Please advise- on adopting MyGWT or gwt-ext mid-development

[sal...@gmail.com]

Hello,

My project has almost reached its full potential with GWT on the front
end, and since I am not in touch with a designer, I am starting to eye
external libraries to prettify my application. MyGWT and gwt-ext both
look the best of the libraries that provide widgets I foresee a use
for. From reading the forums, many users seem to like the integration
of MyGWT with GWT, but the code seems like it isn't ready for use in
production. GWT-ext seems production ready, but there seems to be a
good chance that:

1) my team will have to learn a new model of UI development
2) my team will have to learn javascript and java
3) gwt-ext might demand RPC to be accomplished in a certain way, or
else pay a premium
4) gwt-ext expects the History mechanism to act a certain way. (Our
app retooled the GWT history mechanism)
5) How does flash work with gwt?

If you can advise me on MyGWT's stability, or any of the issues I
listed about gwt-ext, I would greatly appreciate it.

If you'd like to see our app as it is now, try http://www.sparkip.com

Thank you

-David

[Carl Scott]

I have recently adopted MyGWT in mid-development, and can offer at
least some perspective. To address some of your concerns...

> 1) my team will have to learn a new model of UI development

This is true, but MyGWT's model is more java-like -- that is, bloated
and requires more classes, but it works and works deterministically,
whereas GWT-ish models can widely vary from developer to developer as
it pertains to how things render, stability of rendering, etc.
MyGWT's UI development model tries to more cleanly separate things
pertaining to building UI's. The biggest change for me to adopt was
the use of Layouts (each panel (which MyGWT calls containers) must
have some sort of layout, describing how it's widgets are, well, laid
out). You'll find, though, in the end, it's much cleaner.

> 2) my team will have to learn javascript and java

This is probably a good thing to know regardless...

> 3) gwt-ext might demand RPC to be accomplished in a certain way, or
> else pay a premium
> 4) gwt-ext expects the History mechanism to act a certain way. (Our
> app retooled the GWT history mechanism)

I don't have experience with gwt-ext, but I'd expect that since MyGWT
& gwt-ext are build on top of GWT, in the end, it's still GWT.

> 5) How does flash work with gwt?

Never tried it, but it should work the same way it works in HTML or
any other language. At worst, you can always embed it in a frame.
Remember, in the end, it's simply javascript, plain & simple.

> If you can advise me on MyGWT's stability, or any of the issues I
> listed about gwt-ext, I would greatly appreciate it.

MyGWT is current on its way to a full release, and has been recently
releasing RC (release candidate) builds. Although there are some
annoying bugs (and what toolkit is free of those), MyGWT seems
suitable for someone like you, who doesn't have a designer but would
like something with a slick design. And swapping out GWT widgets for
MyGWT ones isn't rocket science. It just takes a bit of reading,
patience, and time to get done right.

The biggest downside to MyGWT (for me) is the poor documentation
(whereas GWT's documentation is great IMHO). Other than that, it
seems to work fine and there are a number of products online using
MyGWT.

Good luck! And I must say, your current application is pretty slick
already!

--
Carl Scott
Software Developer, Solertium Corporation

[Tanvir]

I just went through this myself. My requirements were I just needed
some decent internal tools with serviceable GUIs that could be built
really fast. I started with MyGWT and in general it was OK. The
problem with it is that compared to ExtJS the GUI elements are really
lacking and way too basic, but the upside is that the whole framework
is Java so debugging is simpler. GWT-ext has a ton of more polished
GUI elements where stuff just works, but the downside is that it's
really just a thin veneer on top of the ExtJS library (via JSNI), so
debugging is a pain (especially in hosted mode) as most times you will
simply get some really opaque JavaScript error with almost NO
indication as to what's really wrong.

I opted for GWT-ext though because I really did not want to re-invent
the wheel and make another paged, editable table widget :-).

YMMV, Good Luck!

[Tim T]

there is a new version of mygwt coming out very soon that will be a
lot more competitive with gwt-ext in terms of the number widgets -
read Darrell's post here:

http://www.mygwt.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3915#3915

in terms of gwt and learning javascript/css - I think you need to be
quite familiar with these technologies in order to create anything
moderately complicated in gwt.

cool website by the way.

[ilker]

Hello David and folks,

We are going through a similar thing as well.
I had already written some composite widgets in GWT.
I had to struggle with CSS, but they still do NOT look good.
To get management's buy in, it needs to look good.
So, we are in a dilemma too.

When we go to GWT-EXT for the best looks and widget features,
But then
- it is a bit pain to debug things when they don't work.
- sometimes you don't get to see the exceptions in the console.
- it also loads up slower (in hosted mode)
- the widget APIs, names, the overall way is quiete different than
GWT
- although their examples (demo) is really great, the code doesn't
have much Javadoc comments.

When we go to MyGWT, as a compromise between the looks and debugging;
It seems, with MyGWT, the debugging will be easier, the widgets seems
look better then GWT and seems to have more features.
But then;
- a new version with more features is supposed to be coming soon
- the widget APIs, names, overall way is different then GWT's (and
its incubators)

It seems, GWT incubator folks are working on more widgets, but NOT
clear when they will catch up on the looks, CSS and features.
And Declerative UI seems to be coming too. How it will fit in all, is
NOT very clear.

So, we are in a dilemma.

Some of my observations on each one;

GWT:
=====
GWT widgets are really NOT good looking, they also have less features
and there is NO default CSS.
So right off the box, they do NOT come out looking good.

MYGWT:
=======
Its widgets look better and has more features than GWT's.
It seems, MYGWT is catching up to GWT-EXT.

I have NOT experimented with GWT and MYGWT widget/container
interworking.

GWT-EXT:
========
It seems to me, gwt-ext's widgets is the most mature one ( best
looking and rich in features).

However, mixing of GWT widgets with GWT-EXT don't seem to be 100%
working.
For example, if you add a GWT's widgets like Label, Button into GWT-
EXT's Panel (which is added to RootPanel) then you get exceptions.

While, if you add GWT widgets and GWT-EXT widgets into a GWT's
container (like VerticalPanel), which is then added to GWT-EXT's
Panel, that is added to RootPanel, then it is OK.

Please keep me posted, on what you find out.

Regards,
-- ilker

[Ponthiaux Eric]

In all cases prefer full gwt framework instead of mixed gwt javascript
ones

Mygwt is full gwt ...

Kind regards
Envoyé depuis mon iPhone

Le 13 mars 08 à 07:06, ilker <ilker...@gmail.com> a écrit :

[walden]

+1 to full gwt framework (MyGWT).

To me, it is *invaluable* to be able to debug Java right down into
framework widget behavior. This not only helps in finding the bugs in
the framework, which are inevitable, but it also helps with
customizations. You need to understand the intricacies in order to
understand how to best extend the framework. In Open Source terms,
it's more Open.

Walden

On Mar 13, 4:31 am, Ponthiaux Eric <ponthiaux.e...@gmail.com> wrote:
> In all cases prefer full gwt framework instead of mixed gwt javascript  
> ones
>
> Mygwt is full gwt ...
>
> Kind regards
> Envoyé depuis mon iPhone
>

> Le 13 mars 08 à 07:06, ilker <ilkerki...@gmail.com> a écrit :

> >>>> -David- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -