the gun pointing when you saw it?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. At somewhat 30 degrees downward and west by south.
> >> Mr. BELIN. Do you know down what street it was pointing?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes. Down Elm Street toward the railroad underpasses.
> >> Mr. BELIN. Now, up to the time of the shots, did you observe anything else
> >> that you have not told us about here that you can think of right now?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, not of any importance. I don't remember anything else
> >> except--
> >> Mr. BELIN. Let me ask you this. How many shots did you hear?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Positively two. I do not recall a second shot--
> >> Mr. BELIN. By a second shot, you mean a middle shot between the time you
> >> heard the first noise and the last noise?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes; that is right. I don't know what made me think that there
> >> was firecrackers throwed out of the Book Store unless I did hear the second
> >> shot, because I positively thought the first shot was a backfire, and
> >> subconsciously must have heard a second shot, but I do not recall it. I
> >> could not swear to it.
> >> Mr. BELIN. Could you describe the man you saw in the window on the sixth
> >> floor?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. To my best description, a man in his early thirties, fair
> >> complexion, slender but neat, neat slender, possibly 5-foot 10.
> >> Mr. BELIN. About what weight?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Oh, at--I calculated, I think, from 160 to 170 pounds.
> >> After all that Brennan did not see the large scope mounted on the top of
> >> the rifle? How could he describe the rifle and not see the scope? Mighty
> >> FISHY thoughts!! He only heard two shots? HUMM mighty fishy!!
> >> Mr. BELIN. A white man? Mr. EUINS - The man in the window. I could see his
> >> hand, and I could see his other hand on the trigger, and one hand was on the
> >> barrel thing.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
> >> Now, at the time the second shot was fired, where were you looking then?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I was still looking at the building, you know, behind this--I
> >> was looking at the building.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Looking at anything special in the building?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. I was looking where the barrel was sticking out.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - How many shots did you hear altogether?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I believe there was four, to be exact.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Now, where were you looking at the time of the third shot, if
> >> you remember?
> >> Mr. EUINS - After he shot the first two times, I was just standing back
> >> here. And then after he shot again, he pulled the gun back in the window.
> >> And then all the police ran back over here in the track vicinity.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
> >> Now, when the third shot occurred, Amos, let me ask you again, where were
> >> you looking then?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I was still down here, looking up at the building.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - What did you see in the building?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I seen a bald spot on this man's head, trying to look out the
> >> window. He had a bald spot on his head. I was looking at the bald spot. I
> >> could see his hand, you know the rifle laying across in his hand. And I
> >> could see his hand sticking out on the trigger part. And after he got
> >> through, he just pulled it back in the window.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull it back in the window?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - And were you still standing at point B?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - When he pulled it back in the window?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind here, yes.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Where were you when you heard what you described as the fourth
> >> shot?
> >> Mr. EUINS - The first shot I was standing here.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Now you are referring to 366. Put an "L" on 366 where you were
> >> standing at the first shot.
> >> Mr. EUINS - Right here. (Witness marking.)
> >> Mr. EUINS - And then as I looked up there, you know, he fired another shot,
> >> you know, as I was looking. So I got behind this fountain thing right in
> >> there, at this point B.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - At point B, on 365?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I got behind there. And then I watched, he did fire again. Then
> >> he started looking down towards my way, and then he fired again.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - The question I have for you now is where were you when he
> >> fired on that fourth time.
> >> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind point B.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - You were still at point B when he fired the fourth time?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. Then he pulled the gun back in the window.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull the gun back in the window after the
> >> fourth shot?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes; he just come back like this.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Did you watch what he did after that?
> >> Mr. EUINS - No, sir; because after he had pulled it back in the window, I
> >> ran this way, and went across the tracks.
> >> Mighty FISHY Euins don't remember the scope either? And he heard four shots
> >> too? He saw the rifle sticking out the window about three feet. He saw both
> >> hands, the trigger and the "receiving group" but he can't see a 16" scope?
> >> Fishy. Mighty fishy!!!
> > ---------
> > How Many shots were fired President Kennedy?
> > Most people say three. Supposedly, one (the first) shot missed, one
> > shot hit JFK in the neck, passed through Connally and became the
> > alleged magic-bullet. And the third was the fatal shot that hit the
> > president in the head.
> > The Warren Wizards said: "The consensus among the witnesses at the
> > scene was that three shots were fired. However, some heard only two
> > shots. The most convincing evidence relating to the number of shots
> > was provided by the presence on the sixth floor of three spent
> > cartridges. This led the Commission to conclude that there were three
> > shots...." WR 110-111.
