Gong Li is not that good of an actress
Stephen Lu
Allright, flame bait time!
Because, Gong Li has a very limited range of characters that she can
portray. I haven't seen all of the films that she has been in, but the
ones I have seen her in, (ie, Red Sorgum, Farewell My Concubine, and a
few others), the characters that she has portrayed are all pretty much
the same. I don't know her personally, but I suspect she is pretty much
like the characters she's played. In other words, she plays herself the
best. And remember in THE FLIRTING SCHOLAR, a comedy? She never had any
funny part in there. Her role was the serious, romantic woman. Why? I
suspect because she couldn't deliver, the timing and the sense that's
required to do comedy.
What she has going for her is her classic Chinese beauty, and a great
director that was her husband, Zhang Yimou, and good scripts with roles
written just for her.
With all that said, I am very happy that she has made international
fame. Not very many Chinese/Asian actors has made that far. But I hope
she can still hold up withouth Zhang Yimou.
Ok, hit me with your fire and brimstones!
steve
John R. Meixner
character, plus her retarded sister, Stephen Chow's love interest.
While amusing primarily because it is unusual, I think this conclusively
proves Gong Li is a one note actress, though I admit she is a pretty
good one. When I see her in a movie are start making bets on how she is
going to die, which she does with out fail. It seems that in every
movie she plays a bitch who redeems herself at the end by dying
tragically, killing herself, or going mad; the victim of a harsh unjust
world.
In my opinion the ability to do both comedy and drama is the true
measure of a good actor/actress. Greta Garbo mostly plyed the same sort
of roles as Gong Li, yet when the time came to do comedy she delivered
in "Ninotchka," something Gong Li has never done.
Gong Li is the poster girl for Socialist Realism, every time I see her
in a movie it makes me want to make a Chinese version of Dreiser's
"Sister Carrie." But I don't know whether it would be serious or a
parody.
-JRM-
John R. Meixner
Austin, Texas
Sir KFC
Well, I kinda of agree that Gong Li plays similar roles in all her movies,
but when she does these roles, she's the best for the part. In her
movies, I can't imagine any of the other Chinese or HK actresses
portraying the part better.
Dan Helmick
For my part I've always been put off by her smile, which looks more like a
grimace with gritted teeth. Projecting joy is not one of her strengths.
--
H P Wong
Stephen Lu <luxx...@gold.tc.umn.edu> wrote in article
<32874D...@gold.tc.umn.edu>...
>Because, Gong Li has a very limited range of characters that she can
> portray. I haven't seen all of the films that she has been in, but the
> ones I have seen her in, (ie, Red Sorgum, Farewell My Concubine, and a
> few others), the characters that she has portrayed are all pretty much
> the same. I don't know her personally, but I suspect she is pretty much
> like the characters she's played. In other words, she plays herself the
> best. >
> What she has going for her is her classic Chinese beauty, and a great
> director that was her husband, Zhang Yimou, and good scripts with roles
> written just for her.
>
I disagree. Gong Li is quite a versatile actress. True, she has not shown
great comedic timing, nor did she do well in martial arts films. That
aside, she had played a variety of roles, including femme fatale in
'Farewell My Concubine', 'Shangai Triad', repressed females in 'Raised of
Red Lanterns', 'Ju Du', and straight dramatic roles in 'Spirit of a Woman
Painter', 'Mary from Beijing'. She plays her role with conviction and
depth, never one-dimentional or caricature, whether she be a flighty
starlet in 'Terra Cotta Soldiers', uneducated peasant in 'Story of Jiu
Ju', or power hungry queen in 'Conquerer's Concubine'. Didn't you say she
was just playing herself? That's the power of role playing, not over
acting. Look at what kind of roles Hollywood actresses get to play, it is
pathetic. Even Joan Chen is reduced to be forever a white man's chick. By
the way, Gong Li was never married to Zhang Yimou.
headrush
How dare you criticize the Great One!?! :)
With all the comments you made, here's a question for you:
What kind of role would you want her to do?
Being that Gong Li is pretty, there are some roles that she will not seem to fit
in. For example, it was kind of weird for Michelle Pfeiffer to portray a teacher
who was an ex-marine. A teacher - yes. An ex-marine - possible yes but generally
not believeable. I suppose Gong Li could put on tons of make up to hide her face
to play a drastically different character (i.e. Joan Chen's role in "Heaven and
Earth").
Don't worry. I'm not insulted by your post or any of the 'negative' comments by
others.
