[akka-user] Ticket 117 : What's hard about Akka for newcomers?

[Viktor Klang]

Greetings fellow hAkkers,

In order to be able to fix issue 117 I need additional feedback from our users, what is hard about Akka for a newcomer?

Any special cases we should document?

--
Viktor Klang
| "A complex system that works is invariably
| found to have evolved from a simple system
| that worked." - John Gall

Akka - the Actor Kernel: Akkasource.org
Twttr: twitter.com/viktorklang

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[Mikael Sundberg]

Hi, 

Great ticket, il think some more about it, but the first thing that comes to mind is that there is not much on getting started with the java api. for example java isnt mentioned in the getting started guide

Something like a mvn archetype to create a java sceleton that uses akka would be nice if thats possible? (im a mvn newbie so dont realy know)

When it comes to working with the akka source, something like a sbt target to create an eclipse/idea/netbeans project would probably be helpfull? or maybe its possible to create a .pom in the root, dont think i got that to work when i tried.

/Micke

2010/5/24 Viktor Klang <viktor...@gmail.com>

[Dean Wampler]

I left a comment for the ticket.

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twitter: @deanwampler, @chicagoscala
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http://aquarium.rubyforge.org
http://www.contract4j.org

[Dustin Whitney]

I think it's confusing that you can use akka both in  stand-alone-kernel form, and with libs in your own program.  I think there needs to be a clear explanation of that, and perhaps it should be clearly documented which attributes in the config file are for stand alone and which are not.

Dustin

[Kevin Wright]

Oh yes, definitely more explanation on running it as an integrated library.

Possibly even with notes on using it from Maven, as SBT is an unlikely option for Java users.

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[Mikael Sundberg]

http://wicket.apache.org/quickstart.html

i like the way their quickstart is. you cant fail with that.

/Micke

2010/5/24 Kevin Wright <kev.lee...@googlemail.com>

[Mikael Sundberg]

i got curious about the mvn archetype thing.

so i created one from the akka sample for java i had.

http://github.com/bobo/akka_mvn_archetyp

since its in github and not housted you need to:

git clone git://github.com/bobo/akka_mvn_archetyp.git

cd akka_mvn_archetyp

mvn install

then somewhere else in a folder you want your project:

mvn archetype:generate -DarchetypeCatalog=local

and follow the guide, you should have a archetype named something like: akka_sample_java-archetype 

in the list.

then you can do mvn test and if you have redis running it should pass

but the code itself is probably not the best choice for a mvn archetype. but atleast i found out that its easy to create.

/Micke

2010/5/24 Mikael Sundberg <mikael.s...@gmail.com>

[Jonas Bonér]

On 24 May 2010 16:57, Dustin Whitney <dustin....@gmail.com> wrote:

I think it's confusing that you can use akka both in  stand-alone-kernel form, and with libs in your own program.  I think there needs to be a clear explanation of that, and perhaps it should be clearly documented which attributes in the config file are for stand alone and which are not.

I use stand-alone when I need to write my own bare bones, stand-alone network server. No web, no UI. 

I use akka as lib for everything else.

--
Jonas Bonér

work:   http://jayway.com
code:   http://akkasource.com
blog:    http://jonasboner.com
twitter: @jboner

[Ivan Porto Carrero]

Hi

Now that you mention it I'm having trouble getting the lift sample to run with akka 0.8.1 or head
---
Met vriendelijke groeten - Best regards - Salutations
Ivan Porto Carrero 

[Stefan]

I try to get started with akka since one week. I wrote a small ping
pong example with remote actors (http://paste.pocoo.org/show/217812/)
and get a server side error "ERR [20100524-23:00:50.572] remote:
java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: PingPongServer". I googled and
decided to build akka from source.

New to sbt (and built tools like maven) I still have some problems
building akka:
* including all the sources in the jars
* including the source jars in eclipse, mainly because
"se.scalablesolutions.akka" is missing
* publish-local doesn't seem to publish everything needed - at least I
didn't manage to use the local sbt repo to import akka for my own
project dependencies
* I don't always manage to build akka, depending on the day I check
out. Mainly because some dependency (e.g. configgy) problems.

I build current 0.9 for Scala RC2 today: now, my simple PingPong
Example doesn't compile any more:
[error] Z:\Coden\sbt\SbtAkka\src\main\scala\experimental
\PingPong.scala:31: type mismatch;
[error] found : se.scalablesolutions.akka.actor.ActorRef
[error] required: se.scalablesolutions.akka.actor.Actor
[error] val client = new PingClient(actor)
[error] Z:\Coden\sbt\SbtAkka\src\main\scala\experimental
\PingPong.scala:32: value start is not a member of experimental.
PingClient
[error] client.start
[error] ^
[error] Z:\Coden\sbt\SbtAkka\src\main\scala\experimental
\PingPong.scala:59: not found: value reply
[error] reply('pong)
(...)

Please note, these are my -hopefully not general- problems with akka.


