GoogleTagCombinations as extension wanted.

[fridemar]

Dear developers,
who is interested to integrate the JavaScript of Vartan into
TiddlyWiki.
See <-> http://aboutus.org/TiddlyWikiGoogleTagCombinations for
details.
Fridemar

[Tobias Beer]

Is that intended to replace internal wiki link's with external ones?
If so, I don't find the idea very propelling, besides I don't think
googles indexes get updated this often, or do I misunderstand the
concept? Wouldn't you rather want to do things like that with a
"simple" firefox plugin like "hyperwords"? Why would you want that in
the wiki site itself? Isn't that a bit too much googlifying the whole
web?

[fridemar]

Thank you Tobias for giving me and other interested peers the
opportunity to elaborate a bit on this:

You understand me right, that there is even more potential in it, than
"only" replacing the internal wiki links by it. In TiddlyWiki, I
suggest, to extend the parser a bit, to allow embedded
GoogleTagCombinations, as e.g.

$GoogleSearchTerm1,Comment1 ....some text ...
$GoogleSearchTerm2,Comment2 .. etc,

for calling the above defined (and to be improved) function g that
call g("GoogleSearchTerm1",Comment1) ....some text ...
g("GoogleSearchTerm2",Comment2) ....etc.

These interspersed calls produce (in the TiddlyWiki view-mode) option
boxes, that can be (un-)checked by the users and used as a Google
query by clicking an additional command-link, that is added to the
line, where you have already: "edit","done", ... : This way the new
command line shows up as: "edit","done","search", ... For convenience,
"search" should only be shown, if there is at least one
GoogleSearchTerm defined.

Another good idea, you imply, is: that we should have a "dual use" for
the GoogleTagCombinations, similar to the following example, that is
handled in the Aboutus wiki: GoogleIcon.png TiddlyWiki.

With one marker you get at the same time, two links: one pointing to
Google and the other one, to an internal wiki link. Now think this
latter template tool generalized to arbitrary (Google-) Tag
Combinations and you see the power of this construct and how useful it
is for (collective) filtering (in communities).

Please have a look at <->[[2]] where interested developers and plug-in
programmers can deepen the dialogue on this special topic.


fridemar 05:04, 16 July 2008 (PDT

[fridemar]

PS.:
Since my last newsgroup contributions, doesn't show the richtext
format as in the Media Wiki Engine used at Aboutus,
here is the link, where you find the orignal contribution, which
quotes the question:

http://www.aboutus.org/TiddlyWikiGoogleTagCombinations#An_answer_to_a_TiddlyWiki_Developer_.28newsgroup_member.29

and gives (and allows) richtext answers, even with embedded uploadable
images (and besides that a developing income-model for all
CreativeCommons, who need "food on the table" :-), called
ExtremeOpenBusiness, that uses TiddlyWiki for Journaling ).

[FND]

> Is that intended to replace internal wiki link's with external ones?

So I'm not sure whether I understand this correctly - but am I right in
assuming that this should simply add a Google-search link right next to
every internal wiki link, using the respective tiddler title as search term?

If so, that's pretty simple:
http://devpad.tiddlyspot.com/#SearchTagPlugin

-- F.

[wolfgang]

Hi everyone

> So I'm not sure whether I understand this correctly - but am I right in
> assuming that this should simply add a Google-search link right next to
> every internal wiki link, using the respective tiddler title as search term?

don't think that is what was meant. But something which is able to
combine more than one link to a single search at Google.

Just tried it with this bookmarklet:

http://tiddlyhome.bidix.info/desk.html#TiddlyDesktop%20GoogleSearch

Which has the advantage of selecting any words, not just links, and by
clicking on the bookmarklet a search starts.
However, this isn't able too to select multiple words neither.

Regards,

W.

[Tobias Beer]

I am still on the page of right clicking some selected text and doing
a "search with... (maybe google or could it not be wikipedia as
well?)".

Is google indexing these links (in a specific way) once it actually
find them? If so, is there a specific google-tag-link-format to adhere
to? What are those "comments" you want to pass on to the g function?
Are those "simply" tooltips for the links to be created?

I can see the idea of the search button in the tiddler toolbar which
would probably open a popup listing the "google-tag-links" found in
the tiddler content. But again, why all this internal wiki-indexing?
Unless google actually indexes those links semantically, I don't quite
see the point, besides a certain google-friendlyness/-affiliation.

[fridemar]

Dear Tobias,
thank you very much for your your questions/interest/engagement.

For convenience allow me to quote you in the Aboutus wiki and answer
you
there, (of course with a link or copy to here).