Stephen Lu (luxx...@gold.tc.umn.edu) wrote:
: Allright, flame bait time!
: Because, Gong Li has a very limited range of characters that she can
: portray. I haven't seen all of the films that she has been in, but the
: ones I have seen her in, (ie, Red Sorgum, Farewell My Concubine, and a
: few others), the characters that she has portrayed are all pretty much
: the same. I don't know her personally, but I suspect she is pretty much
: like the characters she's played. In other words, she plays herself the
: best. And remember in THE FLIRTING SCHOLAR, a comedy? She never had any
: funny part in there. Her role was the serious, romantic woman. Why? I
: suspect because she couldn't deliver, the timing and the sense that's
: required to do comedy.
: What she has going for her is her classic Chinese beauty, and a great
: director that was her husband, Zhang Yimou, and good scripts with roles
: written just for her.
: With all that said, I am very happy that she has made international
Xich Lo
I guess it's like American audiences are with Meryl Streep, who is
probably the finest actress working in American films (even though it's
been a while since she made a good one). Gong Li is definitely her
rival for greatest living actress. I have never seen anyone who is able
to range so many different emotions and nuances. My first exposure to
her was RAISE THE RED LANTERN. That opening scene!!!!! One cannot
possibly look at that and think she isn't an absolutely phenomenal
actress. Since then, every performance has cemented this even more in
my mind. She was heartbreaking in TO LIVE (opposite the equally great
Ge You), poignant in THE STORY OF QUI JU, ruthless in FAREWELL MY
CONCUBINE, absolutely sultry in SHANGHIA TRIAD and stunningly passionate
in JU DOU.
Granted, she doesn't always play likeable characters, but for me, that
is one of her greatest strengths. Even when we may hate the characters,
she eventually wins us over.
For her detractors I say, go check out RAISE THE RED LANTERN and TO LIVE
again. GONG LI IS FANTASTIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
jailbird
In article <32878A...@ix.netcom.com>, jmei...@ix.netco> Ok, hit me with
>>
>> steve
>character, plus her retarded sister, Stephen Chow's love interest.
>While amusing primarily because it is unusual, I think this conclusively
>proves Gong Li is a one note actress, though I admit she is a pretty
>good one. When I see her in a movie are start making bets on how she is
>going to die, which she does with out fail. It seems that in every
>movie she plays a bitch who redeems herself at the end by dying
>tragically, killing herself, or going mad; the victim of a harsh unjust
>world.
> In my opinion the ability to do both comedy and drama is the true
>measure of a good actor/actress. Greta Garbo mostly plyed the same sort
>of roles as Gong Li, yet when the time came to do comedy she delivered
>in "Ninotchka," something Gong Li has never done.
> Gong Li is the poster girl for Socialist Realism, every time I see her
>in a movie it makes me want to make a Chinese version of Dreiser's
>"Sister Carrie." But I don't know whether it would be serious or a
>parody.
>
>-JRM-
>John R. Meixner
>Austin, Texas
all!
yqh...@is.nyu.edu
> i personally adore her and her work. but i did read somewhere zhang
> saying something like, she has a lot of natural talent but she'll need
> formal training if she ever wants to really live up to her potential.
> that may have been just the kind of left-handed compliment you'd expect
> from an estranged beau, tho.
She did get formal training, plus, Zhang Yimou informally
trained her during their long time companionship. Gong
Li's success is largely due to Zhang Yimou's help. She got fame and
admirations from his films. I think a good director, a good script, and
plenty of luck are the crucial elements for an average actor/actress's
success.
> : Gong Li is the poster girl for Socialist Realism, every time I see her
> : in a movie it makes me want to make a Chinese version of Dreiser's
> : "Sister Carrie." But I don't know whether it would be serious or a
> : parody.
"Socialist Realism"? In no way is she "socialist realism"
anymore. She has gone out of the bounds of China already.
Shelly Kraicer
Stephen Lu wrote:
>
> Allright, flame bait time!
>
> Because, Gong Li has a very limited range of characters that she can
> portray. I haven't seen all of the films that she has been in, but the
> ones I have seen her in, (ie, Red Sorgum, Farewell My Concubine, and a
> few others), the characters that she has portrayed are all pretty much
> the same. I don't know her personally, but I suspect she is pretty much
> like the characters she's played. In other words, she plays herself the
> best. And remember in THE FLIRTING SCHOLAR, a comedy?
