The subject says it all: On creation, Gmail invasively becomes your
Google Account’s primary email, w/o good warning & “PERMANENTLY”!
So Google/Gmail, what the heck do you think you’re doing?
How did I run into this and then waste several hours figuring-out what
happened and trying to clean up the mess?
After being an otherwise quite happy Google Account user for years, I
finally decided to give their Gmail a quick try,
(that is, after hearing that Gmail could send FROM other email
addresses I own --needed to do that. Oh, and BTW, it “can” except for
one other sneaky thing Gmail does (but doesn’t bother to mention until
the very end of their docs), which can also lead to some very
embarrassing surprises if you don’t catch it, and indeed many say
they’ve entirely left Gmail because of it: your underlying (and
usually very personal) Gmail address is still displayed when sending
reportedly “From” another (often business) address! –read on)
Well just look what that problems that “Okay, I’ll give it a spin” has
caused me:
Now that I’ve created a Gmail, without warning (well without any
warning I ever saw), you’ve switched my Google Account’s primary email
to it. (So regardless if I like Gmail or not, regardless if I ever
want to use it, it’s now my “username” to sign in to Google, it’s
displayed at the top of every Google application once I sign in, and
any time I invite someone to share a Google Doc (or I hear to come to
some event on my calendar) that Gmail is used to send them that
invite (and even though I may never check that email), and under my
Google Docs– in all my documents there-- that Gmail username is now
shown suddenly – in the revision history (who wrote it) and in the
chat, and even though none of my colleagues know that username (how I
found out -- `Who’s this who has been editing all the documents?!’).
Well, possible small correction; the post
http://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Logging-In-en/browse_thread... says in an existing Google Account the Gmail signup (indeed I found it
at https://www.google.com/accounts/NewAccount?service=mail ) mentions
quote[Once you complete this form, your Gmail username will become
your new default email address as well as the primary address
identifying your Google Account. Your previous email address will
remain a part of your Google Account and you may continue to log in
with that address if you prefer. ]
* Why wasn't that in BOLD!
* And while this does mention your Gmail becoming primary, it sounds
like just a convenience, per the final sentence, that nothing will be
lost). Well nothing except for one thing: the ability to UNDO THIS!
As WHY DIDN'T THIS SAY THE MOST IMPORTANT THING: "PERMANENTLY"
becoming primary.
* (plus as I much later found out, why doesn't it also say
"PERMANENTLY using up this username, which will be also be PERMANENTLY
linked this Google Account, indeed PERMANENTLY using up the Google
Account's one direct-link slot, EVEN if the Gmail is deleted, as it
won't fully be deleted, but rather even as ghost it will forever
occupy the one Gmail slot of this Google Account, even if it's deleted
and never used")
--all this, EVERYTHING which can't be undone should be declared up-
front, and in BOLD or ALL-CAPS. (But of course, really just shouldn't
have anything where it can't be undone!)
As much worse, I can’t get rid that darn Gmail all over my Google
Account! Google Account has no way to change my email back. Indeed
apparently no way to change my primary email ever again: as also
Google Account’s “change email” link ( https://www.google.com/accounts/EditEmail ) has now disappeared! You’ve trapped me into this Gmail account!
Permanently! And I haven’t even sent nor received one message. How
sneaky can you be to lock people into your Gmail? Why don’t you have
some integrity here. Advertize “Got a Google Account? Sign up for
free webmail with Gmail. And instantly will arrange it so you can
never go back!” -- Now that would be truth in advertizing.
Indeed, on creation, Gmail not only sets itself as your Google
Account’s primary email (and, yes, w/o warning & “permanently”), but
it also forces you to enter a first & last name, and then also sets
this as your Google Account first & last name (in
https://www.google.com/accounts/UpdateUserInfo), and without telling
you. And while this can be “changed”, there’s a caveat: it can never
now be entirely removed; instead one gets q[Required field cannot be
left blank]. So while before for years I had it blank with never a
problem, now I feel tricked by Google (in trying Gmail) to now have to
have it be filled in with some value.
Google/Gmail, why are you doing this to your users?
• Is it part of the other disrespect Gmail is doing on people’s
privacy where Gmail forces users to expose their underlying Gmail
address even if they aren’t sending from it? That is your “on behalf
of” sneakiness mentioned above, that now even has its own section on
Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gmail#.22On_behalf_of.22 inspired by about 300 pissed-off Gmail users
http://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Message-Delivery-en/browse_... ; your implementation is even against the Internet RFC standard one
user evoisard points out in post #309, and there’s now even the active
petition http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/gmailfrom to get you to
stop.
