I currently own a laptop which I use heavily for image editing. It is powered by a very fast Core 2 Duo 2.4GHz and a power-efficient yet perfectly capable Intel X3100 integrated graphics chip.
My chip supports all of the necessary Shader versions, OpenGL, etc. ( <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_GMA#GMA_X3100> ). However, when I visit the Preferences menu to enable the OpenGL acceleration, I am presented with a grayed-out option telling me I may need to upgrade my drivers or graphics card.
I have tried new driver versions. Certainly I should not have to purchase another card (impossible in a laptop in fact) seeing as my chip supports all of the requisite features.
Help? Thanks!
Steve
BTW Don't feel bad CS4 won't use the GPU on my laptop either. No problem
with my desktop, but no go on the laptop.
Robert
Mylenium
Perhaps I'm missing something, but it makes sense to me that if you're programming for OpenGL, all cards that support it should work... perhaps some way we can edit into the .ini the Intel chip info to allow it to be supported?
I know I am reaching here, but I would really love to have this functionality available to me during editing.
Steve
I would also suggest waiting and checking the net from time to time. Someone
may come up with a way to make it work. But, I would start with the laptop
maker.
Robert
Thanks again,
Steve
Perhaps I'm missing something, but it makes sense to me that if you're
programming for OpenGL, all cards that support it should work... perhaps
some way we can edit into the .ini the Intel chip >info to allow it to
be supported?
Theory, and, according to Nitzsche and Einstein, all theory is grey. ;-) You must understand that OpenGL does not simply equal a suitable hardware being in place. A key component in the whole process is the ICD (installable client driver), you graphics card driver. It acts as a translation matrix from the high-level OpenGL commands to the low-level actual machine code and, specific to your situation, that matrix also takes care of circumventing hardware bugs, which is a major stinker with intel chipsets. That aside, the number of instruction steps must be equal, so, as it is now, if most intel chips only support 16/32 parallel instructions, but desktop cards 48 up to 192 in the latest NVidia models, there is a very obvious mismatch. Ultimately a card like your intel model could still process the commands, but split it up in multiple loops, but this would cause other functions having to wait, breaking the realtime behavior. So to make a long story short: While it may be possible to hack/ adjust the intel driver so CS4 can use it, the practical benefits may not play out, regardless.
Mylenium
Robert
I've tried Dell's driver and am currently running the most recent officially-released Intel driver instead... which supposedly supports all the necessary instruction sets, etc. Hmm...
Mylenium,
Thanks; you're right, just because the chip supports the necessary functions doesn't mean that it can handle what's being thrown at it by the application. That may well be the issue; integrated chips might be too terribly underpowered for this to work. It's strange because it doesn't make sense why such simplistic functions would require all that much power (it isn't like we're talking 3-D here... which, by the way, the Intel chips can do, albeit however choppily), but I digress...
I suppose I'll probably just wait and see how this plays out. I would think we could at least see anti-aliasing in action without the need for a dedicated graphics solution, but perhaps I'm expecting far too much from an integrated chip and just don't realize it.
Steve
I believe Intel is still working to update their chipset drivers to implement some of the features.
Thanks for the reply.
The 15.11.2 driver looks to support everything the way it should...
<http://downloadmirror.intel.com/16939/eng/relnotes_winvista_gfx.htm>
"Support for OpenGL* 2.0 plus extensions (Intel® G31, G33, Q33, & Q35 Express Chipsets not supported)"
It also supposedly works with Shader Model 4.0 now as well, and I know it can wrestle enough memory, shared through it may be.
I hope I'm not beating a dead horse here; I just want my anti-aliasing. :)
Steve
Thanks very much for the input!
Steve
Thank you!
Hey, it's all not so bad! It's all ok with the chip - Photoshop CS4 supports all this stuff on MacBook with exactly the same chip. So it's definitely problem with the drivers! O_o
I hope this issue remains relevant so that it can be corrected in future for PC users. I feel it is a big problem as a lot of people run X3100 GPUs in their mobile computers for battery-saving purposes.
Steve
We hear you, and there are a number of people at Intel working to deliver a driver update that will enable the OpenGL features needed for Photoshop CS4 on Windows XP/Vista. We will provide an update in the coming weeks on when to expect the revised driver.
FYI, a driver update release is planned for next week that will improve the stability of Adobe Premiere Pro CS4 on Intel graphics chipsets that support OpenGL 2.0.
