What say you, LNers?

[charles wallace]

It makes the LNers feel superior to think they know it was Oswald who
killed JFK. It's sad but poor Oswald who shot at Walker and most likely
killed Officer Tippit did not have anything to do with the assassination
of JFK except being tricked into bringing his rifle to work that Friday.
Now Oswald was not the only person tricked that day. The tricking
continues to even this minute. The original trickster died years ago, I
believe. The tricking that continues now I hope is just out of sheer
ignorance.

If Oswald had anything to do with the assassination he would not have left
an empty shell in the firing chamber of the MC rifle when bringing it to
work. He would not have stuck the rifle out of the window for people to
see just before the motorcade arrived at Main and Houston. He would have
left the rifle at the window after the shooting and not carried it to the
staircase. He would not have moved boxes around after the shots. He would
not have stuck around at the window after the shooting to be photographed
by Dillard and be seen by witness, Lillian Mooneyham.

Charles

[Cambridge Ray]

Here's an hypothesis:

- The MC was showed off through the sniper's nest (east window)
during the Main to Houston turn.

- The back shot was done from the west window. (*)

- The MC was hidden in the back of the room and the spent shells
placed in the sniper's nest.

(*) The owner of the building, Mr. Byrd, reportedly asked for a
souvenir: the west window, which he kept for years in his home.

-Ramon

[bigdog]

> -Ramon- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Fun stuff when you don't require any evidence or a hypothesis that
makes one bit of sense.

[Anthony Marsh]

Doesn't work. The fragments found in the limo were shot from Oswald's
Mannlicher-Carcano. To preserve that hypothesis you'd have to add an extra
step of having them use sabots to fire prefired M-C bullets from a larger
caliber rifle. There are some technical problems with that. FYI, my
computer program can test your hypothesis about the shots being fired from
a different window. But the BBN tests pinpoint 3 shots fired from the
sniper's nest. More refined tests could indicate it was a
Mannlicher-Carcano.

[Questionin]

"Anthony Marsh" <anthon...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:4e653b69$1...@mcadams.posc.mu.edu...

Weren't the BNN test proven to be false. Funny you LNers claim that if a
CTer points to the evidence. Then you use it anyway. Is this evidence
viable or not?

>
>

[bigdog]

On Sep 6, 7:14 pm, "Questionin" <Questi...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> "Anthony Marsh" <anthony.ma...@comcast.net> wrote in message

Yes.

> Funny you LNers claim that if a
> CTer points to the evidence. Then you use it anyway. Is this evidence
> viable or not?
>

Marsh does secretly believe that Oswald acted alone.

[charles wallace]

On Sep 4, 6:32 pm, charles wallace <charles63...@gmail.com> wrote:

If Oswald had been a lone gunman there would never have been a APB put
out on Charles Givens.

TSBD employee Charles Givens went to the sixth floor approximately at
noon to get his cigarettes that he had forgotten to take with him when
he had left for lunch about ten minutes earlier. He saw Oswald coming
from the SE corner window area. He and Oswald were alone on the floor
at that time, so he thought.

DPD Inspector Herbert Sawyer in front of the TSBD directing police
officers right after the assassination was told by someone that
Charles Givens could name the shooter on the sixth floor. If any
LNers were interested in the truth of who the shooter was they would
try and identify who that was that told Sawyer to find Givens because
that person was obviously in hiding on the sixth floor and saw Givens
and Oswald meet.

[bigdog]

On Sep 7, 8:04 am, charles wallace <charles63...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sep 4, 6:32 pm, charles wallace <charles63...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > It makes the LNers feel superior to think they know it was Oswald who
> > killed JFK.  It's sad but poor Oswald who shot at Walker and most likely
> > killed Officer Tippit did not have anything to do with the assassination
> > of JFK except being tricked into bringing his rifle to work that Friday.  
> > Now Oswald was not the only person tricked that day.  The tricking
> > continues to even this minute. The original trickster died years ago, I
> > believe. The tricking that continues now I hope is just out of sheer
> > ignorance.
>
> > If Oswald had anything to do with the assassination he would not have left
> > an empty shell in the firing chamber of the MC rifle when bringing it to
> > work. He would not have stuck the rifle out of the window for people to
> > see just before the motorcade arrived at Main and Houston. He would have
> > left the rifle at the window after the shooting and not carried it to the
> > staircase.  He would not have moved boxes around after the shots. He would
> > not have stuck around at the window after the shooting to be photographed
> > by Dillard and be seen by witness, Lillian Mooneyham.
>
> > Charles
>
> If Oswald had been a lone gunman there would never have been a APB put
> out on Charles Givens.
>

Why not. At the time the APB had been put out, there was no prime suspect.
The investigators had just begun and Givens was a person of interest. That
changed very quickly. Oswald too became a person of interest when it was
discovered he went AWOL and a little more than an hour later when he was
arrested for killing Tippit, he became the prime suspect. When the
physical evidence came in, it clinched it.