Reasons for suggesting this:
* I already had written stuff there, that answers partially some
question of you
* I permanently (bi-)link to that page from external wikis
* Aboutus has a complete page history
* Refactoring/Writing/Structuring/Finding/Illustrating/Discussing is
easier
* We can upload images to support our discussion
* We can use rich link language, i.e. easier referencing there.
* Aboutus has finegrained Watchlist options
* We can create en passant in our discussion prototypical GoogleTags,
to test the experimental versions of GooglishTiddlyWikis. (Note the
selfreferential
expressing power of the last sentence in a wiki context versus a naked
mailinglist.)
* I am ready to burdon on myself the additional overhead, if nobody
else makes
my life easier :-), leaving bi-links or copies to here for the
integrity of both, the
newsgroup-and the Aboutus database
(This (normally avoided) redundancy can help in our case in different
ways)

Fridemar

[Tobias Beer]

As for me, cite or cross reference as you see fit. I will take another
look at the aboutus page. Though, I fear I am not quite keen (yet?!?)
on learning discussions the AboutUs way.

To correct you a bit, I am far from what one might call a "tiddlywiki
developer". However, participating in the TiddlyWikiDev discussion
group... I am indeed ;-)

[fridemar]

Hi Tobias,

On Jul 19, 10:56 pm, Tobias Beer <beertob...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> As for me, cite or cross reference as you see fit. I will take another
> look at the aboutus page. Though, I fear I am not quite keen (yet?!?)
> on learning discussions the AboutUs way.

We are perfectly welcome to take initiatives and collaborate on
AboutUs and beyond. See http://aboutus.org/values.

In the AboutUs community wikizens can organize themselves to
* weave the Web, connecting their contributions with an appropriate
subset of many million Websites, represented there as writable wiki-
pages.
* build income for each other (http://aboutus.org/
CreatingAndSharingWealth)

On creative TiddlyWiki developer sites, we often find conventional
DonationButtons to keep the free floating CreativeCommons intelligence
financially independent.

However a smarter, collaboration-based way to build income for the
builders of digital goods and services in the commons, is to build
together ExtremeOpenBusiness, where collaboration-intelligence is
creating a more efficient source of income for each other than those
feedback-less DonationButtons, where nobody knows, whether they
create enough income for their owners or not.

> To correct you a bit, I am far from what one might call a "tiddlywiki
> developer". However, participating in the TiddlyWikiDev discussion
> group... I am indeed ;-)

Modestas non olet :-) .

In analogy to "The Web is the Computer", I am tempted to say:
"The Web is the Developer" and we are all (from newbie to expert) part
of this (hopefully maximally) open process,
a process, where each author is given due credit (and income).

In this context the idea of a http://google.com/search?q=GooglishTiddlyWiki
and the call for realizing GoogleTagCombinations is born,

the sooner, the better.

-- Fridemar

[fridemar]

Thank you FND,

it would be helpful (especially for newcomer programmers),
if you could put an experimental version that "hijacks", as you say,
all
(CamelCase) Tiddler links in each Tiddler, *putting inline an option
box in front
of each link*.

A click on a "search" on the extended commandline ("edit", "done",
"delete", "search", ..)
does two things:
1. It collects a query string L=l1+l2+..+ln of all the optionbox-
selected links of a Tiddler
2. It sends the complex query L to Google.
(
Possible refinements later on:
If no option box is selected, it sends the Tiddler title to Google.
All checked option boxes are persistent in viewmode.
The complex queries are appended at the end of each Tiddler

)
Benefit: an enormous timesaver for collective filtering.
Internal Tiddler links are preserved.

Fridemar

[FND]

> it would be helpful (especially for newcomer programmers),
> if you could put an experimental version that "hijacks", as you say,
> all (CamelCase) Tiddler links in each Tiddler, *putting inline an option
> box in front of each link*.

Quite frankly, I currently don't have the time to put a lot more effort
into this. However, anyone's welcome to improve the implementation.
If you have specific questions, we'll be happy to help.

-- F.

[fridemar]

Dear F., dear developers:

I played a bit with your SearchPlugin and it was very helpful to dig
myself into
TiddlyWiki.

The intermediary result was:
http://www.aboutus.org/TiddlyWikiComplexSearchPlugin

I also found numerous different "createTiddlerCheckbox" flavors in the
Web.

However it would be great, if you or some developer, who has created/
used such a function,
could adapt the for-loop by the names of the checked checkboxes,
excluding the
checkboxes on the system-level.
The names of the checked checkboxes, derived from their corresponding
TiddlerLinks should be collected in an array for blank-delimited
concatenation, that forms the Google query.

As I have not yet grogged the architecture of TiddlyWiki yet (it is a
gorgeous cathedral
in my eyes), it would accelerate the process considerably.

This way we get end-userdefined search tag-combinations instead of our
"hardwired" ones
and best of all, we can use this tool for faster finding/connecting
all the dispersed activities
of TiddlyWikizens.

All the best to all of us
Fridemar