Brooks Institute

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

I am stoked.

I just got back from a visit to the Brooks Institute in Ventura. I took my time to savor and let senses take over. Even in this economy, the place was buzzing with creative energy. Apart from the fact that it is housed in a campus with several southwest-style buildings and classrooms, I walked by several large classrooms and you could hear teaching going on inside. No way to see inside, window shades drawn, probably to present video presentations or other on-screen material. A first-class place. Why was I there? I'm the first to admit I'm not a photographer, and I only love the craft. But I am a designer and I was there looking for a job, possibly as a teacher in the graphic design department.

I met with the HR department lead person and got more information and was very well received. Only time will tell if I can get on there.

Here's my biggest impression about why I think this place is authentic: Everyone was friendly. You don't get personable and humane treatment from phoney-baloney corporations, you do however expect it from people in the arts; At least I do anyway.

I'm not going to go into the school and what they do. You could look up Brooks Institute easy enough if you are so inclined. I just wanted to mention how hot it is to be in a place that honors the craft and puts out serious academics to prove it.

If you've graduated from there, or somewhere like it, my hat is off to you.

Ken

[Ann_She...@adobeforums.com]

Brooke's is probably the top school of photography in the western hemisphere and i am sure that you will find it to be a stimulating and exciting environment.

Lots of luck in landing the job!

:)

[PSh...@adobeforums.com]

Well, one of the top anyway. You also have Art Center in Pasedena (Peter F. knows this place well), and RIT (Rochester Institute of Technology) in New York where Jeff Schewe attended. I'd consider those the top three. Brooks and RIT are more technical focused and Art Center is a bit more about the creativity.

I chose Brooks not only because of reputation and it was closer to me, but the Santa Barbara area is truly a paradise. They market the heck out "creative environment", and it's absolutely true. Loved it there.

The campuses in Ventura are somewhat new - when I graduated in 1992, all facilities were located in Santa Barbara. Ventura is a pretty cool place too (had a studio there for several years), it's a quaint little coastal town, but it doesn't have the same magical charm as SB. It's not as prohibitively expensive though so it works out. :)

Good luck snagging the job!

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

I don't know if a school can really make it happen for someone, it is true that many graduates of well known schools become successful both professionally and artistically but just as many do so without ever even attending a school.

Most of the legendary photographers of the early part of the last century had no schools to attend.

I actually think there is a danger in hampering the creativity of a student by attending a school when you have a teacher who has the talent to influence their students in a very strong and personal way then the student might become caught up in the teachers persona and not ever find their own way.

I think the best part of school is not the instruction which teaches you little but the exchange of ideas with your colleagues, the other students.

Though some people do even better on their own.

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

A friend of mine who attended Art Center at Pasadena told me of the hours and hours of late night work they did for just one class - making color chips, that is mixing colors in a gradated fashion. It sounded like a very challenging environment, and that, to me, would be good preparation for the real world of commercial work where the demands are high.

I'm with Wade on this also, To get a complete picture of the reality, the real world might be a classroom, but is no where near the classroom setting. In the real world, you have to function and while all the academic world becomes a smaller percentage of the draw on your resources and your stamina compared to opposing forces, personalities, obstacles, weather and environment - to name a few that the real world throws at you.

For real world, I've always liked the motto: "The Show Must Go On!"

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

About Santa Barbara and about Ventura, there is one thing that makes it a photographer's heaven here; it's not the beautiful scenery and not the lifestyle but the one thing that makes the setting possible - LIGHT! and lots of it. It is brilliantly sunny here just about every day all year long. The big light source in the sky moves across its trajectory casting various illuminations and brilliance to everything. Put on your sunglasses and go to just about any location with your camera and gear, then stop and start shooting. You'd think you're in a studio, but you're actually outdoors.

It makes you want to paint, it makes you want to shoot, it makes you shiver with excitement at the visual possibilities displayed before you constantly all the day long. No wonder Hollywood birthed in this area. It's naturally an ideal setting for a top of the line photography school.

The school also covers video, cinema, graphics and other art forms that have been brought together by digital technology.

[John_Co...@adobeforums.com]

I wonder what they say about the light in Rochester, NY...

[Ann_She...@adobeforums.com]

Superb Natural Diffusion?

[pfigen]

"A friend of mine who attended Art Center at Pasadena told me of the hours and hours of late night work they did for just one class - making color chips, that is mixing colors in a gradated fashion. It sounded like a very challenging environment, and that, to me, would be good preparation for the real world of commercial work where the demands are high."

