Man shoots Unitarians for being liberal

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080728/ap_on_re_us/church_shooting

Has there been a case of a liberal shooting conservative churchgoers?

[MEG]

Religion strikes again.

On Jul 28, 3:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[Dev]

_________God Love____________God Loves
______God Loves Te_______God Loves Tenne
____God Loves Tenness___God Loves Tennesse
___God Loves Tennessee God Loves _______God
__God Loves Tennessee God Loves _________God
_God Loves Tennessee God Loves Tenn_______God
_God Loves Tennessee God Loves Tennesse______G
God Loves Tennessee God Loves Tennessee G__God
God Loves Tennessee God Loves Tennessee Go_God
God Loves Tennessee God Loves Tennessee God Lo
God Loves Tennessee and hates fags and liberals G
_God Loves Tennessee God Loves Tennessee God
__God Loves Tennessee God Loves Tennessee G
____God Loves Tennessee God Loves Tennesse
______God Loves Tennessee God Loves Tenn
_________God Loves Tennessee God Love
____________God Loves Tennessee Go
______________God Loves Tennesse
_________________God Loves Ten
___________________God Loves
_____________________God Lo
______________________God
_______________________Go


On Jul 28, 4:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[Keith MacNevins]

Some people have a lot of time on their hands. The idle mind is the Devil's workshop.

--
Ambassador From Hell

[Drafterman]

But Stalin killed millions! Religion R gud!

On Jul 28, 6:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[Turner Hayes]

hahahaha

This is an underrepresented category of ASCII art.

[doctorjohn]

It seems that this guy was just a drunk who blamed any available
target for his miserable life. In this story about him

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-07-27-tennessee-shooting_N.htm?csp=34

one lady says that he also ranted against the bible as well as
everything else.

Also, the first story I read about this did describe prior church
shootings over the years including some in conservative christian
churches.

While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
least not a mandatory, connection.

Dr. J

On Jul 28, 6:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[bluemage]

how about that guy who did the horse and buggy church, what is that
called?

On Jul 28, 3:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[Cormagh]

On Jul 28, 8:13 pm, doctorjohn <johnfc...@comcast.net> wrote:
> It seems that this guy was just a drunk who blamed any available
> target for his miserable life. In this story about him
>

> http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-07-27-tennessee-shooting_N.h...

>
> one lady says that he also ranted against the bible as well as
> everything else.
>
> Also, the first story I read about this did describe prior church
> shootings over the years including some in conservative christian
> churches.
>
> While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
> vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
> least not a mandatory, connection.
>
> Dr. J

It looks like this one can't be blamed on religion, because the guy
wasn't a churchmember, there at least. He was just a loner who decided
to go after the most liberal group available.

[Cormagh]

On Jul 28, 4:34 pm, Drafterman <drafter...@gmail.com> wrote:
> But Stalin killed millions! Religion R gud

Religion totally sucks: Stalin was educated entirely in a seminary. He
was kicked out with the rest of the poor students during his senior
year because of the amount of socialist political action in the
country.

'This personal experience of "surveillance, spying, invasion of inner
life, violation of feelings", in Stalin's own words, influenced the
design of his future terror state.'
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#Childhood_and_education.2C_1878.E2.80.931899

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

On Jul 28, 10:25 pm, bluemage <MageSt...@gmail.com> wrote:
> how about that guy who did the horse and buggy church, what is that
> called?

Can you give more details to help look up this case?

[Turner Hayes]

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 12:24 AM, Cormagh <cook...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Jul 28, 8:13 pm, doctorjohn <johnfc...@comcast.net> wrote:
> It seems that this guy was just a drunk who blamed any available
> target for his miserable life.  In this story about him
>

> http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-07-27-tennessee-shooting_N.h...

>
> one lady says that he also ranted against the bible as well as
> everything else.
>
> Also, the first story I read about this did describe prior church
> shootings over the years including some in conservative christian
> churches.
>
> While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
> vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
> least not a mandatory, connection.
>
> Dr. J

It looks like this one can't be blamed on religion, because the guy
wasn't a churchmember, there at least.

I thought he was an usher at the church?
 

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

Not bad! How did you do that? Do you have a program to generate this
shape?