> > But, later they said, "The physical and other evidence examined by
> > the Commission compels the conclusion that AT LEAST TWO SHOTS WERE
> > FIRED... It is possible that the assassin carried an EMPTY SHELL IN
> > THE RIFLE and fired only two shots ...." WR 111
> > Summing up. One shot missed the car completely and there is no
> > record of recovering any of its remains. One shot allegedly passed
> Well, some WC defenders think that the missed shot hit the curb near
> Tague. One even thinks it hit the traffic light above Elm Street.
> > through Kennedy and Connally and magically remained near pristine and
> > ended up at Parkland Hospital. This bullet weighed 161 grains before
> > it was fired at the motorcade. When recovered it weighed 158.6 grains
> > which means that very little was lost in its destructive journey.
> We do not know how much that particular bullet weighed before it was
> fired. What if ALL the missing weight is what was taken out for testing?
> > A fragment weighing 0.5 grains was recovered from Connally's arm.
> > Audrey Bell, the operating nurse, stated that there were four or five
> > fragments "anywhere from three to four millimeters in length and a
> > couple of millimeters wide " These fragments disappeared at the
> > autopsy.
> You seem a little confused here. No fragments from Connally disappeared
> at the autopsy. It is illegal do to an autopsy on a person while he is
> still living. Even Dr. Frankenstein did not violate that rule.
Parkland Hospital Personnel
Audrey Bell, 20 Mar 1997
Side 1 (47:41)
Side 2 (35:40)
No transcript available.
Nurse Audrey Bell was the Parkland Hospital Supervisor of Operating
and Recovery Rooms in 1963. In the course of her work on November 22,
1963, she had an opportunity to view President Kennedy's wounds. She
also participated in the surgery on Governor Connally.
Nurse Bell described Kennedy's head wound as occipital, in the right
posterior portion of the head. She did not see his throat wound. She
recalled receiving "three to five fragments, perhaps four" from the
body of Governor Connally, more than are currently in EVIDENCE. She
viewed the Warren Commission photograph of these fragments and said
that they were too small. According to ARRB staff member Doug Horne,
Nurse Bell drew pictures of the fragments as she remembered them, but
ARRB Chief Counsel Jeremy Gunn refused to take her drawing into
evidence.
Audrey Bell also recalled phone calls from Bethesda to Dr. Perry on
Friday night, not Saturday morning as reported by the autopsy doctors
to the Warren Commission. This recollection, corroborated by Dr. John
Ebersole's formerly-secret HSCA testimony among others, would if true
cast grave doubt on the honesty of the reporting about the autopsy
findings, and make all the more suspicious the fact that the neck was
not dissected to track the bullet path.
> > On Oct 2, 3:27 pm, "Research" <questio...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, I could see at one time he came to the window and he > >> sat
> >> sideways on the window sill. That was previous to President Kennedy > >> getting
> >> there. And I could see practically his whole body, from his hips up. > >> But at
> >> the time that he was firing the gun, a possibility from his belt up.
> >> Mr. BELIN. How much of the gun do you believe that you saw?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. I calculate 70 to 85 percent of the gun.
> >> Mr. BELIN. Do you know what direction the gun was pointing.
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.
> >> Mr. BELIN. And what direction was the gun pointing when you saw it?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. At somewhat 30 degrees downward and west by south.
> >> Mr. BELIN. Do you know down what street it was pointing?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes. Down Elm Street toward the railroad underpasses.
> >> Mr. BELIN. Now, up to the time of the shots, did you observe anything > >> else
> >> that you have not told us about here that you can think of right now?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, not of any importance. I don't remember anything > >> else
> >> except--
> >> Mr. BELIN. Let me ask you this. How many shots did you hear?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Positively two. I do not recall a second shot--
> >> Mr. BELIN. By a second shot, you mean a middle shot between the time > >> you
> >> heard the first noise and the last noise?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes; that is right. I don't know what made me think that > >> there
> >> was firecrackers throwed out of the Book Store unless I did hear the > >> second
> >> shot, because I positively thought the first shot was a backfire, and
> >> subconsciously must have heard a second shot, but I do not recall it. I
> >> could not swear to it.
> >> Mr. BELIN. Could you describe the man you saw in the window on the > >> sixth
> >> floor?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. To my best description, a man in his early thirties, fair
> >> complexion, slender but neat, neat slender, possibly 5-foot 10.
> >> Mr. BELIN. About what weight?
> >> Mr. BRENNAN. Oh, at--I calculated, I think, from 160 to 170 pounds.
> >> After all that Brennan did not see the large scope mounted on the top > >> of
> >> the rifle? How could he describe the rifle and not see the scope? > >> Mighty
> >> FISHY thoughts!! He only heard two shots? HUMM mighty fishy!!
> >> Mr. BELIN. A white man? Mr. EUINS - The man in the window. I could see > >> his
> >> hand, and I could see his other hand on the trigger, and one hand was > >> on the
> >> barrel thing.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
> >> Now, at the time the second shot was fired, where were you looking > >> then?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I was still looking at the building, you know, behind > >> this--I
> >> was looking at the building.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Looking at anything special in the building?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. I was looking where the barrel was sticking out.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - How many shots did you hear altogether?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I believe there was four, to be exact.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Now, where were you looking at the time of the third > >> shot, if
> >> you remember?