I could spend many hours relating similar experiences. Went there. Did that. Assignments like that do a couple of things. They instill a discipline that is hard to get anywhere else. They also help really hone your visual acuity even if you don't realize it at the time. The workload at Art Center when I was there, and it may have changed, was almost unbelievable, but it really did prep you for the most difficult real world situations.

More than just the hard work, it was the collaborative process that carried over after graduation. Working on joint projects with graphic designers emulating real world type assignments not only helped to introduce you to what designers needed from you, those classmates often became your clients in the real world. That early networking, if you chose to take advantage of it, was the real hidden value of a school like that. Even later today, I'm off to shoot another Manhattan Beach Wine Auction poster (at least the background anyway) with Andy Frank, the designer I met in fifth term and did a joint project on bicycles with. That was about 1984.

All the schools mentioned here are good. I'm partial to Art Center, partly because I went there, but also because of who taught there, it's proximity to a major market, and that there was such a broad scope of majors to interact with. Photography, film, fine art, automotive design, industrial design, environmental design, illustration and graphics and packaging were some of the types of students I hung out with. That kind of diversity got you out of what can sometimes be a "photographer's" mindset - seeing how an illustrator approaches a challenge vs how a photographer does.

One fact not in dispute is that Brooks' SB campus beats the hell out of spending a smoggy summer in Pasadena.

[L...@adobeforums.com]

This sounds nice Ken. I look forward to hearing how it works out. Trusting that whatever door is best and well suited will open for you.

[Nick_...@adobeforums.com]

My photographic training came from the University of Missouri School of Journalism. A bit ironic, as my career has leaned much more toward commercial than photoj, but it was still valuable training. It definitely prepared me well for assignment photography. A lot of people can take (or create) fine photos to please themselves, but it's a whole other ballgame when you have to please a client or an editor.

The whole thing about getting an assignment based on a specific set of instructions, and then presenting that photo in a peer-group setting and having it critiqued by the instructor was very motivating, to say the least.

[L...@adobeforums.com]

I think the greatest benefit that can come from working for a place like Brooks Institute would be the opportunities to learn while employed. Hopefully they offer incentives to their employees.

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

I don't know about the school lending itself to being an environment for painting or not or the setting.

NYC is a real jungle by comparison to any place I have ever been to and where as there are parts of LA that might give you concern it is not anything like the place I com from and yet there are so many people from the hell whole who have became painters, photographers, musicians, scientist, writers, sculptors and many that are our heros in TV and the Films.

I do not think the setting has anything to do with expressing yourself in any media.

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

One photography teacher I knew said that if you are truly, completely sensitive to your environment, you would be completely exhausted trying to work one block, and out of film long before that.

Brooks seems to have gone through a catharsis in thinking about photography. I had the opportunity to visit the campus in SB in the late 60's (my 8x10 period). I really got some bad feedback about what I could expect from Brooks coming at photography from the Weston-Adams POV. They weren't interested in talking to me any more and were rather disparaging of that "type" as I recall.

A former brother-in-law did go there a few years later but didn't finish.

[-sh...@adobeforums.com]

...you would be completely exhausted trying to work one block...

I agree. One doesn't have to be in Paris or Yellowstone to make good pics. Pretty pics?...that's another thing. Subject matter may not be as interesting, but surely, one can find (create) pics with great sense of design, color, texture, even emotion in their own neighborhood...wherever they live.

I'm constantly being distracted by everyday scenes when I'm driving---and say, I have to come back for that shot. Usually don't, unless it's something that really stands out. If I'm lucky, I have my camera and time to stop and shoot.

[Ann_She...@adobeforums.com]

I don't think that the geographical location matters — what matters is the type of students and teachers that the place attracts because the real learning comes from the experience, and stimulation, of rubbing mind against mind.

At least it does for me.

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

"I have to come back for that shot. Usually don't, unless it's something that really stands out. If I'm lucky, I have my camera and time to stop and shoot."

That's just it. I've found that you can't simply come back. Even one day later at the same hour the light is different, everything can be completely different. For sure it is best to carry a camera when you know you are going through landscape that makes you want to stop, then you'll probably get that picture you wanted.

Not only carry the camera, but keep it ready for a moment's notice.

(talking to myself here - something I do not do enough.)