[...]
"Plays herself"? I doubt it. Perhaps the what's limited is just the
number of films you've seen her in. I'm thinking especially of THE STORY
OF QIU JU (Qiu Ju da guansi)(1992). She plays a frumpy, simple-talking
peasant woman totally unlike anything else she's done up to that point,
or since. And won a best actress award at the Venice [I think] Film
Festival for it.
It may be true that she's the kind of intuitive actress (unlike, say, an
Emma Thompson), whose performances are heavily dependent on the what
sort of instruction and inspiration she receives from her director. At
least this is the impression I get from the few interviews of her I've
seen in English. Thus her rather more routine appearances in HK films,
and to a lesser extent, in Chen Kaige's films. On the other hand, that
sound pretty stupid: to say that her ability to play powerful, creative
women comes from the strength and creativity of the men who direct her.
Ugh.
After a couple of less than amazing performances for Zhang Yimou, though
(in TO LIVE [Huozhe] and SHANGHAI TRIAD [Yao ya yao, yao dao waipo
qiao]), she seems to made a welcome return to form in Chen's TEMPTRESS
MOON.
S.
Frank Djeng
Stephen Lu wrote:
> > like the characters she's played. In other words, she plays herself the
think she's more like playing Stephen Chiao's idea of Gong Li in that
film.(Great flick, btw, but the humor is almost impossible to get through
for a Western audience)
She was great in STORY OF QIU JU, and was excellent playing the most
extreme opposite kind in FAREWELL MY CONCUBINE, and somehow to me she was
quite natural in both films.
Frank
Kelly E Coffey
Stephen Lu (luxx...@gold.tc.umn.edu) wrote:
Steve,
Obviously, you haven't seen The Story of Qui Ju, which if you ask me,
is as far away from the "usual" Gong Li role as you can get. usually,
she's playing slightly more beautiful women, but in this film, you
barely recognize her. I think it's a phenomenal performance and a
phenomenal movie, for she takes what would seem on the surface a
very average character and makes it memorable. I also think her
performance in "To Live" is very good as well. Unfortunately,
because of where I live, I don't have access to as many Asian movies
as I would like, but the one where she plays dual roles sounds
fascinating.
Kelly
: Allright, flame bait time!
:
: Because, Gong Li has a very limited range of characters that she can
: portray. I haven't seen all of the films that she has been in, but the
: ones I have seen her in, (ie, Red Sorgum, Farewell My Concubine, and a
: few others), the characters that she has portrayed are all pretty much
: the same. I don't know her personally, but I suspect she is pretty much
: like the characters she's played. In other words, she plays herself the
: best. And remember in THE FLIRTING SCHOLAR, a comedy? She never had any
: funny part in there. Her role was the serious, romantic woman. Why? I
: suspect because she couldn't deliver, the timing and the sense that's
: required to do comedy.
:
: What she has going for her is her classic Chinese beauty, and a great
: director that was her husband, Zhang Yimou, and good scripts with roles
: written just for her.
:
: With all that said, I am very happy that she has made international
: fame. Not very many Chinese/Asian actors has made that far. But I hope
: she can still hold up withouth Zhang Yimou.
:
: Ok, hit me with your fire and brimstones!
:
: steve
John R. Meixner
yqh...@is.nyu.edu wrote:
>
> > i personally adore her and her work. but i did read somewhere zhang
> > saying something like, she has a lot of natural talent but she'll need
> > formal training if she ever wants to really live up to her potential.
> > that may have been just the kind of left-handed compliment you'd expect
> > from an estranged beau, tho.
>
> She did get formal training, plus, Zhang Yimou informally
> trained her during their long time companionship. Gong
> Li's success is largely due to Zhang Yimou's help. She got fame and
> admirations from his films. I think a good director, a good script, and
> plenty of luck are the crucial elements for an average actor/actress's
> success.
>
Certainly, I completely agree, Zhang Yimou has great talent, and has the
great ability to draw excellent performances out many actors/actresses,
esp. Gong Li. Nothing is more important than a good director and a good
role in making any performer.
> > : Gong Li is the poster girl for Socialist Realism, every time I see her
> > : in a movie it makes me want to make a Chinese version of Dreiser's
> > : "Sister Carrie." But I don't know whether it would be serious or a
> > : parody.
>
> "Socialist Realism"? In no way is she "socialist realism"
> anymore. She has gone out of the bounds of China already.
