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John I found another clue!
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Robert Harris
Dec 17, 2011, 5:12:13 PM12/17/11
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I think this one is a biggie John and I got it from one of your own posts!
Several years ago, you posted a brilliant rebuttal to a misguided CT who
was claiming that the SBT didn't work, because Mrs. Connally said her
husband was wounded by a gunshot that was fired after she looked back and
saw JFK in distress.
But you pointed out that she didn't realize that her husband had been
wounded. And sure enough, as we examine the Zfilm, it's easy to see that
JBC had his back toward her and that Nellie was mainly focused on the
President.
I think that was the work of a genius, John!
The only thing you forgot to mention is, how she could have heard a shot
then that she thought, hit him.
That had me baffled too. But then, I remembered that Nellie also said that
when she heard that shot, she turned to her husband and pulled him back to
her - never again, looking in the back seat at JFK.
What if we watched her in that film, VERY closely? Maybe we can see when
she first looked back at JFK, and when she finally turned her full
attention to JBC and was in a position to pull him back to her.
Or to put it another way, if she actually heard a shot then, maybe we can
see her react to it!!
And if we can do that, we might be able to see if she reacted at the same
time Greer did!! Yeah, I suppose it's a long shot, but maybe....
Anyway I put this extreme slow motion animation together for you, which
gives us a pretty good look at Nellie then. Why don't you take a look at
it and see if you can figure out when those things happened? It will run
in a continuous loop as long as you need it to, to study Mrs. Connally.
http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
What do you think John? I will look forward to your reply.
Robert Harris
Several years ago, you posted a brilliant rebuttal to a misguided CT who
was claiming that the SBT didn't work, because Mrs. Connally said her
husband was wounded by a gunshot that was fired after she looked back and
saw JFK in distress.
But you pointed out that she didn't realize that her husband had been
wounded. And sure enough, as we examine the Zfilm, it's easy to see that
JBC had his back toward her and that Nellie was mainly focused on the
President.
I think that was the work of a genius, John!
The only thing you forgot to mention is, how she could have heard a shot
then that she thought, hit him.
That had me baffled too. But then, I remembered that Nellie also said that
when she heard that shot, she turned to her husband and pulled him back to
her - never again, looking in the back seat at JFK.
What if we watched her in that film, VERY closely? Maybe we can see when
she first looked back at JFK, and when she finally turned her full
attention to JBC and was in a position to pull him back to her.
Or to put it another way, if she actually heard a shot then, maybe we can
see her react to it!!
And if we can do that, we might be able to see if she reacted at the same
time Greer did!! Yeah, I suppose it's a long shot, but maybe....
Anyway I put this extreme slow motion animation together for you, which
gives us a pretty good look at Nellie then. Why don't you take a look at
it and see if you can figure out when those things happened? It will run
in a continuous loop as long as you need it to, to study Mrs. Connally.
http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
What do you think John? I will look forward to your reply.
Robert Harris
David Von Pein
Dec 17, 2011, 10:22:31 PM12/17/11
to
http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
It looks to me as though Nellie is focusing a lot of her attention on her
husband (JBC) in the Z230s and 240s, and she doesn't turn to look at JFK
until about Z256 or so. (And she was likely focusing on JBC because JBC
was shouting "Oh, no no".)
My summary:
I think all reasonable people would agree that Nellie could not have
possibly seen JBC's initial involuntary reactions to being hit at Z225-
Z230 or so. Those things happened in the blink of an eye, and Nellie was
not looking at JBC at that time. She, therefore, missed seeing the crucial
"impact" of the bullet on JBC.
She then said she turned to look straight at the President and noticed
JFK's hands up at his neck.
But Bob's looping GIF is, indeed, interesting--but not really for the
reason he desires. I found it interesting because it seems to show Mrs.