That's the way it works in the real world. The universe of possible
suspects is large and is gradually narrowed down until the the
perpetrator(s) is identified. It works just the opposite in the CT world.
There is an ever expanding universe of suspects. If one suspect doesn't
work out, just add a few more.

> TSBD employee Charles Givens went to the sixth floor approximately at
> noon to get his cigarettes that he had forgotten to take with him when
> he had left for lunch about ten minutes earlier.  He saw Oswald coming
> from the SE corner window area.  He and Oswald were alone on the floor
> at that time, so he thought.
>
> DPD Inspector Herbert Sawyer in front of the TSBD directing police
> officers right after the assassination was told by someone that
> Charles Givens could name the shooter on the sixth floor.  If any
> LNers were interested in the truth of who the shooter was they would
> try and identify who that was that told Sawyer to find Givens because
> that person was obviously in hiding on the sixth floor and saw Givens
> and Oswald meet.

Why don't you identify who that person was and then tell us why that
would disqualify Oswald as a suspect.

[Cambridge Ray]

> FYI, my computer program can test your hypothesis about the shots

> being fired from a different window.

What computer program? Is it widely available?

-Ramon

[Anthony Marsh]

On 9/7/2011 8:04 AM, charles wallace wrote:
> On Sep 4, 6:32 pm, charles wallace<charles63...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> It makes the LNers feel superior to think they know it was Oswald who
>> killed JFK. It's sad but poor Oswald who shot at Walker and most likely
>> killed Officer Tippit did not have anything to do with the assassination
>> of JFK except being tricked into bringing his rifle to work that Friday.
>> Now Oswald was not the only person tricked that day. The tricking
>> continues to even this minute. The original trickster died years ago, I
>> believe. The tricking that continues now I hope is just out of sheer
>> ignorance.
>>
>> If Oswald had anything to do with the assassination he would not have left
>> an empty shell in the firing chamber of the MC rifle when bringing it to
>> work. He would not have stuck the rifle out of the window for people to
>> see just before the motorcade arrived at Main and Houston. He would have
>> left the rifle at the window after the shooting and not carried it to the
>> staircase. He would not have moved boxes around after the shots. He would
>> not have stuck around at the window after the shooting to be photographed
>> by Dillard and be seen by witness, Lillian Mooneyham.
>>
>> Charles
>
> If Oswald had been a lone gunman there would never have been a APB put
> out on Charles Givens.
>

Illogical. There could be a lone gunman with helpers. And in almost any
murder case there are many possible suspects and false leads.

> TSBD employee Charles Givens went to the sixth floor approximately at
> noon to get his cigarettes that he had forgotten to take with him when
> he had left for lunch about ten minutes earlier. He saw Oswald coming
> from the SE corner window area. He and Oswald were alone on the floor
> at that time, so he thought.
>

Did he really or was he just paid to say that to incriminate Oswald? A
Dallas cop said that Givens would change his story for money and he had
a police record which the cops could use as leverage.

> DPD Inspector Herbert Sawyer in front of the TSBD directing police
> officers right after the assassination was told by someone that
> Charles Givens could name the shooter on the sixth floor. If any
> LNers were interested in the truth of who the shooter was they would
> try and identify who that was that told Sawyer to find Givens because
> that person was obviously in hiding on the sixth floor and saw Givens
> and Oswald meet.
>

That does not have to mean that the information was based on SEEING
Givens and Oswald together.

[Anthony Marsh]

Why do you say things which you know are not true and why do the
moderators allow you to get away with it? Because you are their buddy, a
fellow WC defender.

[Anthony Marsh]

Yo, knock off calling me a LNer. I was lobbying for the HSCA even before
you heard about this case. The BBN tests were NOT proven to be false. And
no LNer would ever cite them. I refuted the study which cast doubt on the
acoustical evidence.

[Anthony Marsh]

The one I wrote for the Commodore 64. In Basic and also in PROMAL.