> >> Mr. EUINS - After he shot the first two times, I was just standing back
> >> here. And then after he shot again, he pulled the gun back in the > >> window.
> >> And then all the police ran back over here in the track vicinity.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
> >> Now, when the third shot occurred, Amos, let me ask you again, where > >> were
> >> you looking then?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I was still down here, looking up at the building.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - What did you see in the building?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I seen a bald spot on this man's head, trying to look out > >> the
> >> window. He had a bald spot on his head. I was looking at the bald spot. > >> I
> >> could see his hand, you know the rifle laying across in his hand. And I
> >> could see his hand sticking out on the trigger part. And after he got
> >> through, he just pulled it back in the window.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull it back in the window?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - And were you still standing at point B?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - When he pulled it back in the window?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind here, yes.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Where were you when you heard what you described as the > >> fourth
> >> shot?
> >> Mr. EUINS - The first shot I was standing here.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Now you are referring to 366. Put an "L" on 366 where you > >> were
> >> standing at the first shot.
> >> Mr. EUINS - Right here. (Witness marking.)
> >> Mr. EUINS - And then as I looked up there, you know, he fired another > >> shot,
> >> you know, as I was looking. So I got behind this fountain thing right > >> in
> >> there, at this point B.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - At point B, on 365?
> >> Mr. EUINS - I got behind there. And then I watched, he did fire again. > >> Then
> >> he started looking down towards my way, and then he fired again.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - The question I have for you now is where were you when he
> >> fired on that fourth time.
> >> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind point B.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - You were still at point B when he fired the fourth time?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. Then he pulled the gun back in the window.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull the gun back in the window after the
> >> fourth shot?
> >> Mr. EUINS - Yes; he just come back like this.
> >> Mr. SPECTER - Did you watch what he did after that?
> >> Mr. EUINS - No, sir; because after he had pulled it back in the window, > >> I
> >> ran this way, and went across the tracks.
> >> Mighty FISHY Euins don't remember the scope either? And he heard four > >> shots
> >> too? He saw the rifle sticking out the window about three feet. He saw > >> both
> >> hands, the trigger and the "receiving group" but he can't see a 16" > >> scope? Fishy. Mighty fishy!!!
> > ---------
> > How Many shots were fired President Kennedy?
> > Most people say three. Supposedly, one (the first) shot missed, one
> > shot hit JFK in the neck, passed through Connally and became the
> > alleged magic-bullet. And the third was the fatal shot that hit the
> > president in the head.
> > The Warren Wizards said: "The consensus among the witnesses at the
> > scene was that three shots were fired. However, some heard only two
> > shots. The most convincing evidence relating to the number of shots
> > was provided by the presence on the sixth floor of three spent
> > cartridges. This led the Commission to conclude that there were three
> > shots...." WR 110-111.
> > But, later they said, "The physical and other evidence examined by
> > the Commission compels the conclusion that AT LEAST TWO SHOTS WERE
> > FIRED... It is possible that the assassin carried an EMPTY SHELL IN
> > THE RIFLE and fired only two shots ...." WR 111
There was three empty shells laying on the floor and one live round in the rifle. So the LNers claim.
> > Summing up. One shot missed the car completely and there is no
> > record of recovering any of its remains. One shot allegedly passed
> Well, some WC defenders think that the missed shot hit the curb near
> Tague. One even thinks it hit the traffic light above Elm Street.
Wow that had to be some more bad aim. Because that shot was fired way before the limo got to that position.
> > through Kennedy and Connally and magically remained near pristine and
> > ended up at Parkland Hospital. This bullet weighed 161 grains before
> > it was fired at the motorcade. When recovered it weighed 158.6 grains
> > which means that very little was lost in its destructive journey.
> We do not know how much that particular bullet weighed before it was
> fired. What if ALL the missing weight is what was taken out for testing?
> > A fragment weighing 0.5 grains was recovered from Connally's arm.
> > Audrey Bell, the operating nurse, stated that there were four or five
> > fragments "anywhere from three to four millimeters in length and a
> > couple of millimeters wide " These fragments disappeared at the
> > autopsy.
> You seem a little confused here. No fragments from Connally disappeared
> at the autopsy. It is illegal do to an autopsy on a person while he is
> still living. Even Dr. Frankenstein did not violate that rule.
Parkland Hospital Personnel
Audrey Bell, 20 Mar 1997
Side 1 (47:41)
Side 2 (35:40)
No transcript available.
Nurse Audrey Bell was the Parkland Hospital Supervisor of Operating
and Recovery Rooms in 1963. In the course of her work on November 22,
1963, she had an opportunity to view President Kennedy's wounds. She
also participated in the surgery on Governor Connally.