Another point would be to mention e.g. the shortcomings of remote
actors. I've seen in Jonas Scala Days presentation that STMs are not
possible with RemoteActors. It would be nice to mention shortcomings
somewhere.

[Stefan]

I've continued reading the newsgroup, changed my PingPong Example so
it does compile (http://paste.pocoo.org/show/217827/).
Still, same error. What am I doing wrong?

[Jonas Bonér]

On 24 May 2010 20:43, Mikael Sundberg <mikael.s...@gmail.com> wrote:

i got curious about the mvn archetype thing.

so i created one from the akka sample for java i had.

http://github.com/bobo/akka_mvn_archetyp

since its in github and not housted you need to:

Great. Thanks. We'll add links to that later.

--
Jonas Bonér

work:   http://jayway.com
code:   http://akkasource.com
blog:    http://jonasboner.com
twitter: @jboner

[Jonas Bonér]

Do you have the JAR on both the client and remote site? 

Akka does currently not do remote class loading/provisioning. 

--
Jonas Bonér

work:   http://jayway.com
code:   http://akkasource.com
blog:    http://jonasboner.com
twitter: @jboner

[Jonas Bonér]

Stefan,

If you remove this line then there is no actor registered and it can't possibly work: 

//    RemoteNode.register("PingPongServer",pingPongServerActor ) //doesn't compile

What compilation error are you getting?

On 25 May 2010 00:15, Stefan <stef...@gmail.com> wrote:

--
Jonas Bonér

work:   http://jayway.com
code:   http://akkasource.com
blog:    http://jonasboner.com
twitter: @jboner

[Mikael Sundberg]

If you have some suggestions on how the code generated by the archetype should contain/do i could throw something more suitable togheter.

/Micke

2010/5/25 Jonas Bonér <jo...@jonasboner.com>

[Jonas Bonér]

Thanks. I'll think about it.

--
Jonas Bonér
http://jayway.com
http://akkasource.com
twitter: jboner

On 25 May 2010 22:35, "Mikael Sundberg" <mikael.s...@gmail.com> wrote:

If you have some suggestions on how the code generated by the archetype should contain/do i could throw something more suitable togheter.

/Micke

2010/5/25 Jonas Bonér <jo...@jonasboner.com>

>
>
>
> On 24 May 2010 20:43, Mikael Sundberg <mikael.s...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>

>> i got curi...

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[Espen]

My first experience with Akka Actors was a 90 minutes attempt to port
from Scala Actors to Akka Actors (version 0.7). A part of my challenge
where limited Scala experience, so even small differences takes time
to understand.

Things I remember I would like documented:
* Better documentation on differences between Akka and Scala Actors.
* Akka uses !, !!, !!!, and Scala actors uses !, !? and !!
* The import Akka.sender.self is resolved for Scala 2.8
* How do to receiveWithin?

Cheers

-Espen

On May 25, 10:35 pm, Mikael Sundberg <mikael.sundber...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> If you have some suggestions on how the code generated by the archetype
> should contain/do i could throw something more suitable togheter.
> /Micke
>
> 2010/5/25 Jonas Bonér <jo...@jonasboner.com>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 24 May 2010 20:43, Mikael Sundberg <mikael.sundber...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> i got curious about the mvn archetype thing.
> >> so i created one from the akka sample for java i had.
> >>http://github.com/bobo/akka_mvn_archetyp
> >> since its in github and not housted you need to:
>
> > Great. Thanks. We'll add links to that later.
>
> >> git clone git://github.com/bobo/akka_mvn_archetyp.git
> >> cd akka_mvn_archetyp
> >> mvn install
> >> then somewhere else in a folder you want your project:
> >> mvn archetype:generate -DarchetypeCatalog=local
> >> and follow the guide, you should have a archetype named something
> >> like: akka_sample_java-archetype
> >> in the list.
>
> >> then you can do mvn test and if you have redis running it should pass
> >> but the code itself is probably not the best choice for a mvn archetype.
> >> but atleast i found out that its easy to create.
>
> >> /Micke
>

> >> 2010/5/24 Mikael Sundberg <mikael.sundber...@gmail.com>
>
> >>http://wicket.apache.org/quickstart.html

> >>> <http://wicket.apache.org/quickstart.html>i like the way their
> >>> quickstart is. you cant fail with that.
> >>>  /Micke
>

> >>> 2010/5/24 Kevin Wright <kev.lee.wri...@googlemail.com>

>
> >>> Oh yes, definitely more explanation on running it as an integrated
> >>>> library.
>
> >>>> Possibly even with notes on using it from Maven, as SBT is an unlikely
> >>>> option for Java users.
>

> >>>> On 24 May 2010 15:57, Dustin Whitney <dustin.whit...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>>>> I think it's confusing that you can use akka both in
> >>>>> stand-alone-kernel form, and with libs in your own program.  I think there
> >>>>> needs to be a clear explanation of that, and perhaps it should be clearly
> >>>>> documented which attributes in the config file are for stand alone and which
> >>>>> are not.
>
> >>>>> Dustin
>