Eric Palmer
Intel Corp.
Nice to see you in the forums Eric!
I'm really happy to hear that the issue is being worked out. Thanks again.
Steve
- Eric
- Eric
Direct Links:
15.11.4.1591 (EXE): <http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=17119>
15.11.4.64.1591 (EXE): <http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=17122>
15.11.4.1591 (ZIP): <http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=17120>
15.11.4.64.1591 (ZIP): <http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&DwnldID=17124>
Cheers
To be clear, the current Intel driver does not support GL_ARB_texture_float and has GL_MAX_TEXTURE_SIZE=2048 where PS CS4 requires GL_MAX_TEXTURE_SIZE>=4096. These changes are in progress, along with fixing some other bugs. Once these new features are stable, they will be available in a driver update, and Photoshop will begin to recognize and use Intel graphics for OpenGL features.
- Eric
I salute you!
this kind of interaction is one reason why i run intel chips on intel boards.
thanks eric.
dave
Thank you.
Forget about Intel support. There is no intel support exist. Intel sells processors and never supports any of them, until there's a really serious case. Your case, I guess is not serious, there are too few of you having to run Photoshop. You're not millions. So you can forget updates or stuff like that - Intel has many more seroius things to do.
Intel can make updated drivers for dozens of years, they are not interested in their customers loyalty, until they sell their millions of processors and sell them well.
If you want support, buy from any other producer. Find one that supports their products. If you want anything else without support - buy from Intel.
Maybe I'm too aggressive but that's the sad truth about any company that goes big and fat.
The Intel integrated graphics chipsets may not have a great track record with OpenGL support on Windows, having only released OpenGL 2.0 support this year, but I think your hostility is a bit unwarranted.
It may take a couple more months (I can't promise any specific timeframe) to finish implementing the needed changes to the OpenGL driver, validate it, and ship the first version that enables Photoshop CS4's OpenGL features. I understand that the wait is frustrating, but we do want to release a stable driver.
Feel free to post Intel product related issues or questions on the forums at <http://software.intel.com>.
- Eric
Intel fixes their drivers...well, maybe ONCE in a year. (And some of them are not even close to 'stable'. Intel Storage Matrix drivers, Intel Turbo memory have serious bugs that crash windows, and they're being updated only ONCE in a year).
NVidia (and many other ones) ship new versions of their drivers every week. They have the desired functionality, and if they don't - they will - just next week. Yes, they're not stable - but which ones are so ideally stable?
It's not about stability, it's about how the biggest processor manufacturer cares about what they sell and whom they sell to. And it's the reality.
I'm graphic and animation designer. My company buys CS4 suite including Photoshop & Flash. And I'm buying a laptop and now choosing between one having Intel Graphics and another with ATI Radeon. Intel has some features I need, but after finding and reading this topic till the end, I see it does not support Photoshop CS4!!! I also need Flash CS4 working, so I guess it does not support Flash as well!!!
So can you still recommend me buying intel integrated-laptop or should I take an ATI Radeon powered one? I need Photoshop working without annoying compatibilites problems. I don't want to buy an Intel one, if it is not Photoshop-compatible....
Thank you!
Let me clarify. I am not aware of any current compatibility issues with Flash (author or player).
The current Intel graphics drivers do not have the OpenGL features that Photoshop looks for to enable OpenGL acceleration. Intel is in the process of developing and testing an updated driver that will support this, hopefully to be released in early 2009.
However, Photoshop CS4 does currently run reliably on systems with Intel graphics - it's just that the new OpenGL-accelerated features in CS4 are not available.
I have used an Intel GM45 system with a pre-production driver to test the new Photoshop CS4 OpenGL features like smooth-zoom, birds-eye view, and canvas rotate, and they perform smoothly. The OpenGL performance is noticably slower on older GM965 systems, but it is still almost-smooth and better than not having OpenGL enabled at all. (Note that OpenGL 2.0 will not be supported on GM945 and earlier chipsets.)
It seems you are aware that the choice of a new notebook system does not only depend on the graphics chip's capabilities, but rather how the performance of the whole system suits your needs. For example, I use Premiere Pro to edit HDV and AVCHD video, and this depends much more on the performance of the CPU than on the graphics, so I would want a system with the best CPU, perhaps even at the cost of some graphics performance.