10 COLOR 15, 9: CLS
15 REM Converted from Commodore BASIC to QBASIC
20
30 PRINT " DPD Echo Study"
35 PRINT "This program will automatically compute matches betweeen the
Dallas Police Dept.";
40 PRINT "recording of Ch.1 on Nov.22,1963 and estimated echoes using
variables that you ";
45 PRINT "input, then print out the results. After computation, you can
send the results ";
50 PRINT "to the printer by pressing F12, or do a series of expanded
calculations around ";
55 PRINT "the cycle and rifle starting positions by pressing F11. Press
ESC KEY to QUIT."
60 i = 0: j = 0: k = 0: l = 0: a = 0: p = 22: REM largest number of
echoes to be studied now
65 l$ = CHR$(29): l2$ = l$ + l$: l3$ = l2$ + l$: l4$ = l2$ + l2$: l5$ =
l4$ + l$: l6$ = l2$ + l4$: l7$ = l6$ + l$: l8$ = l7$ + l$
70 DIM a(22), b(22), c(22), d(22), e(22), f(22), g(22)
80 DIM est(27), cal(27)
85 DIM x(27), y(27), o$(27)
90 DIM sd(9, 9)
100 PRINT "Press RETURN to accept the suggested value or type in a new
value."
110 INPUT "Which shot do you want to study, 1, 2, or 5"; SHOT
111 IF SHOT < 1 OR SHOT > 5 OR SHOT = 3 OR SHOT = 4 THEN PRINT "1,2 or 5
only!": GOTO 110
115 PRINT "From which window was it fired (0-14)?"
116 PRINT "Window #0 is in the DAL-TEX building."
117 PRINT "Window #1 is Oswald's nest in the TSBD."
118 PRINT "Windows 2 through 9 were closed."
119 PRINT "Windows 10 through 14 were open."
120 INPUT "Window"; wi
121 IF wi < 0 OR wi > 14 THEN PRINT "Between 0-14 only!": GOTO 120
123 IF wi = 0 THEN fx = 350#: PRINT "Rifle X coordinate 350.0"; l7$; :
INPUT gx: IF gx = 0 THEN gx = fx
124 IF wi = 1 OR wi = 12 THEN fx = 321.25#: PRINT "Rifle X coordinate
321.25"; l8$; : INPUT gx: IF gx = 0 THEN gx = fx
125 IF wi = 10 OR wi = 14 THEN fx = 321.3#: PRINT "Rifle X coordinate
321.3"; l7$; : INPUT gx: IF gx = 0 THEN gx = fx
126 IF wi = 11 THEN fx = 321.1#: PRINT "Rifle X coordinate 321.1"; l7$;
: INPUT gx: IF gx = 0 THEN gx = fx
127 IF wi = 13 THEN fx = 321.6#: PRINT "Rifle X coordinate 321.6"; l7$;
: INPUT gx: IF gx = 0 THEN gx = fx
128 IF wi > 1 AND wi < 10 THEN fx = 321.5#: PRINT "Rifle X coordinate
321.5"; l7$; : INPUT gx: IF gx = 0 THEN gx = fx
130 IF wi = 0 THEN gz = 172.4: fy = -41#: PRINT "Rifle Y coordinate
-41.0"; l7$; : INPUT gy: IF gy = 0 THEN gy = fy
131 IF wi = 1 THEN gz = 161.9: fy = 46.1#: PRINT "Rifle Y coordinate
46.1"; l6$; : INPUT gy: IF gy = 0 THEN gy = fy
132 IF wi = 10 THEN gz = 162.3: fy = 106.7#: PRINT "Rifle Y coordinate
106.7"; l7$; : INPUT gy: IF gy = 0 THEN gy = fy
133 IF wi = 11 THEN gz = 161.3: fy = 116.8#: PRINT "Rifle Y coordinate
116.8"; l7$; : INPUT gy: IF gy = 0 THEN gy = fy
134 IF wi = 12 THEN gz = 161.7: fy = 121.2#: PRINT "Rifle Y coordinate
121.2"; l7$; : INPUT gy: IF gy = 0 THEN gy = fy
135 IF wi = 13 THEN gz = 163.2: fy = 130.8#: PRINT "Rifle Y coordinate
130.8"; l7$; : INPUT gy: IF gy = 0 THEN gy = fy
136 IF wi = 14 THEN gz = 161.5: fy = 134#: PRINT "Rifle Y coordinate
134.0"; l7$; : INPUT gy: IF gy = 0 THEN gy = fy
137 IF wi > 1 AND wi < 10 THEN gz = 161.5: fy = 39 + INT(wi * 6.7 + .5):
PRINT "Rifle Y coordinate "; 39 + INT(wi * 6.7 + .5); l5$; : INPUT gy:
IF gy = 0 THEN gy = fy
139 IF SHOT = 5 THEN fx = 208.3#: PRINT "Cycle X coordinate 208.3";
l7$; : INPUT cx: IF cx = 0 THEN cx = fx
140 IF SHOT = 1 THEN fx = 213.5#: PRINT "Cycle X coordinate 213.5";
l7$; : INPUT cx: IF cx = 0 THEN cx = fx
141 IF SHOT = 2 THEN fx = 232#: PRINT "Cycle X coordinate 232.0"; l7$;