> >>>>> On Mon, May 24, 2010 at 10:54 AM, Dean Wampler <deanwamp...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
> >>>>>> I left a comment for the ticket.
>

> >>>>>> On Mon, May 24, 2010 at 1:29 AM, Viktor Klang <viktor.kl...@gmail.com
> >>>>>> > wrote:
>
> >>>>>>> Greetings fellow hAkkers,
>
> >>>>>>> In order to be able to fix issue 117<https://www.assembla.com/spaces/akka/tickets/117-document-things-that...>I need additional feedback from our users, what is hard about Akka for a

> >>>>>>> newcomer?
>
> >>>>>>> Any special cases we should document?
>
> >>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>> Viktor Klang
> >>>>>>> | "A complex system that works is invariably
> >>>>>>> | found to have evolved from a simple system
> >>>>>>> | that worked." - John Gall
>
> >>>>>>> Akka - the Actor Kernel: Akkasource.org
> >>>>>>> Twttr: twitter.com/viktorklang
>
> >>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> >>>>>>> Groups "Akka User List" group.
> >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to akka...@googlegroups.com.
> >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

> >>>>>>> akka-user+...@googlegroups.com<akka-user%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups .com>

> >>>>>>> .
> >>>>>>> For more options, visit this group at
> >>>>>>>http://groups.google.com/group/akka-user?hl=en.
>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> Dean Wampler
> >>>>>> coauthor of "Programming Scala" (O'Reilly)
> >>>>>> -  http://programmingscala.com
>
> >>>>>> twitter: @deanwampler, @chicagoscala
> >>>>>> blog:http://blog.polyglotprogramming.com
> >>>>>> Chicago-Area Scala Enthusiasts (CASE):
> >>>>>> -  http://groups.google.com/group/chicagoscala
> >>>>>> -  http://www.meetup.com/chicagoscala/(Meetings)
> >>>>>>http://www.linkedin.com/in/deanwampler
> >>>>>>http://www.polyglotprogramming.com
> >>>>>>http://aquarium.rubyforge.org
> >>>>>>http://www.contract4j.org
>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> >>>>>> Groups "Akka User List" group.
> >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to akka...@googlegroups.com.
> >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

> >>>>>> akka-user+...@googlegroups.com<akka-user%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups .com>

> >>>>>> .
> >>>>>> For more options, visit this group at
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>
> >>>>>  --
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> >>>>> .
> >>>>> For more options, visit this group at
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>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Kevin Wright
>

> >>>> mail/google talk: kev.lee.wri...@googlemail.com
> >>>> wave: kev.lee.wri...@googlewave.com

> >>>> skype: kev.lee.wright
> >>>> twitter: @thecoda
>
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>
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>
> > --
> > Jonas Bonér
>
> > work:  http://jayway.com
> > code:  http://akkasource.com
> > blog:    http://jonasboner.com
> > twitter: @jboner
>
> >  --
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[Jonas Bonér]

On 25 May 2010 23:14, Espen <espen....@gmail.com> wrote:
> My first experience with Akka Actors was a 90 minutes attempt to port
> from Scala Actors to Akka Actors (version 0.7). A part of my challenge
> where limited Scala experience, so even small differences takes time
> to understand.
>
> Things I remember I would like documented:
>  * Better documentation on differences between Akka and Scala Actors.

Good idea.

>  * Akka uses !, !!, !!!, and Scala actors uses !, !? and !!
>  * The import Akka.sender.self is resolved for Scala 2.8
>  * How do to receiveWithin?

Working on that. Stay tuned.
receiveWithin in Scala Actors is based on mailbox linear search. Very costly.
I'll try to see if we can come up with an efficient impl. If not then
we'll have to pass.
Ideas welcome.

> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to akka-user+...@googlegroups.com.

[Stefan]

> Things I remember I would like documented:
> * Better documentation on differences between Akka and Scala Actors.

I started a question about differences in scala actor implementations
on stackoverflow:
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2906162/different-scala-actor-implementations-overview
Sadly, no one answered yet :(

[Alex Cruise]

On 10-05-28 01:10 AM, Jonas Bonér wrote:

receiveWithin in Scala Actors is based on mailbox linear search. Very costly.
I'll try to see if we can come up with an efficient impl. If not then
we'll have to pass.
Ideas welcome.
  

IIUC this is what TranslucentFunction is for--obviously it requires compiler support though.

http://lampsvn.epfl.ch/trac/scala/browser/scala/branches/translucent/src/library/scala/TranslucentFunction.scala

Years go, in a shocking display of naivete, I had this crazy idea ;)

http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.lang.scala.user/1401

-0xe1a

[Viktor Klang]

Alex, that I believe is being done for the new Scala Actors in 2.8
I think I remember hearing something about that at ScalaDays,
so it's not really _that_ naïve ;)

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