[Cormagh]

On Jul 28, 9:35 pm, "Turner Hayes" <lordlacol...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 12:24 AM, Cormagh <cookl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 28, 8:13 pm, doctorjohn <johnfc...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > > It seems that this guy was just a drunk who blamed any available
> > > target for his miserable life.  In this story about him
>
> > >http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-07-27-tennessee-shooting_N.h...
>
> > > one lady says that he also ranted against the bible as well as
> > > everything else.
>
> > > Also, the first story I read about this did describe prior church
> > > shootings over the years including some in conservative christian
> > > churches.
>
> > > While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
> > > vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
> > > least not a mandatory, connection.
>
> > > Dr. J
>
> > It looks like this one can't be blamed on religion, because the guy
> > wasn't a churchmember, there at least.
>
> I thought he was an usher at the church?

It's hard to parse some of these stories. The guy that sacrificed his
life and took a bullet was an usher. Apparently the shooter was a
stranger.

> > He was just a loner who decided
> > to go after the most liberal group available.
>
> > > On Jul 28, 6:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"
>
> > > <ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > >http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080728/ap_on_re_us/church_shooting
>

> > > > Has there been a case of a liberal shooting conservative churchgoers?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[Dev]

Nah, I just Googled "ASCII heart generator" and plugged in the text.
If you search this group for "nobody loves bluemage" you'll see
another one. :)

On Jul 29, 12:08 am, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[omprem]

One atheist strikes at another. What a surprise.

On Jul 28, 6:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[omprem]

Unitarian Universalism is atheist. So it is just one more case of one
atheist targeting another.

[omprem]

As we see every day from the atheist postings in this club. Dev's
example is not only a product of the devil's workshop, it got the
facts wrong. The situation was just one atheist targeting another.

On Jul 28, 6:25 pm, "Keith MacNevins" <kmacnev...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Some people have a lot of time on their hands. The idle mind is the Devil's
> workshop.
>

[omprem]

Stalin was an atheist.

[omprem]

You are admitting that Stalin was a failed seminarian who was asked to
leave the seminar. Sounds to me like the head of the seminary was a
religionist who got it right and asked the atheist to leave.

It is amusing to watch atheists post 'evidence' that they think
supports their atheism when, in fact, it undermines their position.
Atheists should be the annual winners of the Darwin Award.

On Jul 29, 12:31 am, Cormagh <cookl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jul 28, 4:34 pm, Drafterman <drafter...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > But Stalin killed millions! Religion R gud
>
> Religion totally sucks: Stalin was educated entirely in a seminary. He
> was kicked out with the rest of the poor students during his senior
> year because of the amount of socialist political action in the
> country.
>
> 'This personal experience of "surveillance, spying, invasion of inner
> life, violation of feelings", in Stalin's own words, influenced the

> design of his future terror state.'http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#Childhood_and_education.2C...

[bluemage]

my imaginary friend loves me, and satan hates you

[bluemage]

They aren't atheist enough for me.

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

On Jul 29, 8:19 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> Unitarian Universalism is atheist. So it is just one more case of one
> atheist targeting another.

How do know the killer is atheist?

[dali_70]

> On Jul 29, 8:19 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
>
> > Unitarian Universalism is atheist. So it is just one more case of one
> > atheist targeting another.

Like always you jump right to conclusions without checking up on the
facts.

According to reports the shooter described himself to neighbors as a
"Confederate" and a "Believer in the Old South". He claims to have
committed this horrible act because of his hatred of liberals and
homosexuals. After police searched his home they found more guns, ammo
and books by conservative commentators.

Sounds more like a typical fundamentalist christian than anything
else, but we'll have to wait for more information.

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

On Jul 29, 8:19 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:

> Unitarian Universalism is atheist. So it is just one more case of one
> atheist targeting another.

One more case? What was the last case? (FYI, according to dali_70's
info the source of which remains unrevealed, this feller is unlikely
to have been atheist).

BTW, I was looking for an equivalent case of a liberal (whether an
atheist one doesn't matter) targeting conservatives for being
conservative. If you have so many such cases in your hat that you can
say "just one more", then pull out an example of the kind I'm looking
for and show it to us.

[omprem]

You notice that there is no mention of his being a member of a
religion in the description you posted. There is however plenty of
support for his atheism in the report - hatred and resistance to
change, for example.

It always amuses me when atheists post something that is supposed to
support some nutty idea or another of theirs when the reference does
no such thing and, in fact, often invalidates the very notion that the
atheist claims it supports.