• And on my first issue, are you so desperate to get Gmail users
that --to your own loyal Google Account users-- the moment they decide
to also try your Gmail service, you’ll lock them in:
o regardless of if they want it or not, all their emails (as
invites) from their Google Account will come from (and be replied to)
their Gmail address, which also no one ever heard of before)
o and with no way to turn back!
--well not without doing something seemingly extreme.
As it appears there IS a way out of the Gmail trap on Google Account
users – the most drastic way I feared (indeed a bit worse: as I found
out your carefully chosen Gmail username is effectively also lost
forever):
But that, if it works,
• would also destroy all the data in that Gmail account (so I
consider myself lucky I noticed Gmail’s sneaky trick early; the others
I’ve read about don’t seem so lucky)
• and it would seem it might cause my username to be lost.
Or would it be freed for me to open it up again for another account,
at least if I did it quickly?
NO; implied by http://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Logging-In-en/msg/464ccb44c... , even if you delete the Gmail, apparently that deletion is really
kind of a lie, as it never really fully deletes it: the Gmail username
is now permanently linked to this Google Account. So you’re stuck.
You can’t open it elsewhere. And you can’t open it here again without
it (per the above) entirely messing up your primary email again. So,
yes, my carefully chosen username is now lost. Gmail, is there no
end to your ill-design??!
• Indeed even if one went to the absolute drastic extreme of
deleting one’s own Google Account (easily causing one to lose a lot
more than Gmail), “once an account is deleted it can not be recover
and the username can not be re used” says
http://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Logging-In-en/browse_thread... -ugh! Indeed, Gmail users even have a petition pleading Gmail to stop
that annoyance, too: http://www.petitiononline.com/recgmail/petition.html Well sadly still, deleting my Gmail and forever loosing that username
is what I plan to do -- unless Google or someone can post a fix quick.
As it seems the unstated rule is: If you’re a Google Account user,
• don’t dare try the Gmail app, unless it’s okay for you to forever
more have that one Gmail as your primary email – for as long as you
ever use that Google Account again, else okay to lose that username
you choose forever.
• Instead, though you’d never guess this, sign out of your Google
Account, then go to Gmail and create a new associated Gmail mail (and
new Google Account for that, just for that Gmail address to use).
Then you can sign out of Gmail and sign back into your regular Google
Account, and then if you desire, add the Gmail email address to it
(well maybe – I recall reading that works). Yes, it’s a pain to have
two different accounts, but then at least you still have your
freedom.
• But then, do you really want Gmail anyway? From above, hundreds
of users are pissed with it, and for good reason (Gmail’s forced “on
behalf of”). Indeed on that note, according to threads as
http://www.emaildiscussions.com/showthread.php?t=49136 say (from
post#1) http://FastMail.FM and (from post #9) even (Yahoo Mail Plus)
Thanks for posting this. I was beginning to think I was asleep at the
wheel when I set-up a new gmail account. Did you ever find any
resolution to this without loosing your google account? I want my
domain name email account as my primary account, which is the way I
started. Now when I login to my blog this gmail account is there. NOT
COOL.
> The subject says it all: On creation, Gmail invasively becomes your
> Google Account’s primary email, w/o good warning & “PERMANENTLY”!
> So Google/Gmail, what the heck do you think you’re doing?
> How did I run into this and then waste several hours figuring-out what
> happened and trying to clean up the mess?
> After being an otherwise quite happy Google Account user for years, I
> finally decided to give their Gmail a quick try,
> (that is, after hearing that Gmail could send FROM other email
> addresses I own --needed to do that. Oh, and BTW, it “can” except for
> one other sneaky thing Gmail does (but doesn’t bother to mention until
> the very end of their docs), which can also lead to some very
> embarrassing surprises if you don’t catch it, and indeed many say
> they’ve entirely left Gmail because of it: your underlying (and
> usually very personal) Gmail address is still displayed when sending
> reportedly “From” another (often business) address! –read on)
> Well just look what that problems that “Okay, I’ll give it a spin” has
> caused me:
> Now that I’ve created a Gmail, without warning (well without any
> warning I ever saw), you’ve switched my Google Account’s primary email
> to it. (So regardless if I like Gmail or not, regardless if I ever
> want to use it, it’s now my “username” to sign in to Google, it’s
> displayed at the top of every Google application once I sign in, and
> any time I invite someone to share a Google Doc (or I hear to come to
> some event on my calendar) that Gmail is used to send them that
> invite (and even though I may never check that email), and under my
> Google Docs– in all my documents there-- that Gmail username is now
> shown suddenly – in the revision history (who wrote it) and in the
> chat, and even though none of my colleagues know that username (how I
> found out -- `Who’s this who has been editing all the documents?!’).