Nurse Bell described Kennedy's head wound as occipital, in the right
posterior portion of the head. She did not see his throat wound. She
recalled receiving "three to five fragments, perhaps four" from the
body of Governor Connally, more than are currently in EVIDENCE. She
viewed the Warren Commission photograph of these fragments and said
that they were too small. According to ARRB staff member Doug Horne,
Nurse Bell drew pictures of the fragments as she remembered them, but
ARRB Chief Counsel Jeremy Gunn refused to take her drawing into
evidence.
Audrey Bell also recalled phone calls from Bethesda to Dr. Perry on
Friday night, not Saturday morning as reported by the autopsy doctors
to the Warren Commission. This recollection, corroborated by Dr. John
Ebersole's formerly-secret HSCA testimony among others, would if true
cast grave doubt on
...
> On 10/13/2012 11:32 AM, Research wrote:
>> "Anthony Marsh" <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> news:507856b7$1@mcadams.posc.mu.edu...
>>> On 10/11/2012 10:50 PM, Research wrote:
>>>> I read you post and agree with what you said. Thanks for intrest in my
>>>> thoughts. You answer, even though intriging, did not answer the >>>> question.
>>>> The question was, was there any other witnesses who saw the rifle in >>>> the
>>>> window? Cause I don't think there was only three shot. I do think the
>>>> assassin's nest a ploy and the MC was a throw down. But proving it is >>>> the
>>>> million dollar answer.
>>> Your question is nonsense. People seeing a rifle in the window does not
>>> prove it was fired and does not rule out a second rifle from somewhere
>>> else. That's why we pushed for the HSCA and their tests PROVED that >>> three
>>> shots were fired from the sniper's nest and one shot was fired from the
>>> grassy knoll.
>>> Maybe more refined tests could even prove that it was Oswald's rifle >>> that
>>> fired all three shots. But in the meantime the recovered bullet and
>>> fragments were fired from Oswald's rifle.
>>>> I also find it curious that only two (so far) witnesses out of the over >>>> 3
>>>> hundred looked up to the depository. Hundreds of people stood on the
>>> Only two did WHAT? Looked up? Saw the rifle? Maybe many more did, but >>> were
>>> never questioned.
>>>> corner around the building and only two looked up. I can't believe in
>>>> only
>>>> 3 shots and that these shots came from the dep. Many of the people the >>>> WC
>>>> claimed heard 3 shots from the dep was not even asked. Some of these
>>>> witneses claimed the FBI had them sign blank affidavids and when they
>>>> found out the affidavids were falsified, it was to late.
>>> Something like that. I'd like to see you document whatever you think you
>>> are claiming.
>>>> All the evidence around the MC can be discredited. Oswald had to die to
>>>> keep him out of court. The circumstantial evidence of the case would >>>> not
>>>> hold up. The bent shell is only one example. The "eye" witnesses who >>>> did
>>> Not true. Remember where this case would be tried. Dallas, Texas. Wade >>> had
>>> 25 convictions out of 26 cases. Wade could have convicted a ham >>> sandwich.
>> I can believe it. Dallas runs one of theose kangaroo courts. Where many
>> still exist today. Hell, they just arrested a local coroner in my area,
>> just like they been doing all over the country. For falsefing evidence.
>>>> not see the large scope mounted on the rifle is another issue. They
>>>> described they saw the shooter's finger on the trigger. But they did >>>> not
>>>> see the scope? I personally think the shooter, if there really was one,
>>>> used an automatic rifle without a scope. I say automatic because the
>>>> shots
>>> Never rely on witnesses.
>>>> sound timing were to close together to be a bolt-action. The second and
>>>> third shots were reported to almost on top of each other. The dictabelt
>>> The acoustical evidence rules out an automatic.
>> Do you mean the dictabelt that was said to be faked?
> You are still confused. No one said the Dictabelt is faked.
>>>> showed them 1/2 second apart. Could have been from the dep but I rather
>>> You know nothing about the Dictabelt. Those two shots separated by less
>>> than a second are not from the same weapon. They are from two weapons in
>>> two different locations. Try reading the evidence before setting out to
>>> dream up wacky theories.
>> What two rifles? That's it you proved the conspiracy. Get out the
>> trumpets!
> It was the acoustical evidence finding two rifles which proved the > conspiracy.
What about the 3 shots from the window? And the 3 spent shells on the floor? I mean. I don't contest the accoustical evidence, even though I do think the conclusions were flawed. Because there was more than 3 or 4 shots.
>>>> think from two different directions. And I also think the dictabelt was >>>> a
>>>> fake, to cover up the fact that there was a conspiracy and shots were
>>>> fired from different directions. I'm not saying Oswald was a patsy. It
>>>> might have been him in the window, but with help from the knoll.