From what I have seen of Photoshop's new OpenGL features, the GM45 chipset is quite capable of giving most users a nice, smooth experience, and even the GM965 is "ok", with just a little jerkiness. An exception may be users that bring fancy, large 3D models into Photoshop - this should work, but I don't have that type of file to test the performance (anybody want to share some?).
To summarize, the Intel graphics systems will work with Photoshop CS4 now, just without OpenGL features. If these OpenGL features are important to you, and you can wait until Feb-March for the new driver (sorry, still no firm promise on the exact date), then I would still recommend an Intel integrated graphics system with a GM965, GM35, or GM45 chipset (GM45 having the best performance).
I see that unsupported capabilities in software by Intel prevent Photoshop from showing its all features that are crucial to the creative process. And who knows what Adobe will implement in their next release that will be unsupported and supported by Intel 'patch' some day. I can't wait - I have to create! I need a laptop that will run Photoshop for two years minimum with maximum creative features turned on. And after your words I see that it's not an Intel one.
So sorry, Intel guys, I can't be with you.
Thank you all for this thread, you kept me from a mistake. It's time for a brush!
So sorry, Intel guys, I can't be with you.
Which is why I use AMD. And why I didn't blink when Mac Fiends were abuzz about Intel chips in their bubble machines.
All my computers, save my current one, have had two things in common: Windows OS and Intel proc and they all had issues ranging from mildly annoying to me devising creative ways to destroy them (at times while I was whacking it with something already).
I have an AMD machine at home now (still Windows OS) and I've had no problems with it. So... the Mac Fiends and PC Intel Loyalists can have their Intel procs; I'll stick with something that works.
So sorry, Intel guys, I can't be with you. Which is why I use AMD.
apples and oranges! the processor is NOT the gpu or graphics chipset... i'll stick with intel for my processor, thanks. go for an intel chip in a notebook with a real card, not onboard graphics. :)
You sound like an ad for graphics cards, dave.
It's not a long stretch to think that someday, someone will figure out how to put it all on a device the size of the head of a pin. Then if something goes wrong, you simply pick it up with a blotter and toss it.:-)
It's not a long stretch to think that someday, someone will figure out
how to put it all on a device the size of the head of a pin
mayhap, youngun'! mayhap!
and someday someone will figure out something else to use onions for except as a belt! :)
You know, I fully expected to retire gleefully from the work world, but, my oh my! What marvelous things are afoot!
Being at Intel leaves me a bit awed. And, I'm actually making some sort of contribution.
Better than sitting around a retirement center waiting for the final call.
Erm, but onions as a belt?
(grandpa simpson's quote! XD)
I attempted to get a handle on this problem some time ago (before finding this thread) via Dell customer service. They didn't have a clue.
This thread seemed to go dead about a month ago. Does anybody have any new information?
Unfortunately, the G33 is not one of the chipsets for which the driver under development will add the OpenGL features needed by Photoshop (965/G35/G45 and newer).
The driver update will hopefully be ready to ship by the end of Feb.(As before, I cannot make any promises on this).
- Eric
Thanks for the information (I think). Will there ever be an update to this chipset that will support the CS4 OpenGL functionality? Is it possible to add a graphics card that will work with this cpu-gpu chipset and add the needed functionality?
The driver update is being built for Windows XP (32-bit) along with Vista (both 32-bit and 64-bit versions).
- Eric
In other words, can I purchase a Sony with a G45 and get the driver, via the internet, later, or do I have to wait for Sony to insert a newer version of the G45 with the driver installed?
Thanks, Eric and others, for any answers.
Hopefully this is not too far off topic,but I found that enabling hotkeys in the "Intel Graphics Media Accelerator Driver for Mobile"
somehow disables the Escape key when Photoshop CS4 is launched. That means as long as Photoshop CS4 is running,the ESC key won't even work in other apps. Close Photoshop CS4 and the ESC key function returns to normal.
In short I know that disabling "Hotkeys" in the GMA driver solves that problem,but I'm not savvy enough to know why. Just thought you might want to know.
The G45 driver for CS4 OpenGL functionality is a software issue.
You can purchase a Sony with G45, and when the new driver comes out for the G45, you just download it from intel, install it, and the OpenGL will work in CS4.
Abel
yeah, any info about new driver?
This situation really sucks.
BUT! Photoshop CS4 is now CRASHING when using any tool on that shiny zooming canvas :(
- Eric
Using Vista Home Premium 32-bit.