> Well, possible small correction; the posthttp://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Logging-In-en/browse_thread...
> says in an existing Google Account the Gmail signup (indeed I found it
> athttps://www.google.com/accounts/NewAccount?service=mail) mentions
> quote[Once you complete this form, your Gmail username will become
> your new default email address as well as the primary address
> identifying your Google Account. Your previous email address will
> remain a part of your Google Account and you may continue to log in
> with that address if you prefer. ]
> * Why wasn't that in BOLD!
> * And while this does mention your Gmail becoming primary, it sounds
> like just a convenience, per the final sentence, that nothing will be
> lost). Well nothing except for one thing: the ability to UNDO THIS!
> As WHY DIDN'T THIS SAY THE MOST IMPORTANT THING: "PERMANENTLY"
> becoming primary.
> * (plus as I much later found out, why doesn't it also say
> "PERMANENTLY using up this username, which will be also be PERMANENTLY
> linked this Google Account, indeed PERMANENTLY using up the Google
> Account's one direct-link slot, EVEN if the Gmail is deleted, as it
> won't fully be deleted, but rather even as ghost it will forever
> occupy the one Gmail slot of this Google Account, even if it's deleted
> and never used")
> --all this, EVERYTHING which can't be undone should be declared up-
> front, and in BOLD or ALL-CAPS. (But of course, really just shouldn't
> have anything where it can't be undone!)
> As much worse, I can’t get rid that darn Gmail all over my Google
> Account! Google Account has no way to change my email back. Indeed
> apparently no way to change my primary email ever again: as also
> Google Account’s “change email” link (https://www.google.com/accounts/EditEmail > ) has now disappeared! You’ve trapped me into this Gmail account!
> Permanently! And I haven’t even sent nor received one message. How
> sneaky can you be to lock people into your Gmail? Why don’t you have
> some integrity here. Advertize “Got a Google Account? Sign up for
> free webmail with Gmail. And instantly will arrange it so you can
> never go back!” -- Now that would be truth in advertizing.
> Indeed, on creation, Gmail not only sets itself as your Google
> Account’s primary email (and, yes, w/o warning & “permanently”), but
> it also forces you to enter a first & last name, and then also sets
> this as your Google Account first & last name (inhttps://www.google.com/accounts/UpdateUserInfo), and without telling
> you. And while this can be “changed”, there’s a caveat: it can never
> now be entirely removed; instead one gets q[Required field cannot be
> left blank]. So while before for years I had it blank with never a
> problem, now I feel tricked by Google (in trying Gmail) to now have to
> have it be filled in with some value.
> Google/Gmail, why are you doing this to your users?
> • Is it part of the other disrespect Gmail is doing on people’s
> privacy where Gmail forces users to expose their underlying Gmail
> address even if they aren’t sending from it? That is your “on behalf
> of” sneakiness mentioned above, that now even has its own section on
> Wikipediahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gmail#.22On_behalf_of.22 > inspired by about 300 pissed-off Gmail usershttp://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Message-Delivery-en/browse_...
> ; your implementation is even against the Internet RFC standard one
> user evoisard points out in post #309, and there’s now even the active
> petitionhttp://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/gmailfromto get you to
> stop.
> • And on my first issue, are you so desperate to get Gmail users
> that --to your own loyal Google Account users-- the moment they decide
> to also try your Gmail service, you’ll lock them in:
> o regardless of if they want it or not, all their emails (as
> invites) from their Google Account will come from (and be replied to)
> their Gmail address, which also no one ever heard of before)
> o and with no way to turn back!
> --well not without doing something seemingly extreme.
> As it appears there IS a way out of the Gmail trap on Google Account
> users – the most drastic way I feared (indeed a bit worse: as I found
> out your carefully chosen Gmail username is effectively also lost
> forever):
> But that, if it works,
> • would also destroy all the data in that Gmail account (so I
> consider myself lucky I noticed Gmail’s sneaky trick early; the others
> I’ve read about don’t seem so lucky)
> • and it would seem it might cause my username to be lost.
> Or would it be freed for me to open it up again for another account,
> at least if I did it quickly?
> NO; implied byhttp://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Logging-In-en/msg/464ccb44c...
> , even if you delete the Gmail, apparently that deletion is really
> kind of a lie, as it never really fully deletes it: the Gmail username
> is now permanently linked to this Google Account. So you’re stuck.