: INPUT cx: IF cx = 0 THEN cx = fx
144 IF SHOT = 5 THEN cz = 95.1: fy = 129.5#: PRINT "Cycle Y coordinate
129.5"; l7$; : INPUT cy: IF cy = 0 THEN cy = fy
145 IF SHOT = 1 THEN cz = 100.1: fy = 21#: PRINT "Cycle Y coordinate
21.0"; l6$; : INPUT cy: IF cy = 0 THEN cy = fy
146 IF SHOT = 2 THEN cz = 100.1: fy = 28#: PRINT "Cycle Y coordinate
28.0"; l6$; : INPUT cy: IF cy = 0 THEN cy = fy
150 cs = 8.5#: PRINT "Cycle speed in MPH 8.5"; l5$; : INPUT mph: IF mph
= 0 THEN mph = cs
151 cs = mph * 1.466666666666667#
152 IF mph > 35 THEN PRINT "Too fast for an escort! 5< MPH <35": GOTO 150
154 PRINT "Cycle deviation in ";
155 IF SHOT = 1 THEN fc = 12: PRINT "degrees 12"; l4$; : INPUT ac: IF
ac = 0 THEN ac = fc
156 IF SHOT = 2 THEN fc = 16: PRINT "degrees 16"; l4$; : INPUT ac: IF
ac = 0 THEN ac = fc
157 IF SHOT = 5 THEN fc = 35: PRINT "degrees 35"; l4$; : INPUT ac: IF
ac = 0 THEN ac = fc
158 IF ac > 45 THEN PRINT "Unlikely that it's over 45 degrees yet!":
GOTO 154
159 REM reasonable values: shot#1(8-18), shot#2(20-34), shot#5(35+90=125)
160 ff = 1.043#: PRINT "Correction factor for tape speed 1.043"; l7$; :
INPUT cf: IF cf = 0 THEN cf = ff
162 IF cf < .9 OR cf > 1.1 THEN PRINT "There's no evidence for>10%, .9<
cf <1.1": GOTO 160
164 rc = (ac / 180) * (4# * ATN(1#)): 'function generates pi
165 v = 1123: PRINT "Speed of sound in FPS 1123"; l6$; : INPUT fps: IF
fps = 0 THEN fps = v
170
180 pi = 2# * ATN(1#): 'function generates pi/2
190 hr = pi - rc
200 z = gz - (cz + 3): REM microphone is 3 feet above ground
250 FOR i = 0 TO p + 5
255 READ x(i), y(i), o$(i)
260 NEXT
265 IF SHOT = 5 THEN SHOT = 3: REM makes it easier to read data statements
270 FOR j = 1 TO SHOT
275 FOR i = 1 TO p
280 READ a
285 IF j = SHOT THEN a(i) = ABS(a)
290 NEXT
295 NEXT
300 FOR i = 1 TO p
305 b(i) = (cf * a(i) / 1000)
310 NEXT
315 rx = gx: ry = gy: nx = cx: ny = cy
355 best = f(1)
360 GOSUB 400
370 GOSUB 750
375 ON KEY(30) GOSUB 860
380 ON KEY(31) GOSUB 861
385 KEY(30) ON: KEY(31) ON
390 IF INKEY$ = CHR$(27) THEN END
395 GOTO 390
400 REM main calculating subroutine.
405 air = SQR((rx - nx) * (rx - nx) + (ry - ny) * (ry - ny))
410 blast = SQR(air * air + z * z)
415 af = (blast / fps) - b(1)
420 c(0) = af
425 FOR i = 1 TO p
430 c(i) = b(i) + c(0)
445 d(i) = fps * c(i)
450 NEXT
455 e(1) = d(1)
460 FOR i = 2 TO p
465 est(i) = 5: f(i) = 5: g(i) = 0
470 hc = (c(i) - c(1)) * cs
475 hx = hc * COS(rc): IF SHOT = 3 THEN hx = -hx
480 hy = hc * SIN(rc)
485 mx = nx + hx
490 my = ny + hy
491 REM cycle has moved since blast
495 FOR l = 1 TO 27
500 fx = rx - x(l): fy = ry - y(l)
501 fh = SQR(fx * fx + fy * fy)
502 lx = mx - x(l): ly = my - y(l)
505 lh = SQR(lx * lx + ly * ly)
510 cal(l) = SQR(((fh + lh) * (fh + lh)) + (z * z))
515 est(l) = ABS(d(i) - cal(l))
530 IF est(l) < f(i) THEN f(i) = est(l): e(i) = cal(l): g(i) = l
535 NEXT
540 NEXT
545 f(0) = 0
550 FOR i = 2 TO p
555 f(0) = f(0) + f(i) * f(i)
560 NEXT
565 f(1) = f(0) / (p - 1): REM sum of squares
590 RETURN
600 best = 25: FOR j = 1 TO 9
601 IF j = 1 THEN rx = gx: ry = gy
602 IF j = 2 THEN rx = gx + .5: ry = gy + .5
603 IF j = 3 THEN rx = gx + .5: ry = gy
604 IF j = 4 THEN rx = gx + .5: ry = gy - .5
605 IF j = 5 THEN rx = gx: ry = gy - .5
606 IF j = 6 THEN rx = gx - .5: ry = gy - .5
607 IF j = 7 THEN rx = gx - .5: ry = gy
608 IF j = 8 THEN rx = gx - .5: ry = gy + .5
609 IF j = 9 THEN rx = gx: ry = gy + .5
610 IF rx < 320 THEN rx = 320
