Local terrain differences of >1m between SU and Google Earth

[matthiasbasler]

Hi all,

after the terrain changed mid December, some of my 3D buildings in
Weißenburg are hovering 2m in the air. (including those in 3D
buildings layer.) Now I loaded the model of one of those, removed the
orthophoto/terrain (also their textures) and imported the new
orthophoto/terrain using the "Get current view" button. I realized
that in Sketchup the model would still fit nicely onto the terrain.
When using "Place model" to check this in GE the model would however
hoover over 1m in the air. I had to sink the model in order to get it
right in Google Earth.

Experienced with SU 6.4.112 / GE 4.3 on Dec. 27th
with this model:
http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=ed9704307eac3dccfc60ea9dc300387&prevstart=0

How can this happen? Are there two different terrain models involved?

[FlagFreak]

Google sometimes updates their Google Earth terrain for some areas.
The area around your model probably got its terrain updated.

On Dec 27, 11:18 am, matthiasbasler <matthiasbas...@earthflight.org>
wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> after the terrain changed mid December, some of my 3D buildings in
> Weißenburg are hovering 2m in the air. (including those in 3D
> buildings layer.) Now I loaded the model of one of those, removed the
> orthophoto/terrain (also their textures) and imported the new
> orthophoto/terrain using the "Get current view" button. I realized
> that in Sketchup the model would still fit nicely onto the terrain.
> When using "Place model" to check this in GE the model would however
> hoover over 1m in the air. I had to sink the model in order to get it
> right in Google Earth.
>
> Experienced with SU 6.4.112 / GE 4.3 on Dec. 27th

> with this model:http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=ed9704307eac3dccfc...

[olaf]

I also had this mid December. Google had updated the terrain in my
region (I waited long for this update because it was misplaced of
about 100m). So I downloaded my models from 3dw, imported the terrain
from GE (where the building was only some meters missaligned) and the
terrain in SU was flying 50m in the air. Then I lifted the building
onto the terrain in SU and afterwards the building was flying in GE.

My only solution is either to copy the model in a new file (so it
looses position and ID) or to ignore the error and position it by
trial and error.

[Gaieus]

The funny thing is that there was an update at my place sometime in
May so the guy who had modeled most of the things there had to edit
them because the sank in the terrain.

Now as there was a new update in December, everything is floating for
him. ;-)

Must be annoying.

Gai...

[VAM]

Hi to everybody,

since monday before christmas the terrain-data has changed in my area
as well. There is no visible change or improvement in the satellite-
pictures but only an variation of altitude without any constancy.
Lifting and lowering alternate randomly.

All my not yet reviewed models are floating or sunken. Two of my
reviewed models have been accepted on December 16th. Since December
23rd they are floating. I could repair and adjust those unaesthetics.

But to this - as I call it - data-corrupted area belongs Frankfurt am
Main with many ,,accepted'' 3D-Buildings (with a majority from Google
itself). Those buildings are as well floating or sunken. Hence I do
not believe it is a data-update on purpose. Therefore I tend to wait
with repairs until we get some information about quality or intention
of this terrain-modification. I queried this in Tommy's last survey on
December 19th as well as I had noticed you fellows having experienced
this already earlier. I suggested to at least inform ,,Featured
modelers'', Sages and frequent forum members about upcoming updates
and their potential impacts via eMail-newsletter.

Happy New Year

Wolfgang

> > trial and error.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Gaieus]

The problem with informing people is that it's very much strictly
against Google's policy to reveal any upcoming events.

I do tend o agree however that let's just wait until the dust settles
and see when a final change is implemented.

Gai...

p.s. of course a solution when the models once accepted to the 3D
Layer would "sick" to the terrain should it ever change would be much
better. Even in this cae when

[Gaieus]

(Sorry, must have hit something and it got sent)

So what I was going to write was that even in this case, when
RESOLUTION of the terrain changes, there might be some adjustments
needed but at least hovering and sinking should be stopped.

Gai...

[VAM]

Gaieus,

there is no need to inform us in advance. They can tell us after that
we can decide what has to be done with ,,accepted'' and ,,not yet
reviewed'' models.

I have 21 models in the reviewing pipeline which violate acceptance-
criteria since December 16th. Before this date they were just fine.
And not to mention all accepted models - the result of several years
by now (not me personal, but modelers all over the world and Google-
employed-modelers as well).

On the other hand it can be that some mis-handling has happened in the
behalf of Google and nobody (from Google) has noticed yet.

But I agree with you to let the dust settle first. I only post heavily
on this topic to attract some Google guide's attraction. I have posted
on the GoogleEarth Help Group as well.

Wolfgang

> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[bbkh]

Hi Gaieus & Wolfgang,

I totally agree with you and hope someone from google could give us an
answer soon!

