> I am new to the museum field and recently started working as a museum
> attendant giving tours.  I was recently told that if I receive tips at the
> end of a tour I should not keep them and give them to the museum as a
> donation.  Is this a common policy at other museums and, if so, why?  If I
> gave a tour to an individual or group who liked my tour and gave me a tip,
> why should that money go to museum and not the poorly-paid attendant?
>  Thanks for any suggestions or clarifications on policies.

> Adam

> Here are a few random points:

> I have spoken to both museum professionals and non-professional museum
> goers in the past few hours (in completely casual, non-scientific
> manner), and the museum professionals are saying it is up to the
> individual museum (some have a don't ask/don't tell policy), meaning
> there is no hard-and-fast rule, but donation of tips is a generally-
> accepted practice.  However, all the museum goers I spoke to
> vehemently felt that any tip handed to a guide is specifically
> intended to go to the guide.

> It is reasonable to assume that if a visitor wants to donate to the
> museum, they will do so (and may have already done so, and in turn
> will receive the tax deduction they would expect as a donor), and if
> they want to show appreciation to the guide, they will do that. It is
> also reasonable to assume the visitor would rather have the control
> over where the tip goes, and may feel resentment towards a museum that
> takes tips away from its employees (if they were privy to that
> knowledge).  So, if a museum values a donor's intent, they would
> either let the guide keep the tips, or verbalize the tip-donation
> practice into the tour at some point.  To do otherwise would be
> dishonest, so my museum-going sources say.

> I'm no lawyer, and there very well may be different rules and/or
> exemptions for non-profits, but according to the Labor Department:
> 29 CFR 531.52 - General characteristics of ``tips.''
> A tip is a sum presented by a customer as a gift or gratuity in
> recognition of some service performed for him. It is to be
> distinguished from payment of a charge, if any, made for the service.
> Whether a tip is to be given, and its amount, are matters determined
> solely by the customer, and generally he has the right to determine
> who shall be the recipient of his gratuity. In the absence of an
> agreement to the contrary between the recipient and a third party, a
> tip becomes the property of the person in recognition of whose service
> it is presented by the customer. Only tips actually received by an
> employee as money belonging to him which he may use as he chooses free
> of any control by the employer, may be counted in determining whether
> he is a ``tipped
> employee'' within the meaning of the Act and in applying the
> provisions of section 3(m) which govern wage credits for tips.
> http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/ESA/Title_29/Part_531/29CFR531.52.htm

> and Section Number: 531.40:
> ...(c) Under the principles stated in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this
> section, employers have been permitted to treat as payments to
> employees for purposes of the Act sums paid at the employees'
> direction to third persons for the following purposes:...voluntary
> contributions to churches and charitable, fraternal, athletic, and
> social organizations, or societies from which the employer receives no
> profit or benefit directly or indirectly.
> http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/ESA/Title_29/Part_531/29CFR531.40.htm

> I would be interested if someone can find some link somewhere to
> intellectual property law as it relates to tips received by tour
> guides.  I can't imagine it exists.  It sounds akin to a waiter having
> to hand over his tips to the chef for cooking the meal.

> Best,
> Theresa

> On Mar 1, 3:47 am, Adam Michalski <atmichal...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hello,

> > I am new to the museum field and recently started working as a museum
> > attendant giving tours.  I was recently told that if I receive tips at
> the
> > end of a tour I should not keep them and give them to the museum as a
> > donation.  Is this a common policy at other museums and, if so, why?  If
> I
> > gave a tour to an individual or group who liked my tour and gave me a
> tip,
> > why should that money go to museum and not the poorly-paid attendant?
> >  Thanks for any suggestions or clarifications on policies.

> > Adam

> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "AAM-EMP" group.
> To post to this group, send email to aamemp@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
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> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/aamemp?hl=en.

> Here are a few random points:

> I have spoken to both museum professionals and non-professional museum
> goers in the past few hours (in completely casual, non-scientific
> manner), and the museum professionals are saying it is up to the
> individual museum (some have a don't ask/don't tell policy), meaning
> there is no hard-and-fast rule, but donation of tips is a generally-
> accepted practice.  However, all the museum goers I spoke to
> vehemently felt that any tip handed to a guide is specifically
> intended to go to the guide.

> It is reasonable to assume that if a visitor wants to donate to the
> museum, they will do so (and may have already done so, and in turn
> will receive the tax deduction they would expect as a donor), and if
> they want to show appreciation to the guide, they will do that. It is
> also reasonable to assume the visitor would rather have the control
> over where the tip goes, and may feel resentment towards a museum that
> takes tips away from its employees (if they were privy to that
> knowledge).  So, if a museum values a donor's intent, they would
> either let the guide keep the tips, or verbalize the tip-donation
> practice into the tour at some point.  To do otherwise would be
> dishonest, so my museum-going sources say.