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

Wade, I heard you mention the Canon D5 MKII - What a dream, I got to look at at a show in Los Angeles. What a fabulous camera. The pics it takes are impressive indeed.

Let us know when you get one or better yet, let us see some results.

Ken

[Dirk]

The photography course at Daytona Beach Community College have always been second to Brooks. It's either you went to Brooks or Daytona. At least it was that way during the 70's, 80's and 90's.

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

I don't now about this, I often plan what I am going to do even in know ing the type of traffic, pedestrian and o vehicular or air traffic or wildlife interaction which to some degree can be predicted according to the time of day, or astrological events, weather and seasons, foliage etc.

Lots and lots of different circumstances and then make this say what it has to say, everything has a profound effect on us no matter how mundane it may seem to us.

We learn to see better and better as time passes and therefore what looks ordinary to day may seem beautiful tomorrow.

I just heard a brilliant performance by the Chicago Symphony at Carnegie Hall of a piece by Leos Janacek called Sinfonietta they say when the piece was first performed people just thought just was just bad composing and when it started off i thought myself OMG but that soon turned to amazement as the orchestra was really fired up by the conductor Pierre Boulez who was absolutely brilliant.

So now what was once thought to be nothing is performed brilliantly and was one of the best performances I have gone to this year.

So things change as we get to develop our understanding of what we see, at least that is how I have gotten to see things.

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

Hmmm, photography by astrology. That's a good one!

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

True all through the history of art.

What's your point?

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

As I wrote I often plan what i do I expect things to happen nothing is really static in this universe so the idea that you cannot anticipate things happening is not really valid as you are almost certain that there will be opportunities.

If you take the approach that you can only get unique images because you were there at the time you will restrict your self rather then free yourself and open yourself to the possibilities.

Making rules and assumptions like this is not a good idea.

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

A couple of aphorisms are worthwhile here:

1) "Always tell the truth, but don't always be telling it"
-Anon

2) "Those who know do not say
Those who say do not know"
-Lao Tzu

3) Go back to 1.

[Ramón_G_Castañeda@adobeforums.com]

Post #23 applies equally to… post#23.

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

That's what I want on my tombstone.

Spoken like a true artist Wade. Very nice. It's good to be excited about things, deeply excited. To hell with the mundane, give me fire and ice, and let me express what I see through brush, pen or camera lens.

Keep up the good work,

Ken

PS: and as soon as I get my bearings on my new work situation, I'm going to ravage my credit card with the purchase of the new D5. Definitely the next step up for me. anyway.

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

Post #23 applies equally to… post#24.

[Ci...@adobeforums.com]

You also have Art Center in Pasedena

I went to Art Center for a short period of time when it was still in Los Angeles. Unfortunately I was very young and not ready to make a serious commitment. It had very stimulating energy.

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

You are right Cindy. The friend of mine who graduated from there was the most prolific and hard-working artist you can imagine, I'm sure the school built a lot of that into him. Everything he did was done quickly, patiently, accurately to perfection, and he didn't look for short cuts either. He took on massive works, painting and commercial illustrations, that had mind-boggling detail.

Too bad I've lost touch with him and don't find his name by googling it.

Don't know where he is.

Scott McIntire - Hats off to you.

Ken

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

Funny, I found this, which I'm almost certain is him, but no links that work or whereabouts. I'll bet he's pursuing art somewhere.

<http://www.artsitesgallery.com/files/Download/Three%20buildings.htm>

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

I knew him as well, Ken. Yes, he did some really fine work.

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

We're still in school. There's just no name on the door now.

[Laurenti...@adobeforums.com]

Smoking in the bathroom?

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

Smoking in the bathroom?

Your productive and formative years well sent!

[pfigen]

Thats probably well spent, and could be taken about five different ways...well, maybe three. I think the song was "Smokin' in the Boy's Room" cause girls, of course, were good. Brownsville Station. 1973.

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

Laurentiu was an informant?

[Laurenti...@adobeforums.com]

no. and I didn't inhale

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

Now we're getting somewhere.

So you are telling us you smoked but did not inhale, and you expect us to believe that…is that what you're saying?

[Laurenti...@adobeforums.com]

no

[Ken_N...@adobeforums.com]

A devoted Visene customer.

[pfigen]

If you look closely you can just make out Wade taking his shot of Disney Hall...

<http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1amABCDeeGQT6BiepUCtZl9nFECPnU>

[-sh...@adobeforums.com]

XD

What's that little spot down there?
.
.
.
That's no spot...that's Wade.
;)

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

Wow!