Better luck next time.

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

On Jul 29, 3:19 pm, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> You notice that there is no mention of his being a member of a
> religion in the description you posted. There is however plenty of
> support for his atheism in the report - hatred and resistance to
> change, for example.

Er, conservatives are called conservatives for their resistance to
change. Liberals are called liberals for their openness to change.
According to the newspaper Omprem subscribes to, conservative
movements in the US are run by atheists which is no doubt why Omprem
calls this conservative an atheist. But then, why does he call this
conservative's liberal victims atheists too?

Other examples:
According to his neighbors, he considered himself a Confederate and
Confederates were atheists according to Omprem's history.
According to his neighbors, he believed in the Old South which was an
atheist place according to Omprem's history.

> It always amuses me when atheists post something that is supposed to
> support some nutty idea or another of theirs when the reference does
> no such thing and, in fact, often invalidates the very notion that the
> atheist claims it supports.

According to Omprem's newspaper and Omprem's history books, that is.

> Better luck next time.

[Dev]

Oh, of course. Confederates were the first to embrace Darwin, after
all. And the Klan is a secular humanist organization. But aren't we
ignoring the real issue? Let's apply the logic theists use to defend
theism to this case: suffering would still exist without this guy,
therefore he's innocent.

On Jul 29, 2:37 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

> > Better luck next time.- Hide quoted text -

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

On Jul 29, 3:43 pm, Dev <thedevil...@fastmail.fm> wrote:
> Oh, of course. Confederates were the first to embrace Darwin, after
> all. And the Klan is a secular humanist organization. But aren't we
> ignoring the real issue? Let's apply the logic theists use to defend
> theism to this case

I didn't attack theism, so why the need to defend theism? I was merely
curious about whether there had been a similar case of a liberal
violently attacking a gathering of conservatives.

[Dev]

*whoosh*

On Jul 29, 2:48 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

On Jul 29, 8:19 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> Unitarian Universalism is atheist.

How about the hero (usher) who was ready to give his life to save
others? Was he atheist? If so, how does that square with your claim
that atheists can only be selfish?

[Trance Gemini]

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 12:33 AM, ranjit_...@yahoo.com <ranjit_...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Jul 28, 10:25 pm, bluemage <MageSt...@gmail.com> wrote:
> how about that guy who did the horse and buggy church, what is that
> called?

Can you give more details to help look up this case?

I believe it was an Amish school not a church. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amish_school_shooting

> On Jul 28, 3:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"
> <ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080728/ap_on_re_us/church_shooting
> > Has there been a case of a liberal shooting conservative churchgoers?

--
------------------------------------------------
Trance Gemini
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. --Voltaire

Which God Do You Kill For? --Unknown

Love is friendship on fire -- Unknown

[Bob Crowley]

We repeat.

Stalin was an atheist.

Get that straight into your evasive, dishonest mind.

> > > '> Has there been a case of a liberal shooting conservative churchgoers?- Hide quoted text -

[Neil Kelsey]

On Jul 28, 4:34 pm, Drafterman <drafter...@gmail.com> wrote:

> But Stalin killed millions! Religion R gud!

This post of yours gives me the same feeling I got when they gave
Randle MacMurphy a lobotomy in One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest.

[Turner Hayes]

Stupid theist vs. stupid theist! Go!!

[Turner Hayes]

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 3:12 AM, Cormagh <cook...@yahoo.com> wrote:

On Jul 28, 9:35 pm, "Turner Hayes" <lordlacol...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 12:24 AM, Cormagh <cookl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 28, 8:13 pm, doctorjohn <johnfc...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > > It seems that this guy was just a drunk who blamed any available
> > > target for his miserable life.  In this story about him
>
> > >http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-07-27-tennessee-shooting_N.h...
>
> > > one lady says that he also ranted against the bible as well as
> > > everything else.
>
> > > Also, the first story I read about this did describe prior church
> > > shootings over the years including some in conservative christian
> > > churches.
>
> > > While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
> > > vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
> > > least not a mandatory, connection.
>
> > > Dr. J
>
> > It looks like this one can't be blamed on religion, because the guy
> > wasn't a churchmember, there at least.
>
> I thought he was an usher at the church?

It's hard to parse some of these stories. The guy that sacrificed his
life and took a bullet was an usher. Apparently the shooter was a
stranger.