> I'm no lawyer, and there very well may be different rules and/or
> exemptions for non-profits, but according to the Labor Department:
> 29 CFR 531.52 - General characteristics of ``tips.''
> A tip is a sum presented by a customer as a gift or gratuity in
> recognition of some service performed for him. It is to be
> distinguished from payment of a charge, if any, made for the service.
> Whether a tip is to be given, and its amount, are matters determined
> solely by the customer, and generally he has the right to determine
> who shall be the recipient of his gratuity. In the absence of an
> agreement to the contrary between the recipient and a third party, a
> tip becomes the property of the person in recognition of whose service
> it is presented by the customer. Only tips actually received by an
> employee as money belonging to him which he may use as he chooses free
> of any control by the employer, may be counted in determining whether
> he is a ``tipped
> employee'' within the meaning of the Act and in applying the
> provisions of section 3(m) which govern wage credits for tips.
> http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/ESA/Title_29/Part_531/29CFR531.52.htm

> and Section Number: 531.40:
> ...(c) Under the principles stated in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this
> section, employers have been permitted to treat as payments to
> employees for purposes of the Act sums paid at the employees'
> direction to third persons for the following purposes:...voluntary
> contributions to churches and charitable, fraternal, athletic, and
> social organizations, or societies from which the employer receives no
> profit or benefit directly or indirectly.
> http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/ESA/Title_29/Part_531/29CFR531.40.htm

> I would be interested if someone can find some link somewhere to
> intellectual property law as it relates to tips received by tour
> guides.  I can't imagine it exists.  It sounds akin to a waiter having
> to hand over his tips to the chef for cooking the meal.

> Best,
> Theresa

> On Mar 1, 3:47 am, Adam Michalski <atmichal...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hello,

> > I am new to the museum field and recently started working as a museum
> > attendant giving tours.  I was recently told that if I receive tips at
> the
> > end of a tour I should not keep them and give them to the museum as a
> > donation.  Is this a common policy at other museums and, if so, why?  If
> I
> > gave a tour to an individual or group who liked my tour and gave me a
> tip,
> > why should that money go to museum and not the poorly-paid attendant?
> >  Thanks for any suggestions or clarifications on policies.

> > Adam

> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "AAM-EMP" group.
> To post to this group, send email to aamemp@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> aamemp+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<aamemp%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
> .
> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/aamemp?hl=en.

> I am new to the museum field and recently started working as a museum
> attendant giving tours.  I was recently told that if I receive tips at the
> end of a tour I should not keep them and give them to the museum as a
> donation.  Is this a common policy at other museums and, if so, why?  If I
> gave a tour to an individual or group who liked my tour and gave me a tip,
> why should that money go to museum and not the poorly-paid attendant?
>  Thanks for any suggestions or clarifications on policies.

> Adam

Cc: tkelliher<theresakelli...@hotmail.com>; AAM-EMP<aamemp@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [EMP] Re: Tipping Museum Tour Guides

Jumping in here late but here's my $.02 (tip if you feel like it. ;)

On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 12:00 AM, Adam Michalski <atmichal...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I've also been on tours where the tour guide stated, "Tips are
> greatly appreciated."  Therefore, I don't see why asking such a question is
> in poor taste.  At least I asked first before accepting a bunch of tips that
> possibly should have gone to the museum.

First off, I think asking for tips is in poor taste. Tips are always
optional. There are some professions, mainly wait staff, that work for
"tipped wages", which is below the minimum or standard wage with the
idea that these people are getting tips and therefore will make up the
difference in salary. This is a holdout from a time where the class
system was more formalized. Today, tipped wages are pretty much
limited to wait staff, bus boys, bellhops, bartenders, and other
"counter staff" type people. Everyone else is supposed to be paid at
least minimum wage for their work and for the most part, are not to be
tipped.

For example, you aren't supposed to tip the owner of a business as
they are making money directly off of you. If the owner of a hair
salon cuts your hair, s/he does not get a tip but if one of the
salaried hairdressers cuts your hair, s/he gets a tip. Barristas at
Starbucks and counter staff at Subway are NOT supposed to get tips
because they don't work for tipped wages. Maybe if they go above and
beyond to serve you your highly complex
doublechocoventihalfcafhalfsoyfrappucinolatteexpresso or have your
coffee ready for you every AM as you walk through the door because you
are a regular then it would be appropriate to give them a tip. But if
they simply do their job, which is to serve you coffee or a sandwich,
that is not cause for a tip because they aren't making tipped wages.

> But, it also got me to thinking, "why not allow tour guides to accept tips?" It would give me more financial incentive to give a better tour.

You are either getting paid to do your tour or you are a volunteer and
get personal satisfaction for doing the tour. You should do a good job
because you have pride in yourself and your museum. Expecting a tip is
like "paying for a smile" as one blogger put it.

Now if you are an independent tour operator like for city tours, then
I can see accepting tips if you have provided exceptional service and
go above and beyond giving a simple tour. But again, people are paying
you to do a job just like anyone else that gets paid a set wage to do
a job.

> If the tip goes to the museum, what incentive do I have personally to provide a better tour?

Why are you doing museum tours in the first place? It's a job.
Whatever job you have, you should strive to do your best. Now museums
should encourage and reward employees and volunteers but I'm against
programs that directly link customer feedback to rewards. It sounds
like a good idea but in the end, it just fosters resentment. One tour
guide could deal with the school group from hell and get nothing and
another guide could get the sweet family with perfect kids and get
flowers and a huge tip. Some countries don't allow tipping at all so
visitors from those places are probably not going to offer tips or
compliments because it's not a part of their culture.