>>> So your brilliant conspirators cover up their conspiracy by planting a
>>> fake Dictabelt which proves conspiracy? Boy are these guys brilliant. So
>>> Nixon planted a fake WH tape of an innocent conversation which had >>> dozens
>>> of erasures over 18-1/2 minutes only to MAKE it look like he was
>>> destroying evidence of conspiracy?
>> Hey I'm not the one who said it was faked. It was "experts" like, humm,
>> yourself.
> I did not state a fact, I asked an ironic question. Is this the very first > time you have seen that rhetorical technique used? Are you really that > uneducated?
.)
> And don't try to insult me by claiming that anyone else was smart enough > to think of that solution.
LOL ')
>>> Ah ha, but what he didn't know is that the real conversation was
>>> accidentally duplicated on an early part of the tape via printthtough!
>> Printthought isn't even a word, much less a mechanical anomility.
> I didn't have a "t" at the end. And you need to get a better dictionary. > Printthrough is what happens when you keep a reel to reel tape tightly > wound up in storage for 20 years. The magnetized sections from one part of > the tape partially magnetize the other part of the tape where they > overlap. If you had studied anything about the acoustics you would have > heard that for yourself in the very poor quality copies of the reel to > reel tape may by Bowles. Exactly the same words are repeated at specific > intervals before or after the original broadcast of the words. How many > seconds depends on much tape was on the reel at that point. Steve Barber > understands the principle of printthrough. The Gallery record he > originally based his research on.
> drummist1965 Post reply
> More message actions
> Apr 6
> - show quoted text -
> Of course they do. What else can we expect from conspiracy
> theorists who can't accept the fact that it has been proven that it
> was recorded on 11-22-63?
> > Do you understand printthrough?
> Of course I "understand printthrough". But "printthrough" occurs
> only with magnetic tape, not plastic discs such as those used by the
> DPD in 1963.
> WIKI:
> Backing thickness also affects print-through, the phenomenon of adjacent > layers of tape wound on a reel picking up weak copies of the magnetic > signal from each other. Print-through on analog tape causes unintended > pre- and post-echoes on playback, and is generally not fully reversible > once it has occurred.
>>> You know, that aside to Haldeman where he said, "God damn it, I covered >>> up
>>> for Helms when he killed Kennedy and now God damn it, he's going to >>> cover
>>> up for me."
>> Then why didn't this event make the news? And why wasn't Haldeman and
>> Helms arrested and tried for the assassination? Cause this never >> happened.
> Did I say anyone knew about this event? Why didn't Operation Northwoods > make the news at the time?
> Haldeman had nothing to do with the JFK assassination. He was just Nixon's > messenger boy. Why is it that you don't know the basic facts about > Watergate? Not born yet?
> On Oct 11, 9:01 pm, Anthony Marsh <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> On 10/10/2012 4:15 PM, Raymond wrote:
>>> On Oct 2, 3:27 pm, "Research" <questio...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, I could see at one time he came to the window and he sat
>>>> sideways on the window sill. That was previous to President Kennedy getting
>>>> there. And I could see practically his whole body, from his hips up. But at
>>>> the time that he was firing the gun, a possibility from his belt up.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. How much of the gun do you believe that you saw?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. I calculate 70 to 85 percent of the gun.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Do you know what direction the gun was pointing.
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. And what direction was the gun pointing when you saw it?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. At somewhat 30 degrees downward and west by south.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Do you know down what street it was pointing?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes. Down Elm Street toward the railroad underpasses.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Now, up to the time of the shots, did you observe anything else
>>>> that you have not told us about here that you can think of right now?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, not of any importance. I don't remember anything else
>>>> except--
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Let me ask you this. How many shots did you hear?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Positively two. I do not recall a second shot--
>>>> Mr. BELIN. By a second shot, you mean a middle shot between the time you
>>>> heard the first noise and the last noise?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes; that is right. I don't know what made me think that there
>>>> was firecrackers throwed out of the Book Store unless I did hear the second
>>>> shot, because I positively thought the first shot was a backfire, and
>>>> subconsciously must have heard a second shot, but I do not recall it. I
>>>> could not swear to it.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Could you describe the man you saw in the window on the sixth
>>>> floor?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. To my best description, a man in his early thirties, fair
>>>> complexion, slender but neat, neat slender, possibly 5-foot 10.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. About what weight?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Oh, at--I calculated, I think, from 160 to 170 pounds.
>>>> After all that Brennan did not see the large scope mounted on the top of
>>>> the rifle? How could he describe the rifle and not see the scope? Mighty
>>>> FISHY thoughts!! He only heard two shots? HUMM mighty fishy!!