That's what I call a great architectural shot. :D

[pfigen]

You just need to get on a really tall ladder...

[pfigen]

Actually I think I put that in the wrong thread, but oh well.

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

You just need to get on a really tall ladder...

Hot air balloon? Just up Wade's alley!

[pfigen]

Bell Jet Ranger - I'm in yellow Patagonia in the front seat with my seatbelt buckle duct-taped shut.

<http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1Q3vredSb3dL55mwI3uVz4tzvi3zy1>

[-sh...@adobeforums.com]

Wow! Very cool, Peter.

I couldn't do that. I think it was Johnny Carson who once said, "I'm not afraid of heights, I'm afraid of falling".
8o
8)

[Dirk]

Yeah, that's cool. I shot from one of those but didn't think to ductape the belt buckle

What's the other guy shooting with? It looks like a RED ONE...

[Ann_She...@adobeforums.com]

Is there a pilot in that plane — because it doesn't look like it?

Or is Peter shooting while driving that thing with his right knee and one elbow?!

[pfigen]

The pilot is sitting to my right, so I'm hiding him. It's weird because you (at least I don't) feel at all height conscious up there. You take the doors off and try like hell to make sure nothing fall out. Nothing did, but I've heard of people losing their glasses.

This project was really to document Benny Chan as he was shooting from the other helicopter, so we had to Jet Rangers up that afternoon - about a month ago.

When you're a thousand feet above the Staples Center and nothing between you and the other chopper, it's really hard to get a feel for how far apart you are. I think at one point we were about 100 feet apart. Nice to have pilots with 30 years of experience.

I'll post some of the other shots next week.

Dean was shooting with a Sony or Canon Hi-def. No Red there. He was doing a little documentary on Benny's project of shooting L.A. freeway interchanges, that will be shown at the show opening in Pasadena in May.

Having seen a couple of test prints, all I can say is that if you're in Southern California, it will be a worthwhile night out.

[Fred_...@adobeforums.com]

Done that once myself while helping out a friend who was taking shots with a 8x10 view camera from the back seat of a Jetranger (!!! - don't ask!). His door was off but I was unbuckled while sorting and handing 8x10 darkslides to him (I couldn't do that with the belt on). My door was well and truly on - and shut - however.

Strange things, helicopters - you might be a thousand feet up with nothing but air between you and the ground and the skyhooks above rotating to keep you up, but when in a hover with a good pilot they feel every bit as solid as if you were standing in a skyscraper - albeit a vibrating one. Maybe the brain just does not compute the absurdity of the situation.

[pfigen]

Fred,

That's a very good description. Even when looking straight down, you don't feel a real sense of height. I did notice that when we got fairly close, they were careful to have one a few feet higher than the other. Less chance of a rotor hit that way.

I don't have the images at home to post, but Benny was shooting with a home made 8 x 10 aerial camera with a 300mm Nikkor Aerial flat field lens. His assistant was belted in, but the shoulder harnesses on these were on inertial reels, so you could move around a bit.

We basically did circles around the other helicopter and every time we turned south, we'd hit this little pocket where the copter would drop several feet and twist just a bit. The pilot would announce through the headphones - "just a minute here... stabilizing..." After the third or fourth time around I got used to it but the first time sort of took my breath away.

[L...@adobeforums.com]

What a fun shot Peter! Matter of fact this whole thread has been fun to follow.

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

So I would assume that Linda would not find a helicopter difficult to deal with have you ever been in one Linda?

This is a type of photography you could offer your customers and justify a larger fee for doing so.

And it could be useful if you do it well for their web site.

I would think that flying around i a helicopter is more stable than a small plane.

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

Helicopters are rocks with engines. No wings. The blades are subject to enormous stresses and any failure. any out of balance problem with the blades in flight guarantees disaster. The pilot can try to windmill down, but as I found out in a seminar put on by National Instruments on blade stress measurements in the air, that produces the maximum amount of stress possible. In fact, the way NI instruments the blades for stress measurements is to fly the chopper, then do a free fall without engine power from 10,000' or so, all the while collecting data. Finally, (hopefully!) the engine power is returned.

So long as a regular plane can stay above stall speed, it can fly. Witness the crash in the Hudson recently. He flew it into the water.

Helicopters are reasonably safe. What I don't like is what happens with power loss.