Furthermore, I think tipping encourages employees to be fake. I used
to work at a corporate university where all students had to rate their
 professors at the end of the class. Professors had to make a minimum
score and the better their ratings, the more their bonus. We would
joke about how the profs that brought their students donuts on the
last day of class before they did their course surveys would
automatically get higher ratings. Sadly, to some extent, it was true.

Also, any waitress knows that if you show a little cleavage, wear some
make-up and flirt with the customers will get you higher tips and that
the prettiest girls or best looking guys will always get better tips.
So while customer feedback is a tool, it isn't the sole judge of who
is the best worker or gives the best tour. Again, people should strive
to do the best tour that they can do because of personal pride in
themselves for doing a good job and wanting to represent their
employer as best as possible.

> Apparently this is not how many museums work, but it's just a
> thought I had to possibly provide a better experience for visitors and bring
> in a little extra revenue to museums that are typically underfunded as it
> is. Would it work?  I don't know, but it was just a thought.  I'd also
> appreciate any comments or thoughts.

Again, I am against the principle of tipping in museums. If people
like the tour and the museum, then I think they should donate to the
museum. First off, if they are paying an admission fee, they should
not tip as they are already paying for service. For example, here's a
quotation about tipping at Disneyland:

"Walt Disney had strong feelings about tipping that are still
reflected in official policy at Walt Disney World and Disneyland. Walt
did not want guests "bribing" employees to receive preferential
treatment, such as getting a table by tipping a dining room
host/hostess, a better room by tipping a desk clerk, or bypassing a
line by tipping a ride attendant. He wanted all guests to have the
same high level of service, regardless of financial means. As a
result, most Disney employees are expressly prohibited from accepting
tips, and can be terminated for doing so."

Specifically, the service professions at Disney (wait staff, porters,
and bellhops) get tips but regular "cast members" (ride attendants,
info booth people, store clerks) do not. They are all expected to give
everyone the same high quality service. Don't you want everyone in
your museum to get the same high quality service as well? What if word
got out that people were getting extra special treatment because they
tipped the tour guide? How would that make the average visitor feel if
they paid for museum admission and then got an average tour?

Secondly, and more importantly, if the museum employees are civil
servants (i.e. federal, state, or local employees), then they are
probably expressly prohibited from receiving tips so tipping there is
a moot point.

Lastly, as a paying customer, I don't want to be badgered for tips or
have that hanging over my head while I'm on a tour.

Like I mentioned before, I don't like the idea of expecting tips.
People should do their jobs for the wages that they accepted when they
took the job. Tips should be for exceptional service. I don't like how
it seems like every place in America now has a tip jar on the counter,
no matter what the service (at least in my area). That's not how tips
are supposed to work. I'd hope that museums would set a high standard
of service for themselves because they take pride in their institution
and mission, not because they are trying to suck up to the public for
more money.

Deb Fuller

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Cc: tkelliher<theresakelli...@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [EMP] Re: Tipping Museum Tour Guides

Deb says it all.  Let's get on to things like improving the workplace, making sure the industry supports all of you emps,  hires from the field and makes museums a viable career choice - compensation-wise and otherwise.  Alll best, Geri Thomas, Thomas and Associates, Bew York and Chicago.
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

-----Original Message-----
From: Deb Fuller <debful...@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 05:55:59
To: Adam Michalski<atmichal...@gmail.com>
Cc: tkelliher<theresakelli...@hotmail.com>; AAM-EMP<aamemp@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [EMP] Re: Tipping Museum Tour Guides

Jumping in here late but here's my $.02 (tip if you feel like it. ;)

On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 12:00 AM, Adam Michalski <atmichal...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I've also been on tours where the tour guide stated, "Tips are
> greatly appreciated."  Therefore, I don't see why asking such a question is
> in poor taste.  At least I asked first before accepting a bunch of tips that
> possibly should have gone to the museum.

First off, I think asking for tips is in poor taste. Tips are always
optional. There are some professions, mainly wait staff, that work for
"tipped wages", which is below the minimum or standard wage with the
idea that these people are getting tips and therefore will make up the
difference in salary. This is a holdout from a time where the class
system was more formalized. Today, tipped wages are pretty much
limited to wait staff, bus boys, bellhops, bartenders, and other
"counter staff" type people. Everyone else is supposed to be paid at
least minimum wage for their work and for the most part, are not to be
tipped.

For example, you aren't supposed to tip the owner of a business as
they are making money directly off of you. If the owner of a hair
salon cuts your hair, s/he does not get a tip but if one of the
salaried hairdressers cuts your hair, s/he gets a tip. Barristas at
Starbucks and counter staff at Subway are NOT supposed to get tips
because they don't work for tipped wages. Maybe if they go above and
beyond to serve you your highly complex
doublechocoventihalfcafhalfsoyfrappucinolatteexpresso or have your
coffee ready for you every AM as you walk through the door because you
are a regular then it would be appropriate to give them a tip. But if
they simply do their job, which is to serve you coffee or a sandwich,
that is not cause for a tip because they aren't making tipped wages.

> But, it also got me to thinking, "why not allow tour guides to accept tips?" It would give me more financial incentive to give a better tour.

You are either getting paid to do your tour or you are a volunteer and
get personal satisfaction for doing the tour. You should do a good job
because you have pride in yourself and your museum. Expecting a tip is
like "paying for a smile" as one blogger put it.