>>>> Mr. BELIN. A white man? Mr. EUINS - The man in the window. I could see his
>>>> hand, and I could see his other hand on the trigger, and one hand was on the
>>>> barrel thing.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
>>>> Now, at the time the second shot was fired, where were you looking then?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I was still looking at the building, you know, behind this--I
>>>> was looking at the building.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Looking at anything special in the building?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. I was looking where the barrel was sticking out.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - How many shots did you hear altogether?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I believe there was four, to be exact.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Now, where were you looking at the time of the third shot, if
>>>> you remember?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - After he shot the first two times, I was just standing back
>>>> here. And then after he shot again, he pulled the gun back in the window.
>>>> And then all the police ran back over here in the track vicinity.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
>>>> Now, when the third shot occurred, Amos, let me ask you again, where were
>>>> you looking then?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I was still down here, looking up at the building.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - What did you see in the building?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I seen a bald spot on this man's head, trying to look out the
>>>> window. He had a bald spot on his head. I was looking at the bald spot. I
>>>> could see his hand, you know the rifle laying across in his hand. And I
>>>> could see his hand sticking out on the trigger part. And after he got
>>>> through, he just pulled it back in the window.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull it back in the window?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - And were you still standing at point B?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - When he pulled it back in the window?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind here, yes.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Where were you when you heard what you described as the fourth
>>>> shot?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - The first shot I was standing here.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Now you are referring to 366. Put an "L" on 366 where you were
>>>> standing at the first shot.
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Right here. (Witness marking.)
>>>> Mr. EUINS - And then as I looked up there, you know, he fired another shot,
>>>> you know, as I was looking. So I got behind this fountain thing right in
>>>> there, at this point B.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - At point B, on 365?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I got behind there. And then I watched, he did fire again. Then
>>>> he started looking down towards my way, and then he fired again.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - The question I have for you now is where were you when he
>>>> fired on that fourth time.
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind point B.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - You were still at point B when he fired the fourth time?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. Then he pulled the gun back in the window.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull the gun back in the window after the
>>>> fourth shot?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes; he just come back like this.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Did you watch what he did after that?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - No, sir; because after he had pulled it back in the window, I
>>>> ran this way, and went across the tracks.
>>>> Mighty FISHY Euins don't remember the scope either? And he heard four shots
>>>> too? He saw the rifle sticking out the window about three feet. He saw both
>>>> hands, the trigger and the "receiving group" but he can't see a 16" scope?
>>>> Fishy. Mighty fishy!!!
>>> ---------
>>> How Many shots were fired President Kennedy?
>>> Most people say three. Supposedly, one (the first) shot missed, one
>>> shot hit JFK in the neck, passed through Connally and became the
>>> alleged magic-bullet. And the third was the fatal shot that hit the
>>> president in the head.
>>> The Warren Wizards said: "The consensus among the witnesses at the
>>> scene was that three shots were fired. However, some heard only two
>>> shots. The most convincing evidence relating to the number of shots
>>> was provided by the presence on the sixth floor of three spent
>>> cartridges. This led the Commission to conclude that there were three
>>> shots...." WR 110-111.
>>> But, later they said, "The physical and other evidence examined by
>>> the Commission compels the conclusion that AT LEAST TWO SHOTS WERE
>>> FIRED... It is possible that the assassin carried an EMPTY SHELL IN
>>> THE RIFLE and fired only two shots ...." WR 111
>>> Summing up. One shot missed the car completely and there is no
>>> record of recovering any of its remains. One shot allegedly passed
>> Well, some WC defenders think that the missed shot hit the curb near
>> Tague. One even thinks it hit the traffic light above Elm Street.
>>> through Kennedy and Connally and magically remained near pristine and
>>> ended up at Parkland Hospital. This bullet weighed 161 grains before
>>> it was fired at the motorcade. When recovered it weighed 158.6 grains
>>> which means that very little was lost in its destructive journey.
>> We do not know how much that particular bullet weighed before it was
>> fired. What if ALL the missing weight is what was taken out for testing?
>>> A fragment weighing 0.5 grains was recovered from Connally's arm.
>>> Audrey Bell, the operating nurse, stated that there were four or five
>>> fragments "anywhere from three to four millimeters in length and a
>>> couple of millimeters wide " These fragments disappeared at the
>>> autopsy.
>> You seem a little confused here. No fragments from Connally disappeared
>> at the autopsy. It is illegal do to an autopsy on a person while he is
>> still living. Even Dr. Frankenstein did not violate that rule.
> Parkland Hospital Personnel
> Audrey Bell, 20 Mar 1997
> Side 1 (47:41)
> Side 2 (35:40)
> No transcript available.
> Nurse Audrey Bell was the Parkland Hospital Supervisor of Operating
> and Recovery Rooms in 1963. In the course of her work on November 22,
> 1963, she had an opportunity to view President Kennedy's wounds. She
> also participated in the surgery on Governor Connally.