Ah, that's probably it. I only half heard the news report.
 

[Trance Gemini]

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 6:34 PM, Bob Crowley <bobcr...@acenet.net.au> wrote:

We repeat.

Stalin was an atheist.

Stalin did what he did in the name of Communism and for no other reason.

However, the fact that he was indoctrinated in religious doctrine appears to have played a role in his strategies.

[Neil Kelsey]

On Jul 29, 4:02 pm, "Turner Hayes" <lordlacol...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Stupid theist vs. stupid theist! Go!!

And coming out at the bell, stupid theist 1 gives stupid theist 2 a
right uppercut for agreeing with him...a stiff uppercut to the head.
It seems to have dazed him...no, wait, he started out dazed, no harm
done. Over to you, Howard.

> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[doctorjohn]

omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:>>One atheist strikes at another. What
a surprise.<<


??

Please elaborate.

Dr. J

[Turner Hayes]

On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 7:55 PM, Neil Kelsey <neil_...@hotmail.com> wrote:

On Jul 29, 4:02 pm, "Turner Hayes" <lordlacol...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Stupid theist vs. stupid theist! Go!!

And coming out at the bell, stupid theist 1 gives stupid theist 2 a
right uppercut for agreeing with him...a stiff uppercut to the head.
It seems to have dazed him...no, wait, he started out dazed, no harm
done. Over to you, Howard.

Well, Bill, this is shaping up to be a hell of a match. We've got two evenly matched competitors, and you can tell they both really want this. It's anybody's game at this point, I can tell you that.
 

[omprem]

Atheists are resistant to changing their ignorance. The only changes
they want are in others. Unitarians want to keep their ignorance and
initiate social change that accords with and reflects their denseness
and their own preferences. They are atheists of the anarchist/
libertarian/hedonist variety. The gunman, whom you agree is an
atheist and the Unitarians he targeted are cut from one and the same
mold.

On Jul 29, 4:37 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[omprem]

He wanted to save a fellow atheist. Just like you atheists rallying
around a wounded atheist (i.e. one whose ignorance I have exposed to
be illogical and/or factually incorrect) supporting him/her and
hurling attempted insults like 10 year olds.

On Jul 29, 5:23 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[omprem]

PassiveAggressiveWhiner: "However, the fact that he was indoctrinated

in religious doctrine appears to
have played a role in his strategies. "

Omprem: Incorrect. What a moron you are. He was so unaware of
Christian teaching that he was kicked out of the seminary. His
atheism was the central fact that allowed him to kill millions.

On Jul 29, 7:42 pm, "Trance Gemini" <trancegemi...@gmail.com> wrote:

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

On Jul 29, 8:43 pm, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> Atheists are resistant to changing their ignorance. The only changes
> they want are in others. Unitarians want to keep their ignorance and
> initiate social change that accords with and reflects their denseness
> and their own preferences. They are atheists of the anarchist/
> libertarian/hedonist variety. The gunman, whom you agree is an
> atheist

Where did I say he's an atheist?

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

On Jul 29, 8:46 pm, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> He wanted to save a fellow atheist.

What did he have to gain by it? BTW, we don't know that he was
atheist; we only know that you claim so.

[Cormagh]

On Jul 29, 6:25 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> You are admitting that Stalin was a failed seminarian who was asked to
> leave the seminar. Sounds to me like the head of the seminary was a
> religionist who got it right and asked the atheist to leave.
>
> It is amusing to watch atheists post 'evidence' that they think
> supports their atheism when, in fact, it undermines their position.
> Atheists should be the annual winners of the Darwin Award.

You missed my point: Stalin, who was a straight-A student, at the top
of his seminary class, was an especially evil Marxist and killed
millions, not because he was an atheist, but because of the values and
indoctrination he received during his 20-odd years of Christian
education. The mean actions of the rectors who kicked out the students
at the last minute didn't any less indict religion for inculcating
cruelty, paranoia and selfishness into its subjects.

The case of Stalin was that of a religious bigot transfering his
religious theory into a secular world, and behaving as if he was the
"avenging angel" of that doctrine - smashing all oposition, without
zero regard for human life. The Bible is full of similar stories.