Now if you are an independent tour operator like for city tours, then
I can see accepting tips if you have provided exceptional service and
go above and beyond giving a simple tour. But again, people are paying
you to do a job just like anyone else that gets paid a set wage to do
a job.

> If the tip goes to the museum, what incentive do I have personally to provide a better tour?

Why are you doing museum tours in the first place? It's a job.
Whatever job you have, you should strive to do your best. Now museums
should encourage and reward employees and volunteers but I'm against
programs that directly link customer feedback to rewards. It sounds
like a good idea but in the end, it just fosters resentment. One tour
guide could deal with the school group from hell and get nothing and
another guide could get the sweet family with perfect kids and get
flowers and a huge tip. Some countries don't allow tipping at all so
visitors from those places are probably not going to offer tips or
compliments because it's not a part of their culture.

Furthermore, I think tipping encourages employees to be fake. I used
to work at a corporate university where all students had to rate their
 professors at the end of the class. Professors had to make a minimum
score and the better their ratings, the more their bonus. We would
joke about how the profs that brought their students donuts on the
last day of class before they did their course surveys would
automatically get higher ratings. Sadly, to some extent, it was true.

Also, any waitress knows that if you show a little cleavage, wear some
make-up and flirt with the customers will get you higher tips and that
the prettiest girls or best looking guys will always get better tips.
So while customer feedback is a tool, it isn't the sole judge of who
is the best worker or gives the best tour. Again, people should strive
to do the best tour that they can do because of personal pride in
themselves for doing a good job and wanting to represent their
employer as best as possible.

> Apparently this is not how many museums work, but it's just a
> thought I had to possibly provide a better experience for visitors and bring
> in a little extra revenue to museums that are typically underfunded as it
> is. Would it work?  I don't know, but it was just a thought.  I'd also
> appreciate any comments or thoughts.

Again, I am against the principle of tipping in museums. If people
like the tour and the museum, then I think they should donate to the
museum. First off, if they are paying an admission fee, they should
not tip as they are already paying for service. For example, here's a
quotation about tipping at Disneyland:

"Walt Disney had strong feelings about tipping that are still
reflected in official policy at Walt Disney World and Disneyland. Walt
did not want guests "bribing" employees to receive preferential
treatment, such as getting a table by tipping a dining room
host/hostess, a better room by tipping a desk clerk, or bypassing a
line by tipping a ride attendant. He wanted all guests to have the
same high level of service, regardless of financial means. As a
result, most Disney employees are expressly prohibited from accepting
tips, and can be terminated for doing so."

Specifically, the service professions at Disney (wait staff, porters,
and bellhops) get tips but regular "cast members" (ride attendants,
info booth people, store clerks) do not. They are all expected to give
everyone the same high quality service. Don't you want everyone in
your museum to get the same high quality service as well? What if word
got out that people were getting extra special treatment because they
tipped the tour guide? How would that make the average visitor feel if
they paid for museum admission and then got an average tour?

Secondly, and more importantly, if the museum employees are civil
servants (i.e. federal, state, or local employees), then they are
probably expressly prohibited from receiving tips so tipping there is
a moot point.

Lastly, as a paying customer, I don't want to be badgered for tips or
have that hanging over my head while I'm on a tour.

Like I mentioned before, I don't like the idea of expecting tips.
People should do their jobs for the wages that they accepted when they
took the job. Tips should be for exceptional service. I don't like how
it seems like every place in America now has a tip jar on the counter,
no matter what the service (at least in my area). That's not how tips
are supposed to work. I'd hope that museums would set a high standard
of service for themselves because they take pride in their institution
and mission, not because they are trying to suck up to the public for
more money.

Deb Fuller

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> I am new to the museum field and recently started working as a museum
> attendant giving tours.  I was recently told that if I receive tips at the
> end of a tour I should not keep them and give them to the museum as a
> donation.  Is this a common policy at other museums and, if so, why?  If I
> gave a tour to an individual or group who liked my tour and gave me a tip,
> why should that money go to museum and not the poorly-paid attendant?
>  Thanks for any suggestions or clarifications on policies.

> Adam

> I agree with Theresa's comments and wanted to add a few things.
> Tipping museum docents/guides are generally not the norm in museums in
> the United States, although it is not uncommon and happens in other
> countries such as France and Britain. But, it is common to tip tour
> guides in the United States if you are part of a walking tour that
> takes you to different sites. Why the difference, I am not sure, but
> it may have something to do with non-profit vs. for-profit
> institutions and laws.

> Of course, in the end, the museum's policy will ultimately determine
> what you can and cannot do. With that said, your museum's policy
> should be one that does not accept tips and have their docents/guides
> decline them when offered. It seems rather unethical for a museum to
> let you accept tips, but then turn around and require you to "donate"
> the money back to them. I would check into the legality of your
> museum's practice in this matter. And, tipping is not a matter of who
> "owns" the information intellectually, but instead is given for the
> quality of the delivery of the tour--it doesn't matter if you had a
> script, you still have to be personable, accurate, engaging, etc.
> (this is a personal decision, in the same way you would tip a waiter
> that you thought had a welcoming personality and whose service you
> liked).

> I hope this information helps. It can get complicated and interpreted
> in different ways as you can probably tell by the other postings.