Connally paying particular attention to JOHN CONNALLY (not JOHN KENNEDY)
in the Zapruder frames very shortly after the SBT bullet struck both men
(the Z230s).
http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
Pamela Brown
Dec 18, 2011, 8:19:58 AM12/18/11
to
On Dec 17, 9:22 pm, David Von Pein <davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
> http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
>
> It looks to me as though Nellie is focusing a lot of her attention on her
> husband (JBC) in the Z230s and 240s, and she doesn't turn to look at JFK
> until about Z256 or so. (And she was likely focusing on JBC because JBC
> was shouting "Oh, no no".)
>
> My summary:
>
> I think all reasonable people would agree that Nellie could not have
> possibly seen JBC's initial involuntary reactions to being hit at Z225-
> Z230 or so.
That's because he wasn't.
> http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
>
> It looks to me as though Nellie is focusing a lot of her attention on her
> husband (JBC) in the Z230s and 240s, and she doesn't turn to look at JFK
> until about Z256 or so. (And she was likely focusing on JBC because JBC
> was shouting "Oh, no no".)
>
> My summary:
>
> I think all reasonable people would agree that Nellie could not have
> possibly seen JBC's initial involuntary reactions to being hit at Z225-
> Z230 or so.
Robert Harris
Dec 18, 2011, 8:20:25 AM12/18/11
to
In article
<46813d06-d4c0-4f7c...@i8g2000vbh.googlegroups.com>,
> Those things happened in the blink of an eye, and Nellie was
> not looking at JBC at that time. She, therefore, missed seeing the crucial
> "impact" of the bullet on JBC.
Yes.
>
> She then said she turned to look straight at the President and noticed
> JFK's hands up at his neck.
Yes, and we can see that she was absolutely correct.
>
> But Bob's looping GIF is, indeed, interesting--but not really for the
> reason he desires. I found it interesting because it seems to show Mrs.
> Connally paying particular attention to JOHN CONNALLY (not JOHN KENNEDY)
> in the Zapruder frames very shortly after the SBT bullet struck both men
> (the Z230s).
I disagree with that, but it's actually not important.
What is important is, that she heard the next shot, AFTER she looked
back and saw JFK in the late 250's. And we can see when she turned away
from JFK and toward her husband, beginning at precisely 291-292.
Her reactions were in almost perfect unison with the reactions by Jackie
(290), Kellerman (291-292), Greer (291-292) and her husband (290).
All of those reactions were dramatic and consistent with the known
attributes of startle reactions. This is the clincher, David. This shot
is the ONLY reason I have continued to be involved in this godforsaken,
case.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GH5pGQy6yI
Robert Harris
>
> http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
<46813d06-d4c0-4f7c...@i8g2000vbh.googlegroups.com>,
David Von Pein <davev...@aol.com> wrote:
> http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
>
> It looks to me as though Nellie is focusing a lot of her attention on her
> husband (JBC) in the Z230s and 240s, and she doesn't turn to look at JFK
> until about Z256 or so. (And she was likely focusing on JBC because JBC
> was shouting "Oh, no no".)
>
> My summary:
>
> I think all reasonable people would agree that Nellie could not have
> possibly seen JBC's initial involuntary reactions to being hit at Z225-
> Z230 or so.
JBC was hit at 223 - not 222 or 224. (ask me to prove it:-)
> http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
>
> It looks to me as though Nellie is focusing a lot of her attention on her
> husband (JBC) in the Z230s and 240s, and she doesn't turn to look at JFK
> until about Z256 or so. (And she was likely focusing on JBC because JBC
> was shouting "Oh, no no".)
>
> My summary:
>
> I think all reasonable people would agree that Nellie could not have
> possibly seen JBC's initial involuntary reactions to being hit at Z225-
> Z230 or so.
> Those things happened in the blink of an eye, and Nellie was
> not looking at JBC at that time. She, therefore, missed seeing the crucial
> "impact" of the bullet on JBC.
>
> She then said she turned to look straight at the President and noticed
> JFK's hands up at his neck.
>
> But Bob's looping GIF is, indeed, interesting--but not really for the
> reason he desires. I found it interesting because it seems to show Mrs.
> Connally paying particular attention to JOHN CONNALLY (not JOHN KENNEDY)
> in the Zapruder frames very shortly after the SBT bullet struck both men
> (the Z230s).