[Cormagh]

On Jul 29, 6:50 pm, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> PassiveAggressiveWhiner: "However, the fact that he was indoctrinated
> in religious doctrine appears to
> have played a role in his strategies. "
>
> Omprem: Incorrect. What a moron you are.  He was so unaware of
> Christian teaching that he was kicked out of the seminary.  His
> atheism was the central fact that allowed him to kill millions.

Namecaller,

Just because Stalin was a rebel, doesn't means he was unaware of
Christian teaching while he was at seminary. That would be hard for
anyone to accept, since it is the business of seminaries t inculcate
religious dogma on all students - no one therefor would be exempt.

There are several factors that turned Stalin from a bank robber into a
killer. One of them was achieving absolute power, for example. Most
likely the central factor was his assmilation of the Christian
tradition, that allows mass killing, as long as it is sanctified.
Christians and other religionsists have killed millions thoughout
history, not atheists. Just read your Bible critically once, if you
want proof.

> > Love is friendship on fire -- Unknown- Hide quoted text -

[Dev]

Don't encourage him. omprem is a pathological bullshitter.

[LL]

On Jul 28, 3:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

<ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080728/ap_on_re_us/church_shooting
>
> Has there been a case of a liberal shooting conservative churchgoers?

LL: I've never heard of one. Shooting people is not something liberals
tend to do. Most gun people are "conservatives." They shoot first and
ask questions later (if, indeed, they ask questions at all).

[Keith MacNevins]

You, demon-dev are just pathological, period.

[LL]

On Jul 28, 8:13 pm, doctorjohn <johnfc...@comcast.net> wrote:

While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
least not a mandatory, connection.

LL: It's certainly a significant connection and bears investigation,
however.

> It seems that this guy was just a drunk who blamed any available
> target for his miserable life.  In this story about him
>
> http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-07-27-tennessee-shooting_N.h...
>
> one lady says that he also ranted against the bible as well as
> everything else.
>
> Also, the first story I read about this did describe prior church
> shootings over the years including some in conservative christian
> churches.
>
> While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
> vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
> least not a mandatory, connection.



>
> Dr. J
>

> On Jul 28, 6:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"
>
>
>
> <ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080728/ap_on_re_us/church_shooting
>

[LL]

On Jul 28, 9:24 pm, Cormagh <cookl...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> It looks like this one can't be blamed on religion, because the guy

> wasn't a churchmember, there at least. He was just a loner who decided

> to go after the most liberal group available.
>

LL: So you're saying that a shooter has to be a church member in order
to blame religon? He can't be a member of a different church, or
simply someone who doesn't belong to any particular church but blames
some churches for the ills of the world?

> On Jul 28, 8:13 pm, doctorjohn <johnfc...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > It seems that this guy was just a drunk who blamed any available
> > target for his miserable life.  In this story about him
>
> >http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-07-27-tennessee-shooting_N.h...
>
> > one lady says that he also ranted against the bible as well as
> > everything else.
>
> > Also, the first story I read about this did describe prior church
> > shootings over the years including some in conservative christian
> > churches.
>
> > While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
> > vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
> > least not a mandatory, connection.
>
> > Dr. J
>

> It looks like this one can't be blamed on religion, because the guy

> wasn't a churchmember, there at least. He was just a loner who decided

> to go after the most liberal group available.
>
>
>

> > On Jul 28, 6:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"
>
> > <ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080728/ap_on_re_us/church_shooting
>
> > > Has there been a case of a liberal shooting conservative churchgoers?- Hide quoted text -
>

> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[LL]

On Jul 29, 10:15 am, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

<ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jul 29, 8:19 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
>

> > Unitarian Universalism is atheist. So it is just one more case of one
> > atheist targeting another.
>
> How do know the killer is atheist?


LL: I'll bet dollars to donuts they'll find a fundamentalist Christian
connection in this guy's background.



>
> > On Jul 28, 6:10 pm, MEG <ekrub...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Religion strikes again.
>
> > > On Jul 28, 3:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com]

On Jul 29, 8:43 pm, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:

> Atheists are resistant to changing their ignorance. The only changes
> they want are in others. Unitarians want to keep their ignorance and
> initiate social change that accords with and reflects their denseness
> and their own preferences. They are atheists of the anarchist/
> libertarian/hedonist variety.

> The gunman, whom you agree is an atheist

I'm still waiting for you to reproduce a posting (or a portion of one)
where I agreed that he's an atheist.