> Best,
> Jane

> On Mar 1, 12:47 am, Adam Michalski <atmichal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hello,

>> I am new to the museum field and recently started working as a museum
>> attendant giving tours.  I was recently told that if I receive tips  
>> at the
>> end of a tour I should not keep them and give them to the museum as a
>> donation.  Is this a common policy at other museums and, if so,  
>> why?  If I
>> gave a tour to an individual or group who liked my tour and gave me  
>> a tip,
>> why should that money go to museum and not the poorly-paid attendant?
>>  Thanks for any suggestions or clarifications on policies.

>> Adam

> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google  
> Groups "AAM-EMP" group.
> To post to this group, send email to aamemp@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to aamemp+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com
> .
> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/aamemp?hl=en
> .

> Generally, the guide is provided the tools (i.e. training) to make the museum "come alive" by the museum educators. Also, if monetary gain is a large incentive for someone, that person may wish to re-evaluate their choice to pursue a career in the museum profession.

> From: aamemp@googlegroups.com [mailto:aamemp@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Katie Courtien
> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 7:53 PM
> To: tkelliher
> Cc: AAM-EMP
> Subject: Re: [EMP] Re: Tipping Museum Tour Guides

> Very well said Theresa. You're waiter/cook analogy is perfect. Although the museum creates the content, it only comes alive because of an educator who is presenting it in an informative and entertaining way. Besides, who really completely sticks to the script any way? If I had offered someone a tip and they then handed it to the organization they worked for, I would be angry that my money wasn't given to the person who deserved it. It's a pretty bogus standard.

> On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 7:35 PM, tkelliher <theresakelli...@hotmail.com<mailto:theresakelli...@hotmail.com>> wrote:
> Adam,

> Here are a few random points:

> I have spoken to both museum professionals and non-professional museum
> goers in the past few hours (in completely casual, non-scientific
> manner), and the museum professionals are saying it is up to the
> individual museum (some have a don't ask/don't tell policy), meaning
> there is no hard-and-fast rule, but donation of tips is a generally-
> accepted practice.  However, all the museum goers I spoke to
> vehemently felt that any tip handed to a guide is specifically
> intended to go to the guide.

> It is reasonable to assume that if a visitor wants to donate to the
> museum, they will do so (and may have already done so, and in turn
> will receive the tax deduction they would expect as a donor), and if
> they want to show appreciation to the guide, they will do that. It is
> also reasonable to assume the visitor would rather have the control
> over where the tip goes, and may feel resentment towards a museum that
> takes tips away from its employees (if they were privy to that
> knowledge).  So, if a museum values a donor's intent, they would
> either let the guide keep the tips, or verbalize the tip-donation
> practice into the tour at some point.  To do otherwise would be
> dishonest, so my museum-going sources say.

> I'm no lawyer, and there very well may be different rules and/or
> exemptions for non-profits, but according to the Labor Department:
> 29 CFR 531.52 - General characteristics of ``tips.''
> A tip is a sum presented by a customer as a gift or gratuity in
> recognition of some service performed for him. It is to be
> distinguished from payment of a charge, if any, made for the service.
> Whether a tip is to be given, and its amount, are matters determined
> solely by the customer, and generally he has the right to determine
> who shall be the recipient of his gratuity. In the absence of an
> agreement to the contrary between the recipient and a third party, a
> tip becomes the property of the person in recognition of whose service
> it is presented by the customer. Only tips actually received by an
> employee as money belonging to him which he may use as he chooses free
> of any control by the employer, may be counted in determining whether
> he is a ``tipped
> employee'' within the meaning of the Act and in applying the
> provisions of section 3(m) which govern wage credits for tips.http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/ESA/Title_29/Part_531/29CFR531.52.htm

> and Section Number: 531.40:
> ...(c) Under the principles stated in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this
> section, employers have been permitted to treat as payments to
> employees for purposes of the Act sums paid at the employees'
> direction to third persons for the following purposes:...voluntary
> contributions to churches and charitable, fraternal, athletic, and
> social organizations, or societies from which the employer receives no
> profit or benefit directly or indirectly.http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/ESA/Title_29/Part_531/29CFR531.40.htm

> I would be interested if someone can find some link somewhere to
> intellectual property law as it relates to tips received by tour
> guides.  I can't imagine it exists.  It sounds akin to a waiter having
> to hand over his tips to the chef for cooking the meal.

> Best,
> Theresa

> On Mar 1, 3:47 am, Adam Michalski <atmichal...@gmail.com<mailto:atmichal...@gmail.com>> wrote:

> > Hello,

> > I am new to the museum field and recently started working as a museum
> > attendant giving tours.  I was recently told that if I receive tips at the
> > end of a tour I should not keep them and give them to the museum as a
> > donation.  Is this a common policy at other museums and, if so, why?  If I
> > gave a tour to an individual or group who liked my tour and gave me a tip,
> > why should that money go to museum and not the poorly-paid attendant?
> >  Thanks for any suggestions or clarifications on policies.

> > Adam

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> I am new to the museum field and recently started working as a museum
> attendant giving tours.  I was recently told that if I receive tips at
the
> end of a tour I should not keep them and give them to the museum as a
> donation.  Is this a common policy at other museums and, if so, why?
If I
> gave a tour to an individual or group who liked my tour and gave me a
tip,
> why should that money go to museum and not the poorly-paid attendant?
>  Thanks for any suggestions or clarifications on policies.