> You can’t open it elsewhere. And you can’t open it here again without
> it (per the above) entirely messing up your primary email again. So,
> yes, my carefully chosen username is now lost. Gmail, is there no
> end to your ill-design??!
> • Indeed even if one went to the absolute drastic extreme of
> deleting one’s own Google Account (easily causing one to lose a lot
> more than Gmail), “once an account is deleted it can not be recover
> and the username can not be re used” sayshttp://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Logging-In-en/browse_thread...
> -ugh! Indeed, Gmail users even have a petition pleading Gmail to stop
> that annoyance, too:http://www.petitiononline.com/recgmail/petition.html > Well sadly still, deleting my Gmail and forever loosing that username
> is what I plan to do -- unless Google or someone can post a fix quick.
> As it seems the unstated rule is: If you’re a Google Account user,
> • don’t dare try the Gmail app, unless it’s okay for you to forever
> more have that one Gmail as your primary email – for as long as you
> ever use that Google Account again, else okay to lose that username
> you choose forever.
> • Instead, though you’d never guess this, sign out of your Google
> Account, then go to Gmail and create a new associated Gmail mail (and
> new Google Account for that, just for that Gmail address to use).
> Then you can sign out of Gmail and sign back into your regular Google
> Account, and then if you desire, add the Gmail email address to it
> (well
If you already have a Google Account, you'll be given the option to
add Gmail to your current account, or create a separate account. If
you'd like to add Gmail to your current Google Account, be sure to
click the sign in here link.
Note: Gmail won't replace your current email address, but it will
become your primary address on your Google Account.
> Thanks for posting this. I was beginning to think I was asleep at the
> wheel when I set-up a new gmail account. Did you ever find any
> resolution to this without loosing your google account? I want my
> domain name email account as my primary account, which is the way I
> started. Now when I login to my blog this gmail account is there. NOT
> COOL.
> Thanks again
> On Jan 19, 6:15 am, AnytimeInnovator wrote:
> > The subject says it all: On creation, Gmail invasively becomes your
> > Google Account’s primary email, w/o good warning & “PERMANENTLY”!
> > So Google/Gmail, what the heck do you think you’re doing?
> > How did I run into this and then waste several hours figuring-out what
> > happened and trying to clean up the mess?
> > After being an otherwise quite happy Google Account user for years, I
> > finally decided to give their Gmail a quick try,
> > (that is, after hearing that Gmail could send FROM other email
> > addresses I own --needed to do that. Oh, and BTW, it “can” except for
> > one other sneaky thing Gmail does (but doesn’t bother to mention until
> > the very end of their docs), which can also lead to some very
> > embarrassing surprises if you don’t catch it, and indeed many say
> > they’ve entirely left Gmail because of it: your underlying (and
> > usually very personal) Gmail address is still displayed when sending
> > reportedly “From” another (often business) address! –read on)
> > Well just look what that problems that “Okay, I’ll give it a spin” has
> > caused me:
> > Now that I’ve created a Gmail, without warning (well without any
> > warning I ever saw), you’ve switched my Google Account’s primary email
> > to it. (So regardless if I like Gmail or not, regardless if I ever
> > want to use it, it’s now my “username” to sign in to Google, it’s
> > displayed at the top of every Google application once I sign in, and
> > any time I invite someone to share a Google Doc (or I hear to come to
> > some event on my calendar) that Gmail is used to send them that
> > invite (and even though I may never check that email), and under my
> > Google Docs– in all my documents there-- that Gmail username is now
> > shown suddenly – in the revision history (who wrote it) and in the
> > chat, and even though none of my colleagues know that username (how I
> > found out -- `Who’s this who has been editing all the documents?!’).
> > Well, possible small correction; the posthttp://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Logging-In-en/browse_thread...
> > says in an existing Google Account the Gmail signup (indeed I found it
> > athttps://www.google.com/accounts/NewAccount?service=mail) mentions
> > quote[Once you complete this form, your Gmail username will become
> > your new default email address as well as the primary address
> > identifying your Google Account. Your previous email address will
> > remain a part of your Google Account and you may continue to log in
> > with that address if you prefer. ]
> > * Why wasn't that in BOLD!
> > * And while this does mention your Gmail becoming primary, it sounds
> > like just a convenience, per the final sentence, that nothing will be
> > lost). Well nothing except for one thing: the ability to UNDO THIS!
> > As WHY DIDN'T THIS SAY THE MOST IMPORTANT THING: "PERMANENTLY"
> > becoming primary.