Give me a Cessna any day!

[Ann_She...@adobeforums.com]

I got my first job because they needed a new photographer as the last one had been in a helicopter when the rotor sheared-off.

Of course no-one told me that at the interview …

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

I did helicopter and high wing single engine shots of Portland in the 70's. I definitely preferred the heli for shooting, but I hated every minute I was up there.

The fixed wing, however, was a joy.

I never went back to helicopters, and when a local photographer escaped certain death because the chopper was close enough to ground and the blades still turning, I definitely abandoned flying rocks.

[L...@adobeforums.com]

So I would assume that Linda would not find a helicopter difficult to
deal with have you ever been in one Linda?

Never have.

This is a type of photography you could offer your customers and justify
a larger fee for doing so.

I think I've reached a point in my life to where I will stick with what I know. Photography is a nice service to offer on the side but designing websites seems to be what I'm supposed to do. They keep coming to me. I just need to figure out how to keep up with it all.

[Ann_She...@adobeforums.com]

Did they send you up, Ann?

Not in the literal sense.

Once the people at the air station discovered that i was under 21 (and that they would be held responsible for my safety!) I was "Grounded" and stuck with photographing dead aircraft parts — which was no fun at all and NOT why I had applied for the job in the first place!

:(

[L...@adobeforums.com]

LOL Ann!

[Ann_She...@adobeforums.com]

It wasn't "LOL" at all: I also got stuck with taking Passport/ID photographs and discovered that the nearest "Ladies Room" was a bicycle-ride away from the Photographic Department … on the other side of the airfield!

[L...@adobeforums.com]

LOL again. I'm sorry Ann, but the way you tell it makes me laugh. ;-)

[Ann_She...@adobeforums.com]

:)

[John Joslin]

Aerodynamicists have proved that helicopters can't fly.

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

Aerodynamicists have proved that helicopters can't fly.

They don't fly they rise or fall. And then they are pushed directed in one direction or another.

Sometimes scientist do the research using the wrong criteria.

A rocket does not fly either although a rocket lane does to some extent but mostly it glides which is the part that is flight.

A hot air balloon does not fly either.

[Dirk]

"Aerodynamicists have proved that helicopters can't fly"

Could Superman really fly, or was it just special effects to deceive us?

[Fred_...@adobeforums.com]

Could Superman really fly, or was it just special effects to deceive us?

I never doubted he could fly, it was just his method of propulsion that always puzzled me ;-) .

Oh well, I suppose he was Super man in all things.....

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

Sometimes scientist do the research using the wrong criteria.

...never mind

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

Lawrence it happens all the time that is why some proven scientific fact is later proven to be not so?

I know as an engineer you do not like the idea hat you can be mistaken even when you are very careful about your work but the fact is you can and probably are often as is the case with most scientist and engineers and why we are having increasing amounts of building failures, bridge failures rocket failures medical failures ( drugs that are proven to be more harmful then helpful after they have killed hundreds of people), you know that kind of thing.

[pfigen]

Hmmmm I saw several helicopters and one B-17 flying around Los Angeles this afternoon.

[Laurenti...@adobeforums.com]

if a helicopter flies in the forest and wade doesn't see it…

now, wade, you'll have to take another photo of a Gehry building (or a flying puppy : )

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

Now that is one cute flying puppy.

You re correct the next time I am in LA.

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

Gad, Wade, you are so full of it.

Engineering and science...
never mind.....

Do you know what science actually does?

[Laurenti...@adobeforums.com]

in inches or centimeters? : )

[Wade_Zi...@adobeforums.com]

LOL!

Very good LT!

Lawrence know do you?

Pray tell, tell us!

[Lawrenc...@adobeforums.com]

Answering a question with a question is bad form.

[Fred_...@adobeforums.com]

The secret of flight - huge, flapping ears!

Love that shot, LT.

[Laurenti...@adobeforums.com]

not mine
sorry if there was any confusion!
and yes, I like the pooch too
(and Gehry's buildings : )

[Nick_...@adobeforums.com]

Hope the pup landed somewhere forgiving! <g>

I have a new kitten who, even if he doesn't land correctly, still likes the ride. It's all instigated by him, of course, who knows no bounds.

[Laurenti...@adobeforums.com]

according to "ceci n'est pas un chien", the pup will never land : )

My cat, when kitten, used to stay on top of my head when I was driving
from the side, it must've looked like like a Davy Crockett hat : )