>
>
By "Socialist Realism" I don't mean PRC films though most of the ones I
have seen have been. What I am talking about is the sort of message
movie that that is heavily dependent for its conflict and tension upon
social forces. This type of movie, story, etc.. is one of the mainstays
of twentieth century drama, and many great Social Realist films have
been made including several with Gong Li, notably "Raise the Red
Lantern" and "Story of Qiu Ju," but also "Grapes of Wrath" and "Ballad
of a Soldier" all of which are in my mind excellent films. What I was
trying to say, and admittedly I didn't communicate it well, was that of
the work by Gong Li that I have seen, most of it seems to be in that
vein. I also think that when she steps out of it she is uninteresting
and basically serves as window dressing.
I believe she is a one note actress, all be it a fine one.
Sigmund C. Shen
Frank Djeng (webs...@taiseng.com) wrote:
: She was great in STORY OF QIU JU, and was excellent playing the most
: quite natural in both films.
: Frank
to go offtopic for a sec, have y'all seen wolverine's news this week?
gong li signing a record contract?! well, if that was really her singing
in shanghai triad, i guess it'll be ok.
sig
Stephen Lu
Kelly E Coffey wrote:
>
> Stephen Lu (luxx...@gold.tc.umn.edu) wrote:
>
> Steve,
> Obviously, you haven't seen The Story of Qui Ju, which if you ask me,
> is as far away from the "usual" Gong Li role as you can get. usually,
> she's playing slightly more beautiful women, but in this film, you
> barely recognize her. I think it's a phenomenal performance and a
> phenomenal movie, for she takes what would seem on the surface a
> very average character and makes it memorable. I also think her
> performance in "To Live" is very good as well. Unfortunately,
> because of where I live, I don't have access to as many Asian movies
> as I would like, but the one where she plays dual roles sounds
> fascinating.
> Kelly
Actually, I did see THE STORY OF QUI JU. I liked the movie. yes, it was not the "usual"
Gong Li role, but from what i remember about her role, first there wasn't a lot of
dialog, and the rest of the movie i just remember her walking around looking lost. And
then she just talked like she had a sinus conjestion in a very monotonous voice to give
that frumpy peasant woman look/feel. I didn't think her role was particularly difficult.
I saw the movie TO LIVE, also. I liked that movie, too. But I still found her to be the
same old self again. To me, she just hasn't shown me that she can be versatile.
Sorry to differ. :>
Support your local HK cinema.
http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g186/luxx0039/AMA
steve
Paul Greim
"stephen lu wrote: Gong Li has a very limited range of characters that
"she canportray. I haven't seen all of the films that she has been in...
i dont think so: i have seen most of her films and i think she is not
limited of the characters. she is one of the best actresses!
Sir KFC
On 18 Nov 1996 fip...@aol.com wrote:
> In article <56e692$q...@news.nyu.edu>, scs...@is2.nyu.edu (Sigmund C.
> Shen) writes:
>
> >well, if that was really her singing
> >in shanghai triad, i guess it'll be ok.
> >
> >
>
> i really don't think it was her. Theres no way.
i read Chinese and it says it's her in the credits.
--
Kevin Hsien-Hsin Chen P.O. Box 6247
kev...@leland.stanford.edu Stanford, CA 94309
http://www.stanford.edu/~kevinc (415) 497-6182
KFC's quote of the week, month, year, or whenever he feels otherwise:
"If pro is the opposite of con, is progress the opposite of congress?"
fip...@aol.com
>well, if that was really her singing
>in shanghai triad, i guess it'll be ok.
>
>
i really don't think it was her. Theres no way.
Fipper
Don Marion
No reason why not. After all, she started out to be a singer, then
switched to acting when she couldn't get into China's top music school.
When I was living there a few years ago, I would occasionally see her
doing guest shots on TV, and she always did a song on those occasions,
usually pop ballads. Yeah, it was probably her.
--
Don
Richard K. Meyers
>
> I've seen five of her films and I think she is great. Maybe as good as > Meryl Streep. I heard there may be a Hollywood movie deal in the works > with Richard Geer. Just rumor.
>
> I think she has played alot of similar roles which might make it seem >she is limited but the test is how well she does it. Just my opinion.
David Blume
I just saw Gong Li with Brigette Lin in a period-piece fly-by-wire
movie at the Towne Theater in Santa Clara, CA. It wasn't her
typical sulking role, it was campy, and she did well in it.