> > * (plus as I much later found out, why doesn't it also say
> > "PERMANENTLY using up this username, which will be also be PERMANENTLY
> > linked this Google Account, indeed PERMANENTLY using up the Google
> > Account's one direct-link slot, EVEN if the Gmail is deleted, as it
> > won't fully be deleted, but rather even as ghost it will forever
> > occupy the one Gmail slot of this Google Account, even if it's deleted
> > and never used")
> > --all this, EVERYTHING which can't be undone should be declared up-
> > front, and in BOLD or ALL-CAPS. (But of course, really just shouldn't
> > have anything where it can't be undone!)
> > As much worse, I can’t get rid that darn Gmail all over my Google
> > Account! Google Account has no way to change my email back. Indeed
> > apparently no way to change my primary email ever again: as also
> > Google Account’s “change email” link (https://www.google.com/accounts/EditEmail > > ) has now disappeared! You’ve trapped me into this Gmail account!
> > Permanently! And I haven’t even sent nor received one message. How
> > sneaky can you be to lock people into your Gmail? Why don’t you have
> > some integrity here. Advertize “Got a Google Account? Sign up for
> > free webmail with Gmail. And instantly will arrange it so you can
> > never go back!” -- Now that would be truth in advertizing.
> > Indeed, on creation, Gmail not only sets itself as your Google
> > Account’s primary email (and, yes, w/o warning & “permanently”), but
> > it also forces you to enter a first & last name, and then also sets
> > this as your Google Account first & last name (inhttps://www.google.com/accounts/UpdateUserInfo), and without telling
> > you. And while this can be “changed”, there’s a caveat: it can never
> > now be entirely removed; instead one gets q[Required field cannot be
> > left blank]. So while before for years I had it blank with never a
> > problem, now I feel tricked by Google (in trying Gmail) to now have to
> > have it be filled in with some value.
> > Google/Gmail, why are you doing this to your users?
> > • Is it part of the other disrespect Gmail is doing on people’s
> > privacy where Gmail forces users to expose their underlying Gmail
> > address even if they aren’t sending from it? That is your “on behalf
> > of” sneakiness mentioned above, that now even has its own section on
> > Wikipediahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gmail#.22On_behalf_of.22 > > inspired by about 300 pissed-off Gmail usershttp://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Message-Delivery-en/browse_...
> > ; your implementation is even against the Internet RFC standard one
> > user evoisard points out in post #309, and there’s now even the active
> > petitionhttp://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/gmailfromtoget you to
> > stop.
> > • And on my first issue, are you so desperate to get Gmail users
> > that --to your own loyal Google Account users-- the moment they decide
> > to also try your Gmail service, you’ll lock them in:
> > o regardless of if they want it or not, all their emails (as
> > invites) from their Google Account will come from (and be replied to)
> > their Gmail address, which also no one ever heard of before)
> > o and with no way to turn back!
> > --well not without doing something seemingly extreme.
> > As it appears there IS a way out of the Gmail trap on Google Account
> > users – the most drastic way I feared (indeed a bit worse: as I found
> > out your carefully chosen Gmail username is effectively also lost
> > forever):
> > But that, if it works,
> > • would also destroy all the data in that Gmail account (so I
> > consider myself lucky I noticed Gmail’s sneaky trick early; the others
> > I’ve read about don’t seem so lucky)
> > • and it would seem it might cause my username to be lost.
> > Or would it be freed for me to open it up again for another account,
> > at least if I did it quickly?
> > NO; implied byhttp://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Logging-In-en/msg/464ccb44c...
> > , even if you delete the Gmail, apparently that deletion is really
> > kind of a lie, as it never really fully deletes it: the Gmail username
> > is now permanently linked to this Google Account. So you’re stuck.
> > You can’t open it elsewhere. And you can’t open it here again without
> > it (per the above) entirely messing up your primary email again. So,
> > yes, my carefully chosen username is now lost. Gmail, is there no
> > end to your ill-design??!
> > • Indeed even if one went to the absolute drastic extreme of
> > deleting one’s own Google Account (easily causing one to lose a lot
> > more than Gmail), “once an account is deleted it can not be recover
> > and the username can not be re used” sayshttp://groups.google.com/group/Gmail-Help-Logging-In-en/browse_thread...
> > -ugh! Indeed, Gmail users even have a petition pleading Gmail to stop
> > that annoyance, too:http://www.petitiononline.com/recgmail/petition.html > > Well sadly still, deleting my Gmail and
|