But just as Anastasiy Safari pointed out,the driver crashes when I use any other tools.
Video Card Renderer: Intel 965/963 Graphics Media Accelerator
OpenGL Drawing: Enabled.
Video Card: Mobile Intel(R) 965 Express Chipset Family
What would be the proper download?
The drivers above should work for 965GM, G35, and G45.
- Eric
I've asked the driver team about this - stay tuned.
Gener, thanks for pointing this out. The latest 965 driver is the 15.12.4.1666,
which according to a previous post allows GPU acceleration to be enabled
in PS CS4, but then crashes. Correct?
Correct, Eric. I can rotate a document,but applying a tool such as marquee or crop (never tried the others) causes Photoshop to close and gives me a message that the display driver stopped working and has recovered. I tried several times,same results.
Perhaps my error log can give your team more to go on.
Gene
Log Name: Application
Source: Application Error
Date: 3/16/2009 4:30:14 PM
Event ID: 1000
Task Category: (100)
Level: Error
Keywords: Classic
User: N/A
Computer: Madoka
Description:
Faulting application Photoshop.exe, version 11.0.1.0, time stamp 0x499bf9b5, faulting module ig4dev32.dll, version 7.15.10.1666, time stamp 0x49a6eaa3, exception code 0xc0000005, fault offset 0x00008d66, process id 0x80c, application start time 0x01c9a68f113a6cf0.
Event Xml:
<Event xmlns="http://schemas.microsoft.com/win/2004/08/events/event">
<System>
<Provider Name="Application Error" />
<EventID Qualifiers="0">1000</EventID>
<Level>2</Level>
<Task>100</Task>
<Keywords>0x80000000000000</Keywords>
<TimeCreated SystemTime="2009-03-16T23:30:14.000Z" />
<EventRecordID>18665</EventRecordID>
<Channel>Application</Channel>
<Computer>Madoka</Computer>
<Security />
</System>
<EventData>
<Data>Photoshop.exe</Data>
<Data>11.0.1.0</Data>
<Data>499bf9b5</Data>
<Data>ig4dev32.dll</Data>
<Data>7.15.10.1666</Data>
<Data>49a6eaa3</Data>
<Data>c0000005</Data>
<Data>00008d66</Data>
<Data>80c</Data>
<Data>01c9a68f113a6cf0</Data>
</EventData>
</Event>
"The driver being installed is not validated for this computer,please obtain the appropriate driver from the computer's manufacturer, setup will exit"
So I basically shoehorned the drivers,by extracting the archive to a folder and using the "have disk" option when updating the driver from Vista's Device Manager > Display Adaptor Properties box.
Photoshop still didn't recognize it,and so I used Adobe's "turn old gpu on" registry fix. That turned it on and it worked,but crashes.
I'd like to believe this 965/963 GMA can do it,but am I asking too much?
This way I've had luck and installed the latest of the latest of the latest drivers from Intel site - <http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Product_Filter.aspx?ProductID=2800&lang=eng> For Windows Vista Business it's 15124.
Then you have to enable "Old GPU" mode in Photoshop, as it is written in Adobe article here
("Solution 2"): <http://www.adobe.com/go/kb405064>
After these magic routines you'll have OpenGL enabled in Photoshop CS4, BUT IT STILL doesn't make any sense.
Because Photoshop CS4 is still crashing when OpenGL is enabled, while using such tools as Marquee Tool.
P.S.
(Eric, BTW I had problems with playing HD video with these latest of the latest drives, so I had to roll them back. Is there any Intel bug report e-mail I can use to send the details?)
- Eric
I don't know if there is a way to directly submit bug reports, but you can post the issue in the forum here: <http://software.intel.com/en-us/forums/developing-software-for-visual-computing/>
Your OEM may also have a way for you to report the issue, and they may in turn report it to Intel.
- Eric
It'll be worth the wait if you and your team can get it going :)
I tried to install this driver <http://downloadcenter.intel.com/Detail_Desc.aspx?agr=Y&ProductID=2996&DwnldID=17397&strOSs=164&OSFullName=Windows%20Vista*%2032&lang=eng>
But was told that it's not valid for my PC and that I should contact manufacturer (Sony). Like I said before, Sony's latest driver doesn't get OpenGL to work.
I guess I'll just keep an eye on this discussion to see if anything develops.