What is important is, that she heard the next shot, AFTER she looked
back and saw JFK in the late 250's. And we can see when she turned away
from JFK and toward her husband, beginning at precisely 291-292.
Her reactions were in almost perfect unison with the reactions by Jackie
(290), Kellerman (291-292), Greer (291-292) and her husband (290).
All of those reactions were dramatic and consistent with the known
attributes of startle reactions. This is the clincher, David. This shot
is the ONLY reason I have continued to be involved in this godforsaken,
case.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GH5pGQy6yI
Robert Harris
>
> http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
bigdog
Dec 18, 2011, 12:15:28 PM12/18/11
to
On Dec 18, 8:19 am, Pamela Brown <pamelaj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 17, 9:22 pm, David Von Pein <davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
>
> > It looks to me as though Nellie is focusing a lot of her attention on her
> > husband (JBC) in the Z230s and 240s, and she doesn't turn to look at JFK
> > until about Z256 or so. (And she was likely focusing on JBC because JBC
> > was shouting "Oh, no no".)
>
> > My summary:
>
> > I think all reasonable people would agree that Nellie could not have
> > possibly seen JBC's initial involuntary reactions to being hit at Z225-
> > Z230 or so.
>
> That's because he wasn't.
>
Right. At Z226, he just decided to flip his right arm upward and then back
> On Dec 17, 9:22 pm, David Von Pein <davevonp...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >http://jfkhistory.com/nellie2.gif
>
> > It looks to me as though Nellie is focusing a lot of her attention on her
> > husband (JBC) in the Z230s and 240s, and she doesn't turn to look at JFK
> > until about Z256 or so. (And she was likely focusing on JBC because JBC
> > was shouting "Oh, no no".)
>
> > My summary:
>
> > I think all reasonable people would agree that Nellie could not have
> > possibly seen JBC's initial involuntary reactions to being hit at Z225-
> > Z230 or so.
>
> That's because he wasn't.
>
down, all in about a half a second and immediately before he twisted and
dipped to his right.
Coincidently, this was the same frame JFK's arms began moving upward.
Anthony Marsh
Dec 18, 2011, 5:31:12 PM12/18/11
to
JFK's arms move DOWN at Z-224.
Mike
Dec 18, 2011, 9:19:35 PM12/18/11
to
the assassination sequence than Abraham Zapruder.
Mike
Dec 18, 2011, 9:20:25 PM12/18/11
to
at frame 313. We are only talking seconds here and you are treating Nellie
like she was some sort of computer. You are being unrealistic.
Robert Harris
Dec 19, 2011, 9:15:03 AM12/19/11
to
In article <4eee7e07$1...@mcadams.posc.mu.edu>,
One need not be a computer to describe two gunshots, which followed an
ambiguous, early noise which she did not realize was a shot.
She heard the first of them after looking back at JFK and she was very
specific about the last one she heard in which she was pelted with
tissue from the fatal head shot.
And we can easily see her react to the 285 shot, simultaneous with every
other surviving passenger in the car. Have you even bothered to look at
the animations I linked?
She heard the shots at 285 and 312. That's why the overwhelming
consensus of relevant witnesses was that the final shots were closely
bunched.
Robert Harris
ambiguous, early noise which she did not realize was a shot.
She heard the first of them after looking back at JFK and she was very
specific about the last one she heard in which she was pelted with
tissue from the fatal head shot.
And we can easily see her react to the 285 shot, simultaneous with every
other surviving passenger in the car. Have you even bothered to look at
the animations I linked?
She heard the shots at 285 and 312. That's why the overwhelming
consensus of relevant witnesses was that the final shots were closely
bunched.
Robert Harris
Robert Harris
Dec 20, 2011, 2:21:55 PM12/20/11
to
In article
<bobharris77-BD37...@70-3-168-216.pools.spcsdns.net>,
Come on David. Can't you even muster a feeble, "maybe"?
Robert Harris
<bobharris77-BD37...@70-3-168-216.pools.spcsdns.net>,
Robert Harris
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