611 FOR k = 1 TO 9
612 IF k = 1 THEN nx = cx: ny = cy
613 IF k = 2 THEN nx = cx + .5: ny = cy + .5
614 IF k = 3 THEN nx = cx + .5: ny = cy
615 IF k = 4 THEN nx = cx + .5: ny = cy - .5
616 IF k = 5 THEN nx = cx: ny = cy - .5
617 IF k = 6 THEN nx = cx - .5: ny = cy - .5
618 IF k = 7 THEN nx = cx - .5: ny = cy
619 IF k = 8 THEN nx = cx - .5: ny = cy + .5
620 IF k = 9 THEN nx = cx: ny = cy + .5
621 REM move starting positions for rifle & cycle,then compute each sd
625 GOSUB 400
626
627 LOCATE 25, 1
628 PRINT "J="; j; ":Rifle at"; : PRINT USING "####.##"; rx; : PRINT "
by"; : PRINT USING "####.##"; ry;
629 PRINT " ", "K="; k; ":Cycle at"; : PRINT USING "####.##"; nx; :
PRINT " by"; : PRINT USING "####.##"; ny;
630 sd(j, k) = f(1)
632 IF sd(j, k) < best THEN best = sd(j, k): bj = j: bk = k
635 NEXT k, j
641 IF bj = 1 THEN rx = gx: ry = gy
642 IF bj = 2 THEN rx = gx + .5: ry = gy + .5
643 IF bj = 3 THEN rx = gx + .5: ry = gy
644 IF bj = 4 THEN rx = gx + .5: ry = gy - .5
645 IF bj = 5 THEN rx = gx: ry = gy - .5
646 IF bj = 6 THEN rx = gx - .5: ry = gy - .5
647 IF bj = 7 THEN rx = gx - .5: ry = gy
648 IF bj = 8 THEN rx = gx - .5: ry = gy + .5
649 IF bj = 9 THEN rx = gx: ry = gy + .5
651 IF bk = 1 THEN nx = cx: ny = cy
652 IF bk = 2 THEN nx = cx + .5: ny = cy + .5
653 IF bk = 3 THEN nx = cx + .5: ny = cy
654 IF bk = 4 THEN nx = cx + .5: ny = cy - .5
655 IF bk = 5 THEN nx = cx: ny = cy - .5
656 IF bk = 6 THEN nx = cx - .5: ny = cy - .5
657 IF bk = 7 THEN nx = cx - .5: ny = cy
658 IF bk = 8 THEN nx = cx - .5: ny = cy + .5
659 IF bk = 9 THEN nx = cx: ny = cy + .5
660 GOSUB 400: REM recalculate
661 RETURN
670 ' <-----------Y ^ <-----------Y ^
675 ' +-----------+ | +-----------+ |
680 ' J = | 2 | 3 | 4 | | K = | 2 | 3 | 4 | |
685 ' RIFLE +-----------+ | CYCLE +-----------+ |
690 ' POSITION | 9 | 1 | 5 | | POSITION | 9 | 1 | 5 | |
695 ' MOVES +-----------+ | MOVES +-----------+ |
700 ' 0.5 Ft | 8 | 7 | 6 | | 0.5 Ft | 8 | 7 | 6 | |
705 ' EACH TIME +-----------+ X EACH TIME +___________+ X
750 CLS
760 IF wi = 0 THEN PRINT "Rifle in DAL-TEX "; ELSE PRINT "Rifle in TSBD
#"; wi;
770
780 PRINT "at"; : PRINT USING "####.## "; rx; : PRINT "x"; : PRINT USING
"####.##"; ry;
790 PRINT " . Cycle X,Y at blast: ";
795 PRINT USING "####.## "; nx; : PRINT "x"; : PRINT USING "####.##";
ny; : PRINT " ."
800 PRINT "Millisecs Corrected Elapsed ms Elapsed ft Calc.feet
Deviation Matches "
810 FOR i = 1 TO p
815 PRINT USING "#####.### "; a(i);
820 PRINT USING "##.####### "; b(i);
825 PRINT USING "##.####### "; c(i);
830 PRINT USING "#####.#### "; d(i);
835 PRINT USING "#####.#### "; e(i);
836 IF i = 1 THEN PRINT USING "###.#### "; f(1); : IF i = 1 THEN PRINT
" **BLAST** ";
840 IF i > 1 AND f(i) >= 5 THEN PRINT "OVER 5.0 "; : ELSE IF i > 1
THEN PRINT USING "###.#### "; f(i);
841 IF i = 22 THEN PRINT o$(g(i));
842 IF i < 22 AND i > 1 THEN PRINT o$(g(i))
843 NEXT i
845 RETURN
852
853
854
855
856
857 PRINT "Performing 81 Bernoulli calculations, each .5 feet away from
starting positions";
859 GOSUB 600
860 gx = rx: gy = ry: cx = nx: cy = ny: GOSUB 600: GOSUB 750: RETURN
861 LPRINT "DPD Echo Study": IF SHOT = 3 THEN LPRINT "Shot #5": GOTO 863
862 LPRINT "Shot#"; SHOT
863 IF wi = 0 THEN LPRINT "Rifle in Dal-Tex Building.": GOTO 865
864 LPRINT "Rifle in Window #"; wi; "on the sixth floor of the Texas
School Book Depository"
865 LPRINT "Rifle Coordinates:"; rx; "x"; ry