> Nurse Bell described Kennedy's head wound as occipital, in the right
> posterior portion of the head. She did not see his throat wound. She
> recalled receiving "three to five fragments, perhaps four" from the
> body of Governor Connally, more than are currently in EVIDENCE. She
Never rely on witnesses. She was not a forensic pathologist. She did not weigh the fragments.
The evidence has changed over the years. There used to be more fragments than there are now. But no proof that the original fragments added up to more than was missing from CE399.
> viewed the Warren Commission photograph of these fragments and said
> that they were too small. According to ARRB staff member Doug Horne,
Which fragments? Show me the photograph you think she meant.
> Nurse Bell drew pictures of the fragments as she remembered them, but
> ARRB Chief Counsel Jeremy Gunn refused to take her drawing into
> evidence.
> Audrey Bell also recalled phone calls from Bethesda to Dr. Perry on
> Friday night, not Saturday morning as reported by the autopsy doctors
Not reliable.
And what's the difference between Friday night a couple of hours after midnight and early Saturday morning.
>>> On Oct 2, 3:27 pm, "Research" <questio...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, I could see at one time he came to the window and he
>>>> sat
>>>> sideways on the window sill. That was previous to President Kennedy
>>>> getting
>>>> there. And I could see practically his whole body, from his hips up.
>>>> But at
>>>> the time that he was firing the gun, a possibility from his belt up.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. How much of the gun do you believe that you saw?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. I calculate 70 to 85 percent of the gun.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Do you know what direction the gun was pointing.
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. And what direction was the gun pointing when you saw it?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. At somewhat 30 degrees downward and west by south.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Do you know down what street it was pointing?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes. Down Elm Street toward the railroad underpasses.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Now, up to the time of the shots, did you observe anything
>>>> else
>>>> that you have not told us about here that you can think of right now?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Well, not of any importance. I don't remember anything
>>>> else
>>>> except--
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Let me ask you this. How many shots did you hear?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Positively two. I do not recall a second shot--
>>>> Mr. BELIN. By a second shot, you mean a middle shot between the time
>>>> you
>>>> heard the first noise and the last noise?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Yes; that is right. I don't know what made me think that
>>>> there
>>>> was firecrackers throwed out of the Book Store unless I did hear the
>>>> second
>>>> shot, because I positively thought the first shot was a backfire, and
>>>> subconsciously must have heard a second shot, but I do not recall it. I
>>>> could not swear to it.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. Could you describe the man you saw in the window on the
>>>> sixth
>>>> floor?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. To my best description, a man in his early thirties, fair
>>>> complexion, slender but neat, neat slender, possibly 5-foot 10.
>>>> Mr. BELIN. About what weight?
>>>> Mr. BRENNAN. Oh, at--I calculated, I think, from 160 to 170 pounds.
>>>> After all that Brennan did not see the large scope mounted on the top
>>>> of
>>>> the rifle? How could he describe the rifle and not see the scope?
>>>> Mighty
>>>> FISHY thoughts!! He only heard two shots? HUMM mighty fishy!!
>>>> Mr. BELIN. A white man? Mr. EUINS - The man in the window. I could see
>>>> his
>>>> hand, and I could see his other hand on the trigger, and one hand was
>>>> on the
>>>> barrel thing.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
>>>> Now, at the time the second shot was fired, where were you looking
>>>> then?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I was still looking at the building, you know, behind
>>>> this--I
>>>> was looking at the building.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Looking at anything special in the building?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. I was looking where the barrel was sticking out.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - How many shots did you hear altogether?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I believe there was four, to be exact.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Now, where were you looking at the time of the third
>>>> shot, if
>>>> you remember?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - After he shot the first two times, I was just standing back
>>>> here. And then after he shot again, he pulled the gun back in the
>>>> window.
>>>> And then all the police ran back over here in the track vicinity.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - All right.
>>>> Now, when the third shot occurred, Amos, let me ask you again, where
>>>> were
>>>> you looking then?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I was still down here, looking up at the building.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - What did you see in the building?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I seen a bald spot on this man's head, trying to look out
>>>> the
>>>> window. He had a bald spot on his head. I was looking at the bald spot.
>>>> I
>>>> could see his hand, you know the rifle laying across in his hand. And I
>>>> could see his hand sticking out on the trigger part. And after he got
>>>> through, he just pulled it back in the window.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull it back in the window?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - And were you still standing at point B?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - When he pulled it back in the window?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind here, yes.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Where were you when you heard what you described as the
>>>> fourth
>>>> shot?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - The first shot I was standing here.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Now you are referring to 366. Put an "L" on 366 where you
>>>> were
>>>> standing at the first shot.
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Right here. (Witness marking.)
>>>> Mr. EUINS - And then as I looked up there, you know, he fired another
>>>> shot,
>>>> you know, as I was looking. So I got behind this fountain thing right
>>>> in
>>>> there, at this point B.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - At point B, on 365?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I got behind there. And then I watched, he did fire again.