Bill

[Tomasz]

It looks like a terrain has been updated almost everywhere. I 've got
just one model so far in Galway/Ireland awaiting for approval.
I have submitted it on 8th of December. Now it is floating... I have
adjusted the SU Model to match a new terrain, but when I have loaded
it into GE it is floating!
It is so irritating. Do we really have to do it by a trial and
error??

Tomasz

[NESUA]

Tomasz, i have done the same thing with my models that are waiting for
approval..
Please load the model into GE after a day. it seems that there is a
small difference in time update. with the 3d warehouse link on GE.

[matthiasbasler]

Just a hint:

I put a version number into every file name I upload. So I can always
know which model version is the one that is visible on the 3DWH.
In my experience it takes only minutes until the uploaded model is
visible.

But anyway, the problem that the terrain in SU and GE don't match
still persists and I don't know any workaround yet.

[Tomasz]

Nesua, Thank you for a guidance, but my model has not been accepted
yet.
I have taken an updated GE terrain to SU, revised model and thought it
will be fine in GE,
because it is ok in SU.

When I am uploading it back to GE (as a KMZ local file on my hard
drive) it doesn't match
the position in relation to the recently updated terrain. It is
floating ca. 1.6m above it.

Do you mean that I should upload it to 3D Warehouse, although it
doesn't match the GE terrain?
I was really intending to invest my time in modelling for GE, but if
we have to face such a delays in qualifying our models and similar
events to the one discussed in this thread, I am considering helping
out Microsoft, although I would prefer to stay with Google.

Tomasz

[NESUA]

No, I don't mean that.

I just wanted to help you when you says that've updated the models
that are waiting for approval to match to the new tarrain; and when
you downloaded in ge with the 3d warehouse link, the updated version
isn't shown.
That is why I intervened to say that I have noticed that it takes a
while.

Anyway, it is true that there is a difference between the terrain in
sketchup and in ge., closer to 1/1.5 meters.
I remember having seen it in this forum discussed several. And never
fixed.

Because of that, when I finish a new model, after upload to the 3d
warehouse, I check the terrain level placing the model in ge. (as a
local .kmz file on my hard drive).
And with this change in december I have to do it with my 'new' models,
that there are waiting approval from August..
The 'solution' that I have founded was to don't load the new terrain
in sketchup, only change the model and than check it in ge. (like a
local kmz) -trial and error- :-|

Regards Tomasz and Matthiasbasler


ps. matthiasbasler: I do the same when I change a model in 3d
warehouse. put the model version.

[NESUA]

(...)
> Because of that, when I finish a new model, after* upload to the 3d

> warehouse, I check the terrain level placing the model in ge.

(...)


*In this part I want to say before, not after.

[SketchUp Guide Tommy]

Howdy Everyone,

First, I'd like to say "thank you" for discussing these issues and
raising this concern. As you noticed, terrain updates to Google Earth
can impact the models you've uploaded to the 3D Warehouse. This is
definitely a concern, and we're working on ways to address this issue.
At the very least, we'd like to be better at informing you when a
terrain update may affect your model. I'll keep you updated as changes
happen.

Many thanks.

[VAM]

Hi Tommy,

this wasn't really a discussion but rather a call to get you back from
the holidays.

It isn't a big problem to adjust models to a change in terrain
elevation. (well, if you don't have hundreds of accepted models as
Google himself has) The problem is how to react on those chances in
the best manner.

Unfortunatly you did not answer on some urgent questions which emerged
between Dezember 16th and now - not only in this thread.

- if there is a change in elevation only without any change in the
satellite-view: is that a designated improvement or just a malfunction
or mishandling by some operator while updating a server.

- preconditioning that elevation in GoogleEarth is an approximation
anyhow, why then change the terrain-data at all when paying the price
that hundreds allready accepted models will float or be sunken (as
long as I do not update the satellite view as well)? Not to mention
that these need-to-be-modified-models will jam the reviewing-pipeline!

The following models (by Google) exist since September 2006. Since
Dezember 2008 they are floating or sunken.
http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=b3ccb908ea7f198838709aa970c964dd&hl=de&ctyp=3dbl
sunken by about 7 feet
http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=f080447beca127ad17b75835e8401cec&hl=de&ctyp=3dbl
floating by about 5 feet
http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=31d0701acb435ffd22c4b4df98e3f030&hl=de&ctyp=3dbl
floating by about 5 feet

To shorten a long story: What is your (Tommy) recommendation?

Wolfgang

On Jan 14, 2:14 am, SketchUp Guide Tommy <sketchup-guide-

> > *In this part I want to say before, not after.- Hide quoted text -