866 LPRINT "Cycle Coordinates at Blast:"; nx; "x"; ny
867 LPRINT "Cycle's initial speed"; mph; "mph."
868 LPRINT "Cycle's path deviating ";
869 IF SHOT < 3 THEN LPRINT "west from north by"; ac; "degrees."
870 IF SHOT > 2 THEN LPRINT "south from west by"; ac; "degrees."
872 LPRINT "Correction factor used for tape speed:"; cf
873 LPRINT "Speed of sound:"; fps; "fps.": LPRINT " "
874 LPRINT "Millisec. Corrected Elapsed ms Elapsed ft Calc. feet
Deviation Matches "
875 FOR i = 1 TO p
876 LPRINT USING "#####.### "; a(i);
877 LPRINT USING "##.####### "; b(i);
878 LPRINT USING "##.####### "; c(i);
879 LPRINT USING "#####.#### "; d(i);
880 LPRINT USING "#####.#### "; e(i);
881 IF i = 1 THEN LPRINT USING "###.#### "; f(1); : GOTO 885
882 IF f(i) >= 5 THEN LPRINT "OVER 5.0 "; : ELSE LPRINT USING
"###.#### "; f(i);
885 IF i = 1 THEN LPRINT " **BLAST**": ELSE LPRINT o$(g(i))
889 NEXT i
895
899 RETURN
900 DATA 320,40.3," No Match "
901 DATA 276,72.5,"Trf. light"
902 DATA 202.5,32.5,"TrafficBox"
903 DATA 211,56.25," Pool tip "
904 DATA 199.5,44.75," Pool, NE "
905 DATA 272.5,97," Tree A "
906 DATA 201.5,79.25," Column B "
907 DATA 239.83333333,-40.3333333," DCRB, NW "
908 DATA 265.75,113.1666666," Column A "
909 DATA 319.5,-39,"DAL-TEX,SW"
910 DATA 174,82," Tree N "
911 DATA 248.5,142,"Wall A,NE "
912 DATA 296.5,149," Tree D "
913 DATA 179,120.25," Tree B "
914 DATA 158.5,-40.3333333," DCRB, SW "
915 DATA 132.5,31," Neon #1 "
916 DATA 129.8333333,-39," DCCB, NW "
917 DATA 227.5,182," Tree C "
918 DATA 100.5,96," Column D "
919 DATA 71,65.5," Monument "
920 DATA 262,235," N.Shelter"
921 DATA 39.25,76.5," Column C "
922 DATA 38.5,-39," DCCB, SW "
923 DATA 205,291," S.Shelter"
924 DATA 161,287," Retn.wall"
925 DATA -11,80," City bus "
926 DATA -40,-40,"Old Court."
927 DATA -315,50," P.O., NE "
928 REM data for x(),y(),o$()
1000 REM shot#1 data
1001 DATA 30.625: REM hsca#1
1002 DATA 41.875: REM marsh 1a
1003 REM 46.875
1004 REM 51.25
1005 DATA 56.25: REM marsh 1b
1006 REM 65
1007 REM 68.75
1008 REM 75
1009 DATA 93.125: REM hsca#2
1010 DATA 150: REM hsca#3
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1016 DATA 312.5: REM hsca#9
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1020 DATA 424.375: REM hsca#12
1021 DATA 465.625: REM hsca#13
1024 DATA 480.625: REM hsca#14
1025 DATA 633.75: REM marsh 14a
1026 DATA 653.75: REM hsca#15
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1028 DATA 1046.875: REM hsca#16
1029 DATA 1106.25: REM hsca#17
1030 REM last echo on chart
1035 REM change rems to data statements if screen can handle >22 matches
2000 REM shot#2 data
2001 DATA 15.625: REM hsca#1
2002 DATA 25: REM hsca#2
2003 DATA 34: REM marsh 2a
2004 DATA 41: REM marsh 2b
2005 DATA 47: REM hsca#3
2006 REM 56
2007 DATA 69: REM hsca#4
2008 REM 79
2009 REM 89
2010 REM 94
2011 REM 104
2012 DATA 115.5: REM hsca#5
2013 REM 138
2014 REM 151
2015 DATA 158: REM hsca#6
2016 DATA 166: REM hsca#7
2017 REM 172
2018 REM 180
2019 REM 189
2020 REM 193
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2026 DATA 304.375: REM marsh 10a
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2028 DATA 476.875: REM marsh 11a
2029 DATA 565: REM hsca#12
2030 DATA 646.875: REM marsh 12a
2031 DATA 712.5: REM marsh 12b
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2036 REM last echo on tape
3000 REM shot#3 data not available
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[charles wallace]