>>>> Then
>>>> he started looking down towards my way, and then he fired again.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - The question I have for you now is where were you when he
>>>> fired on that fourth time.
>>>> Mr. EUINS - I was still behind point B.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - You were still at point B when he fired the fourth time?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes, sir. Then he pulled the gun back in the window.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Did you see him pull the gun back in the window after the
>>>> fourth shot?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - Yes; he just come back like this.
>>>> Mr. SPECTER - Did you watch what he did after that?
>>>> Mr. EUINS - No, sir; because after he had pulled it back in the window,
>>>> I
>>>> ran this way, and went across the tracks.
>>>> Mighty FISHY Euins don't remember the scope either? And he heard four
>>>> shots
>>>> too? He saw the rifle sticking out the window about three feet. He saw
>>>> both
>>>> hands, the trigger and the "receiving group" but he can't see a 16"
>>>> scope? Fishy. Mighty fishy!!!
>>> ---------
>>> How Many shots were fired President Kennedy?
>>> Most people say three. Supposedly, one (the first) shot missed, one
>>> shot hit JFK in the neck, passed through Connally and became the
>>> alleged magic-bullet. And the third was the fatal shot that hit the
>>> president in the head.
>>> The Warren Wizards said: "The consensus among the witnesses at the
>>> scene was that three shots were fired. However, some heard only two
>>> shots. The most convincing evidence relating to the number of shots
>>> was provided by the presence on the sixth floor of three spent
>>> cartridges. This led the Commission to conclude that there were three
>>> shots...." WR 110-111.
>>> But, later they said, "The physical and other evidence examined by
>>> the Commission compels the conclusion that AT LEAST TWO SHOTS WERE
>>> FIRED... It is possible that the assassin carried an EMPTY SHELL IN
>>> THE RIFLE and fired only two shots ...." WR 111
> There was three empty shells laying on the floor and one live round in the
> rifle. So the LNers claim.
>>> Summing up. One shot missed the car completely and there is no
>>> record of recovering any of its remains. One shot allegedly passed
>> Well, some WC defenders think that the missed shot hit the curb near
>> Tague. One even thinks it hit the traffic light above Elm Street.
> Wow that had to be some more bad aim. Because that shot was fired way before
> the limo got to that position.
>>> through Kennedy and Connally and magically remained near pristine and
>>> ended up at Parkland Hospital. This bullet weighed 161 grains before
>>> it was fired at the motorcade. When recovered it weighed 158.6 grains
>>> which means that very little was lost in its destructive journey.
>> We do not know how much that particular bullet weighed before it was
>> fired. What if ALL the missing weight is what was taken out for testing?
>>> A fragment weighing 0.5 grains was recovered from Connally's arm.
>>> Audrey Bell, the operating nurse, stated that there were four or five
>>> fragments "anywhere from three to four millimeters in length and a
>>> couple of millimeters wide " These fragments disappeared at the
>>> autopsy.
>> You seem a little confused here. No fragments from Connally disappeared
>> at the autopsy. It is illegal do to an autopsy on a person while he is
>> still living. Even Dr. Frankenstein did not violate that rule.
> Parkland Hospital Personnel
> Audrey Bell, 20 Mar 1997
> Side 1 (47:41)
> Side 2 (35:40)
> No transcript available.
> Nurse Audrey Bell was the Parkland Hospital Supervisor of Operating
> and Recovery Rooms in 1963. In the course of her work on November 22,
> 1963, she had an opportunity to view President Kennedy's wounds. She
> also participated in the surgery on Governor Connally.
> Nurse Bell described Kennedy's head wound as occipital, in the right
> posterior portion of the head. She did not see his throat wound. She
> recalled receiving "three to five fragments, perhaps four" from the
> body of Governor Connally, more than are currently in EVIDENCE. She
> viewed the Warren Commission photograph of these fragments and said
> that they were too small. According to ARRB staff member Doug Horne,
> Nurse Bell drew pictures of the fragments as she remembered them, but
> ARRB Chief Counsel Jeremy Gunn refused to take her drawing into
> evidence.
> Audrey Bell also recalled phone calls from Bethesda to Dr. Perry on
> Friday night, not Saturday morning as reported by the autopsy doctors
> to the Warren Commission. This recollection, corroborated by Dr. John
> > > So this leaves one bullet and it had to be the fatal projectile that
> > > removed part of the president's skull and much of his brains.
> > Indeed.
> > > After the coup,
> > What coup?
> President Kennedy was much more conservative than VP Johnson. If LBJ
> was the mastermind behind this assassination, as some CTs believe,
> then this was a Liberal coup to overthrow a Conservative Democrat.
I understand what they believe. I asked "What coup?" because this is an *unproven* belief. ;-)