> Adam

Thank you, Kirsten.  This was the point I was trying to make.  It's a
couple of dollars here and there every few weeks.  It's not like we
are raking hundreds of dollars in tips every week. The visitor has
paid the admission fee.  If at the end of the tour the visitor decides
the tour was exceptional, says to the docent, "we liked the tour,
thank you," and hands the docent a couple of dollars before walking
away, why would it automatically become a donation to the museum?  The
visitor did not specifically state it should be a donation to the
museum and, if there is no written policy on accepting/not accepting
tips, then why shouldn't the docent keep it?

I do agree that we don't do museum work for the money.  But, why is so
wrong to accept a tip every few weeks to make it almost a living wage?
I have a master's degree, yet I make $8.50 per hour for part-time work
and no health insurance.  The director that hired me even admitted the
pay is low and expects to me leave if I find a better offer.
Therefore, I don't understand why the museum should automatically get
the couple dollars I could use to buy a loaf of bread or put towards
student loan payments.

Also, while I appreciate the efforts the education department does to
train docents, I work for a small organization giving a house tour. I
do some of my own research for tours on my own time.  In addition, I
have incorporated my own research from my master's thesis into my
tours.  My thesis is copyrighted.  If I earn a tip on a tour where I
incorporated my thesis research into it, do I  get a cut of that money
since it is intellectual property?  If so, how much goes to the
museum, how much goes to the library where I did my research and how
much goes to me?  At that point we are splitting hairs and agree that
we are putting the museum's mission on a pedestal.

I definitely agree with Theresa and Kirsten that asking for tips is
tacky. I don't do that on any of my tours. In addition, I agree that
the admission price should be a sufficient price to pay for a tour.
When I go on museum tours I think the price is sufficient and I don't
tip the docent.  However, I think that if a visitor thought the tour
was exceptional and wanted to give the docent a couple of dollars at
the end of the tour and wasn't solicited, then the docent should be
able to keep the tip.  That decision is left to the visitor's
discretion.  One hundred percent of the tip proceeds should not
automatically go to the museum.  At best the docent should keep the
entire tip.  At worst the tip should be split fairly between the
museum and the docent.  In general, docents are free labor as it is
and I don't see a problem with them accepting an unsolicited tip from
a visitor every few weeks on a tour.

Adam

On 3/3/10, kteasdale <teasdale.kirs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> What is a typical tip? A dollar or two? Let's not conflate thinking
> you might be permitted to keep a couple of dollars with being money
> hungry. I feel like this is a case of museums putting their mission on
> a pedestal. Workers in other professions can accept tips or expect pay
> in line with their skill/education level but if you're a museum
> professional you have to be doing it for love alone. You can't even
> hint you might like to keep your dollar or that you feel like you
> deserve to be paid well without being told you should reevaluate your
> priorities.

> That said, I agree with Theresa. I don't think guides should ask for
> tips (I agree that it's tacky and off-putting) but accepting them is
> another matter. Who is the museum to decide what the visitor should do
> with their money? If they mean for it to go to the tour guide it
> should go to the tour guide. If the museum's policy is that it goes to
> the museum this should be made explicit to the visitors so that they
> can decide whether or not they still want to tip. You should always
> respect your museum's written policy, but you should also feel free to
> question or--if you are in a position to do so--reevaluate it. (My
> museum has a no-tip policy written into its docent handbook. I put it
> there. It's coming out.)

> Cheers,
> Kirsten

> On Mar 3, 9:07 am, Shannon Morris <shannon.mor...@gcsu.edu> wrote:
>> I do not agree>>
>> Generally, the guide is provided the tools (i.e. training) to make the
>> museum "come alive" by the museum educators. Also, if monetary gain is a
>> large incentive for someone, that person may wish to re-evaluate their
>> choice to pursue a career in the museum profession.

>> From: aamemp@googlegroups.com [mailto:aamemp@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
>> Of Katie Courtien
>> Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2010 7:53 PM
>> To: tkelliher
>> Cc: AAM-EMP
>> Subject: Re: [EMP] Re: Tipping Museum Tour Guides

>> Very well said Theresa. You're waiter/cook analogy is perfect. Although
>> the museum creates the content, it only comes alive because of an educator
>> who is presenting it in an informative and entertaining way. Besides, who
>> really completely sticks to the script any way? If I had offered someone a
>> tip and they then handed it to the organization they worked for, I would
>> be angry that my money wasn't given to the person who deserved it. It's a
>> pretty bogus standard.

>> On Tue, Mar 2, 2010 at 7:35 PM, tkelliher
>> <theresakelli...@hotmail.com<mailto:theresakelli...@hotmail.com>> wrote:
>> Adam,

>> Here are a few random points:

>> I have spoken to both museum professionals and non-professional museum
>> goers in the past few hours (in completely casual, non-scientific
>> manner), and the museum professionals are saying it is up to the
>> individual museum (some have a don't ask/don't tell policy), meaning
>> there is no hard-and-fast rule, but donation of tips is a generally-
>> accepted practice.  However, all the museum goers I spoke to
>> vehemently felt that any tip handed to a guide is specifically
>> intended to go to the guide.