If Oswald was the lone nut shooter there would not have been a policeman
telling Capt. Fritz that Oswald had a room in Oak Cliff before he was
supposed to know that. This address information given to Fritz was before
the DPD learned this address from Oswald. This fact was presented in
Fritz's WC testimony by Fritz. LNers don't even suspect anything amiss in
this case much less have a clue to any wrong doing.

[claviger]

Cite please.

> If Oswald was the lone nut shooter there would not have been a policeman
> telling Capt. Fritz that Oswald had a room in Oak Cliff before he was
> supposed to know that. This address information given to Fritz was before
> the DPD learned this address from Oswald. This fact was presented in
> Fritz's WC testimony by Fritz.  LNers don't even suspect anything amiss in
> this case much less have a clue to any wrong doing.

Where are you getting this kind of information? As for Oswald living
in Oak Cliff his friend and co-worker Buell Wesley Frazier would know
that.

[David Von Pein]

>>> "This address information given to Fritz was before the DPD learned
this address from Oswald. This fact was presented in Fritz's WC testimony
by Fritz." <<<

At least it's good to know that Captain Fritz has been scratched off your
list of suspects in the frame-up of Oswald. Because if Fritz was a liar
and one of the people trying to frame poor LHO, he wouldn't be so stupid
as to tip his hand about the asddress snafu in his OWN WARREN COMMISSION
TESTIMONY...now would he?

This "address" thing is just one more road that leads nowhere for CTers.
It's another instance of CTers thinking that the cops had some kind of
foreknowledge of things. In reality, of course, there is always a logical,
non-conspiratorial explanation for things like this. And "timing"
discrepancies in the record couldn't be more common.

Take the differing times provided by Elmer Todd and Bob Frazier for the
time when CE399 was received by Todd and then turned over to Frazier by
Todd.

Conspiracists like James DiEugenio, naturally, always see "conspiracy" in
discrepancies like this, even when such a thing would be very very easy to
easy to eliminate, by just simply altering one of the times. CTers think
that tons of evidence WAS altered and eliminated, but they just couldn't
get the paperwork right evidently, is that it?

The fact that discrepancies such as the ones I just discussed exist at all
is much more indicative of normal human error than it is a sign of
conspiracy or cover-up. Because in a real cover-up, discrepancies like
these would NOT exist in the record at all.

[charles wallace]

No, Fritz was not trying to frame Oswald but he knew that there were
things about the case that were not as they seemed.
Why do you think he held back on the bent empty shell? He gave it up
to the FBI only when he was forced to.

Another just a fluke for you is that a DPD patrol car came by the
roominghouse and tooted the horn while stopped in front. There were
two uniformed officers in the car. Oswald was in his room at this
time 30 minutes after the assassination.

[charles wallace]

If you read Fritz's WC testimony you will see that the DPD knew about
Oswald's Oak Cliff address before Oswald told them. In fact after
Fritz had been told of Oswald's address by the officer in the hallway
Fritz then went to Oswald and asked if it was true.

Now I would like to see anything that shows Frazier knew where Oswald
had a room. In your belief, did he also know that the room was rented
under the name O.H.Lee?