This is strange to say, I always knew she was beautiful, but
she was absolutely captivating in that movie. Brigette Lin just
couldn't hold a candle compared to her...
--David
John R. Meixner
The only one I can think of is "Semi-Gods & Semi-Devils," starring
Brigitte Li, Gong Li, and Cheung Man. I thought it was truly awful and
aside from the unfortunate presence of Cheung Man, it showed that Gong
Li should never make a sword movie. Brigitte Lin was born to make Sword
films (even when she is just collecting her paycheck, as she was in this
one), Gong Li is not, she is just not theatrical enough. She seemed
wooden, dull, and out of place in this movie. I think she is a fine
actress but she is just not suited for the over the top tyle of a
traditional fantasy epic.
fip...@aol.com
In article <3294AB...@pinnaclesys.com>, David Blume
<dbl...@pinnaclesys.com> writes:
>I just saw Gong Li with Brigette Lin in a period-piece fly-by-wire
>movie at the Towne Theater in Santa Clara, CA. It wasn't her
>typical sulking role, it was campy, and she did well in it.
>
>This is strange to say, I always knew she was beautiful, but
>she was absolutely captivating in that movie. Brigette Lin just
>couldn't hold a candle compared to her...
>
>
The movie you saw was Semi-Gods and Semi-Devils. I think Bridgette Lin did
a better job in this movie than Gong Li. Bridgette had a weaker role and
she played the evil character. Gong Li was so stiff, and her emotions were
not getting across clear enough. Yeah, it wasn't your typical sulking role
but she was sulking typically and a lot in this film.
Fipper
Nhan Tran
fip...@aol.com wrote:
: In article <3294AB...@pinnaclesys.com>, David Blume
: <dbl...@pinnaclesys.com> writes:
: >I just saw Gong Li with Brigette Lin in a period-piece fly-by-wire
: >movie at the Towne Theater in Santa Clara, CA. It wasn't her
: >typical sulking role, it was campy, and she did well in it.
: >
: >This is strange to say, I always knew she was beautiful, but
: >she was absolutely captivating in that movie. Brigette Lin just
: >couldn't hold a candle compared to her...
: >
: >
: The movie you saw was Semi-Gods and Semi-Devils ...
The movie is actually Dragon Chronicles: The Maiden, directed by Andy Chin
starring Briggete Lin and Gong Li as two rival martial artists having the
crush on their martial art "brother". The move is about their continuing
rivalry.
N.Tran
David Blume
Nhan Tran wrote:
> fip...@aol.com wrote:
> : In article <3294AB...@pinnaclesys.com>, David Blume
> : <dbl...@pinnaclesys.com> writes:
>
> : >I just saw Gong Li with Brigette Lin in a period-piece fly-by-wire
> : >movie at the Towne Theater in Santa Clara, CA. It wasn't her
> : >typical sulking role, it was campy, and she did well in it.
>
>
> The movie is actually Dragon Chronicles: The Maiden, directed by Andy Chin
> starring Briggete Lin and Gong Li as two rival martial artists having the
> crush on their martial art "brother". The move is about their continuing
> rivalry.
Yeah! That *was* it. People here seem to think that "Semi-Gods and
Semi-Devils" really stinks. I liked "Dragon Chronicles." What did
anybody else think of "Dragon Chronicles." It would be a shame if people
really thought that Gong Li couldn't break out of her brooding stereotype,
and couldn't even do a campy wire-fu movie...
--David
mpk
Nhan Tran wrote:
>
> fip...@aol.com wrote:
> : In article <3294AB...@pinnaclesys.com>, David Blume
> : <dbl...@pinnaclesys.com> writes:
>
> : >I just saw Gong Li with Brigette Lin in a period-piece fly-by-wire
> : >movie at the Towne Theater in Santa Clara, CA. It wasn't her
> : >typical sulking role, it was campy, and she did well in it.
> : >
> : >she was absolutely captivating in that movie. Brigette Lin just
> : >couldn't hold a candle compared to her...
> : >
> : >
>
>
> The movie is actually Dragon Chronicles: The Maiden, directed by Andy Chin
> starring Briggete Lin and Gong Li as two rival martial artists having the
> crush on their martial art "brother". The move is about their continuing
> rivalry.
>
Same Move. It is Dragon Chronicles: The Maiden but it is also known as
Semi-Gods and Semi-Devils (I see it referred to as Semi-Gods and
Semi-Devils almost exclusively on this group).
-Michael