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cass-hacks  
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 More options Jun 7 2007, 10:04 am
From: cass-hacks
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2007 07:04:07 -0700
Local: Thurs, Jun 7 2007 10:04 am
Subject: Re: Using CSS to hide text
Directly from the ambiguous department of ambiguity.  :-()

The guidelines should stick to guidelines for Google and leave
accessibility out of it or, give references to authoritative sites on
accessibility.

It seems all that was accomplished was confusing the issue even more
without actually saying much of anything concrete.

Personally, I'm just going to keep doing what I always have been
doing, e.g. provide a "basic" page, including any images that are
relevant, that anything can process while building enhancements on top
that enabled user agents can take advantage of while at the same time,
not being required.

Craig

On Jun 7, 10:47 pm, Sam I Am wrote:

> Okay, so there's been an update on what constitutues hidden text and
> links -http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=66353

> Great; I applaud.

> Now, back to 2007 and these particular bits of the information:

> "Text (such as excessive keywords) can be hidden in several ways,
> including .... Using CSS to hide text"

> Agreed, and if done for the wrong reasons, not good.

> Then this: "If you're using text to try to describe something search
> engines can't access - for example, Javascript, images, or Flash files
> - remember that many human visitors using screen readers, mobile
> browsers, browsers without plug-ins, and slow connections will not be
> able to view that content either."

> As most web developers/designers will know, the choice of fonts and
> how they look are still unfortunately severely limited when it comes
> to the web. A lot of design aware developers and web designers that
> choose to code their websites a la 2007 (ie. split content from style
> and use CSS to get the design) thus choose to make their navigation
> consist of a series of images since, let's face it, this generally
> looks a lot better and also looks the same over most browsers .... and
> as designers/developers, we are of course coding for users (like
> google always recommends!). Common practice when doing this is to
> provide a means for people on outdated browsers or browsers aimed at
> viewers with visual disabilities, to still be able to see the
> navigation, although not at it's top design wise. This is done with
> hidden text which automatically shows depending on the browsers
> capabilities.

> I guess you know the question. Does this update to the guidelines mean
> this is out or definitely in? On the one hand you're not supposed to
> hide text, yet on the other hand they specifically mention keeping
> your site readable for human visitors who have browsers that might not
> otherwise be able to see the images. The only way to do this, if you
> want to have a nicely designed image of text as your navigation, is to
> hide text (well, or have both showing underneath each other which I
> think everyone will agree is not an option).

> Have a look at the main navigation on my sitewww.travellerspoint.com
> for an example. Disable css altogether and you'll get the text version
> just like it's meant to be. But the images look better for those users
> browsing with 99% of the browsers. Just to be clear, I'm not talking
> about keyword stuffing or anything, it's exactly the same text as in
> the image, just hidden using CSS.

> I guess to be safe, the only choice is to remove the images and go
> back to text, but I hate it when having to go backwards in time/design
> just because something isn't clear in google's guidelines....


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