[charles wallace]

If Oswald were the lone nut shooter there would not have been a DPD
patrol car stop in front of Oswald's roominghouse 30 minutes after the
assassination tooting the horn while Oswald is in his room.

[Anthony Marsh]

I think he wanted to try to find out where Oswald bought the ammo.

> Another just a fluke for you is that a DPD patrol car came by the
> roominghouse and tooted the horn while stopped in front. There were
> two uniformed officers in the car. Oswald was in his room at this
> time 30 minutes after the assassination.
>

We don't know this for a fact. Never rely on one witness.

[Anthony Marsh]

You have no proof that happened.

[Anthony Marsh]

On 9/9/2011 4:05 PM, charles wallace wrote:

When exactly did Oswald tell Fritz where his room was?
Please cite and quote the interrogation and note the exact time.

[bobr]

On 9/9/2011 7:52 AM, charles wallace wrote:
> On Sep 8, 11:11 pm, David Von Pein<davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>> "This address information given to Fritz was before the DPD learned

> Another just a fluke for you is that a DPD patrol car came by the
> roominghouse and tooted the horn while stopped in front. There were
> two uniformed officers in the car. Oswald was in his room at this
> time 30 minutes after the assassination.
>

I would be interested to know how the LN crowd explains that!

[David Von Pein]

>>> "If Oswald were the lone nut shooter there would not have been a DPD patrol car stop in front of Oswald's roominghouse 30 minutes after the assassination tooting the horn while Oswald is in his room." <<<

Was there a conspiracy in place on the multiple other occasions before
Nov. 22 when a police car would do that EXACT same thing in front of
1026 North Beckley Avenue in Oak Cliff?

[claviger]

On Sep 9, 6:14 pm, bobr <neok...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 9/9/2011 7:52 AM, charles wallace wrote:
>
> > On Sep 8, 11:11 pm, David Von Pein<davevonp...@aol.com>  wrote:
> >>>>> "This address information given to Fritz was before the DPD learned
> > Another just a fluke for you is that a DPD patrol car came by the
> > roominghouse and tooted the horn while stopped in front. There were
> > two uniformed officers in the car.  Oswald was in his room at this
> > time 30 minutes after the assassination.

How rude of LHO to not go out and see what they wanted. As an
innocent man he should want to help support the local police any way
he can. Perhaps he thought his employer sent them for playing hooky
from his job.

> I would be interested to know how the LN crowd explains that!

If they were after Oswald I would think they would get out of the car
and knock on the door to see if he was home, or keep the house under
surveillance until detectives arrive. They did neither, so we can
only assume this patrol car was at the wrong address looking for
someone else, perhaps not even a suspect.

While it was a curious situation, how does it prove anything to you?

[charles wallace]

Marsh in your world the police would never respond to a 911 call until
they received a second call verifying the first. There would be very
few criminal trials since no witnesses would be allowed. You call
other people wacky. Wow.

[claviger]

CW,

> If you read Fritz's WC testimony you will see that the DPD knew about
> Oswald's Oak Cliff address before Oswald told them. In fact after
> Fritz had been told of Oswald's address by the officer in the hallway
> Fritz then went to Oswald and asked if it was true.
>
> Now I would like to see anything that shows Frazier knew where Oswald
> had a room. In your belief, did he also know that the room was rented
> under the name O.H.Lee?

How about common sense. Frazier was Oswald's ride from time to time
and knew that he and Marina were separated. It would be simple human
curiosity to ask LHO where he was living. Linnie Mae Randel was
friendly with Ruth Paine and Marina, so they could have told Linnie
Mae who mentioned it to her brother.

[charles wallace]

It is my understanding that even Marina did not know where Oswald had
rented his room. But according to you everybody knew. You want to
tell me where the "officer" mentioned below learned where Oswald's
room was?

"Mr. FRITZ. When I started to talk to this prisoner or maybe just
before I started to talk to him, some officer told me outside of my
office that he had a room on Beckley, I don't know who that officer
was, I think we can find out, I have since I have talked to you this
morning I have talked to Lieutenant Baker and he says I know maybe who
that officer was, but I am not sure yet.
Mr. BALL. Some officer told you that he thought this man had a room on
Beckley?
Mr. FRITZ. Yes, sir. "

[Anthony Marsh]

Knowing that Oswald had a room in Oak Cliff does not mean that he knew
Oswald was using an alias to rent it. Nor did he know that Oswald used
an alias to buy the rifle.

[Anthony Marsh]

In my area the police relied on one witness who said the killer was a
black man and then they went out trying to find some black man to frame.
The real killer was the guy who called them.
Not here, but under some rules of law you must have TWO witnesses minimum.

[claviger]

Yes, what's your point?

[Anthony Marsh]

Fritz did not know where Oswald live that soon.