>> It is reasonable to assume that if a visitor wants to donate to the
>> museum, they will do so (and may have already done so, and in turn
>> will receive the tax deduction they would expect as a donor), and if
>> they want to show appreciation to the guide, they will do that. It is
>> also reasonable to assume the visitor would rather have the control
>> over where the tip goes, and may feel resentment towards a museum that
>> takes tips away from its employees (if they were privy to that
>> knowledge).  So, if a museum values a donor's intent, they would
>> either let the guide keep the tips, or verbalize the tip-donation
>> practice into the tour at some point.  To do otherwise would be
>> dishonest, so my museum-going sources say.

>> I'm no lawyer, and there very well may be different rules and/or
>> exemptions for non-profits, but according to the Labor Department:
>> 29 CFR 531.52 - General characteristics of ``tips.''
>> A tip is a sum presented by a customer as a gift or gratuity in
>> recognition of some service performed for him. It is to be
>> distinguished from payment of a charge, if any, made for the service.
>> Whether a tip is to be given, and its amount, are matters determined
>> solely by the customer, and generally he has the right to determine
>> who shall be the recipient of his gratuity. In the absence of an
>> agreement to the contrary between the recipient and a third party, a
>> tip becomes the property of the person in recognition of whose service
>> it is presented by the customer. Only tips actually received by an
>> employee as money belonging to him which he may use as he chooses free
>> of any control by the employer, may be counted in determining whether
>> he is a ``tipped
>> employee'' within the meaning of the Act and in applying the
>> provisions of section 3(m) which govern wage credits for
>> tips.http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/ESA/Title_29/Part_531/29CFR531.52.htm

>> and Section Number: 531.40:
>> ...(c) Under the principles stated in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this
>> section, employers have been permitted to treat as payments to
>> employees for purposes of the Act sums paid at the employees'
>> direction to third persons for the following purposes:...voluntary
>> contributions to churches and charitable, fraternal, athletic, and
>> social organizations, or societies from which the employer receives no
>> profit or benefit directly or
>> indirectly.http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/ESA/Title_29/Part_531/29CFR531.40.htm

>> I would be interested if someone can find some link somewhere to
>> intellectual property law as it relates to tips received by tour
>> guides.  I can't imagine it exists.  It sounds akin to a waiter having
>> to hand over his tips to the chef for cooking the meal.

>> Best,
>> Theresa

>> On Mar 1, 3:47 am, Adam Michalski
>> <atmichal...@gmail.com<mailto:atmichal...@gmail.com>> wrote:

>> > Hello,

>> > I am new to the museum field and recently started working as a museum
>> > attendant giving tours.  I was recently told that if I receive tips at
>> > the
>> > end of a tour I should not keep them and give them to the museum as a
>> > donation.  Is this a common policy at other museums and, if so, why?  If
>> > I
>> > gave a tour to an individual or group who liked my tour and gave me a
>> > tip,
>> > why should that money go to museum and not the poorly-paid attendant?
>> >  Thanks for any suggestions or clarifications on policies.

>> > Adam

>> --
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>> aamemp@googlegroups.com<mailto:aamemp@googlegroups.com>.
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>> aamemp+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com<mailto:aamemp%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroup s.com>.
>> For more options, visit

> *We museum people, are in an "educated" profession. Salary or lack
>> thereof has nothing to do with expecting or needing tips. We chose to
>> go into our profession and go through the advanced schooling and
>> training associated with it. Even volunteers are trained to do their
>> jobs and by the very nature of being a "volunteer" should not get
>> tipped. You don't tip your lawyer, doctor, school teacher, college
>> professor, fireman, police officer, or curator. Front line museum
>> educators and docents shouldn't get nor expect tips either.*

> > I feel like this is a case of museums putting their mission on
> > a pedestal. Workers in other professions can accept tips or expect pay
> > in line with their skill/education level but if you're a museum
> > professional you have to be doing it for love alone. You can't even
> > hint you might like to keep your dollar or that you feel like you
> > deserve to be paid well without being told you should reevaluate your
> > priorities.

> You misunderstand the nature of tipping. Tipping is done for the
> traditional "service trades", not for "professionals" and is very much
> a part of a social class system. Historically, unskilled laborers like
> waitresses, bus boys, porters, and their like were paid very little
> and quite literally worked for tips. Today, many of these jobs have a
> minimum wage but it is lower than regular minimum because again,
> people are expected to make up the different in tips. If they don't,
> their employer has to make up the difference to bring their hourly
> salary up to minimum wage. This is why are you aren't supposed to tip
> the owner of a business if they serve you directly but you do tip his
> or her staff. The owner of the business is making money directly off
> his service whereas the staff is working for tips.

> We museum people, are in an "educated" profession. Salary or lack
> thereof has nothing to do with expecting or needing tips. We chose to
> go into our profession and go through the advanced schooling and
> training associated with it. Even volunteers are trained to do their
> jobs and by the very nature of being a "volunteer" should not get
> tipped. You don't tip your lawyer, doctor, school teacher, college
> professor, fireman, police officer, or curator. Front line museum
> educators and docents shouldn't get nor expect tips either.

> Encourage people who want to tip to make a donation to the museum or
> write a letter to the director expressing how much they enjoyed their
> visit. Those go a lot further than being handed a couple of bucks.

> Deb Fuller

> *From:* aamemp@googlegroups.com [mailto:aamemp@googlegroups.com] *On
> Behalf Of *Kirsten Teasdale
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 04, 2010 11:12 AM
> *To:* Deb Fuller
> *Cc:* AAM-EMP; safertodr...@gmail.com

> *Subject:* Re: [EMP] Re: Tipping Museum Tour Guides

>  *We museum people, are in an "educated" profession. Salary or lack

> thereof has nothing to do with expecting or needing tips. We chose to
> go into our profession and go through the advanced schooling and
> training associated with it. Even volunteers are trained to do their
> jobs and by the very nature of being a "volunteer" should not get
> tipped. You don't tip your lawyer, doctor, school teacher, college
> professor, fireman, police officer, or curator. Front line museum
> educators and docents shouldn't get nor expect tips either.
> *

> No one has said anything about expecting tips or relying on them or
> anything that would demean an "educated" profession. (Not that there is
> anything demeaning about a job where you *do* rely on tips or are less
> "educated" etc.) The original poster asked what to do when he himself is
> given a tip that he has not solicited. This happens. Clearly your conception
> of museum workers as professionals who are outside the realm of tips is not
> one that is universally shared by visitors.

> First of all, why are we assuming that people who are compensated up to the
> minimum wage level (making the big bucks!) are "professional" employees and
> not service employees, and are therefore making enough money so that tipping
> shouldn't come into the equation? Because we've undergone years of education
> and training? I would say it's not tipping that's a part of a traditional
> class system so much as the concept that a group of people--regardless of
> how poorly they're paid--are engaged in work that is just plain better (more
> elevated, more fulfilling, more important) than service work and therefore
> above tipping. As if tipping is for the working class, and museos are better
> than that.

> Secondly, just because something has always been done doesn't mean it's the
> best way. I had a no tips clause in my docent handbook because it was just
> the accepted thing and I had never really thought about it before. Let's
> look at things anew rather than looking back to the way they've typically
> been done. (Although, to directly refute your claim about not tipping
> lawyers, doctors, teachers etc, it is not at all uncommon for people in
> these professions to receive gifts. Sure, some school districts etc have
> rules against this, but that's usually so that no child feels badly that
> they couldn't afford to give the teacher something. If the class or the PTA
> chip in to get the teacher something that's usually acceptable. And if a
> child disobeys this rule and gives his or her teacher a gift card? The
> school district doesn't claim it.)

> I know it's difficult for many of us with middle class backgrounds to
> really see our own class privilege and how it colors our view of things like
> money and tipping, but if we're bringing up the class system this is
> especially relevant (despite getting a bit beyond the subject of tipping and
> into salaries.) You have to remember that there are people who are trying to
> get their foot in the door of the museum profession who don't have the
> financial support of their parents or spouses. Whatever money they earn is
> the money they live off of. Fulfilling "professional" work is all well and
> good, but are we not insisting on "professional" salaries because we're not
> reliant on them ourselves (and therefore not sympathetic to someone who
> might be)? Because we were raised to think talking about money is gauche?
> From peoples' comments I can see how unacknowledged class privilege might be
> seeping into the conversation. Again, there are obviously no museos living
> off of their tips, but the undertones of this conversation are similar to
> the many I have had about salaries.

> It's wonderful if you want to donate your tips to the museum if you are in
> a comfortable place financially. A couple of dollars won't make a difference
> for you but they might make a difference for the museum. The original
> poster, who is making $8/hr with a masters degree, should feel free to
> accept a couple of dollars in tips. They probably make a bigger difference
> for him than for the museum.

> Cheers,
> Kirsten

> On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 12:41 PM, Deb Fuller <debful...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 11:16 AM, kteasdale <teasdale.kirs...@gmail.com>
> wrote:

> > I feel like this is a case of museums putting their mission on
> > a pedestal. Workers in other professions can accept tips or expect pay
> > in line with their skill/education level but if you're a museum
> > professional you have to be doing it for love alone. You can't even
> > hint you might like to keep your dollar or that you feel like you
> > deserve to be paid well without being told you should reevaluate your
> > priorities.

> You misunderstand the nature of tipping. Tipping is done for the
> traditional "service trades", not for "professionals" and is very much
> a part of a social class system. Historically, unskilled laborers like
> waitresses, bus boys, porters, and their like were paid very little
> and quite literally worked for tips. Today, many of these jobs have a
> minimum wage but it is lower than regular minimum because again,
> people are expected to make up the different in tips. If they don't,
> their employer has to make up the difference to bring their hourly
> salary up to minimum wage. This is why are you aren't supposed to tip
> the owner of a business if they serve you directly but you do tip his
> or her staff. The owner of the business is making money directly off
> his service whereas the staff is working for tips.

> We museum people, are in an "educated" profession. Salary or lack
> thereof has nothing to do with expecting or needing tips. We chose to
> go into our profession and go through the advanced schooling and
> training associated with it. Even volunteers are trained to do their
> jobs and by the very nature of being a "volunteer" should not get
> tipped. You don't tip your lawyer, doctor, school teacher, college
> professor, fireman, police officer, or curator. Front line museum
> educators and docents shouldn't get nor expect tips either.

> Encourage people who want to tip to make a donation to the museum or
> write a letter to the director expressing how much they enjoyed their
> visit. Those go a lot further than being handed a couple of bucks.

> Deb Fuller

> --
> Kirsten Teasdale
> (757) 810 - 4608
> teasdale.kirs...@gmail.com
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/kteasdale

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