> and the Unitarians he targeted are cut from one and the same
> mold.

Reproduce a news article where a Unitarian shot up a churchful of
people. If you can't, what is this "same mold" that you're blabbering
about?

[omprem]

cormagh: "Just because Stalin was a rebel, doesn't means he was

unaware of
Christian teaching while he was at seminary."

Omprem: There are a number of atheists here, perhaps all of them, who
claim to be aware of Christian teaching but alas they demonstrate on a
daily basis in each of their posts that they do not understand
Christian teaching and that their understandings of Christian teaching
is wrong. Stalin falls into this category. No wonder he was asked to
leave the seminary.

Further evidence that atheist do not understand Christian teaching is
provided by your own specious, self-serving claim that Christianity
teaches mass killing. You seem to be forgetting the main Christian
teaching regarding one's interaction with others - Love thy neighbour
as thy self. You are in desperate need of a Bible study class if you
want to claim to understand Christian teaching.

[omprem]

Dev's incoherent, foaming-at-the-mouth hate mongering is well known to
all here.

On Jul 30, 3:25 pm, "Keith MacNevins" <kmacnev...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You, demon-dev are just pathological, period.
>

> On 7/30/08, Dev <thedevil...@fastmail.fm> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Don't encourage him. omprem is a pathological bullshitter.
>
> > On Jul 29, 6:11 pm, doctorjohn <johnfc...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > > omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:>>One atheist strikes at another. What
>
> > > a surprise.<<
>
> > > ??
>
> > > Please elaborate.
>
> > > Dr. J
>

> --
> Ambassador From Hell

[random]

On Jul 31, 4:37 pm, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> cormagh: "Just because Stalin was a rebel, doesn't means he was
> unaware of
> Christian teaching while he was at seminary."
>
> Omprem: There are a number of atheists here, perhaps all of them, who
> claim to be aware of Christian teaching but alas they demonstrate on a
> daily basis in each of their posts that they do not understand
> Christian teaching and that their understandings of Christian teaching
> is wrong. Stalin falls into this category. No wonder he was asked to
> leave the seminary.
>
> Further evidence that atheist do not understand Christian teaching is
> provided by your own specious, self-serving claim that Christianity
> teaches mass killing. You seem to be forgetting the main Christian
> teaching regarding one's interaction with others - Love thy neighbour
> as thy self. You are in desperate need of a Bible study class if you
> want to claim to understand Christian teaching.
>

History tells us that many Christians were also in such a desperate
need.

What's written in the Bible is nice, the question is how the religion
was implemented in reality.

[Drafterman]

I never thought one statement could generate so much sarchasm.

> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[omprem]

LL: "It's certainly a significant connection and bears investigation,
however."

Omprem: So, all of the gang-related violence is just some
disagreements between religion rivals? Oh, please.

FYI: the poster to whom you responded said that was not a mandatory or
even a tangible connection between guns and religiosity. Your jump to
a 'significant connection' is pure fiction.

[omprem]

LL: "So you're saying that a shooter has to be a church member in
order
to blame religon?

Omprem: No. He clearly said that the guy was not a churchmember and
therefore religion was not his motivator.

LL : "He can't be a member of a different church,"

Omprem: The poster said the guy was not a churchmember. He didn't say
that the guy was not a member of just that 'church '. His statement
includes lack of membership in any church.

LL: " or simply someone who doesn't belong to any particular church

but blames
some churches for the ills of the world?"

Omprem: That would be an atheist.

You shouldn't trouble your head with trying to think because you are
not very good at it.



- Hide quoted text -

[omprem]

LL: "I'll bet dollars to donuts they'll find a fundamentalist
Christian
connection in this guy's background."

Omprem: Biased wishful thinking. The bane of empiricism. He seems
to have been a fundamentalist atheist ( I know, I now, 'fundamentalist
atheist' is redundant but atheists are so thick so they need
repetition)

[zencycle]

On Jul 28, 6:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

<ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080728/ap_on_re_us/church_shooting
>
> Has there been a case of a liberal shooting conservative churchgoers?

none, ever....

[zencycle]

As usual, you have your head so far up your ass looking for some sort
of inner spirit that you have no concept of the world around you.

On Jul 29, 9:19 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> Unitarian Universalism is atheist.

"Concepts about deity are diverse among UUs. Some believe that there
is no god (atheism); others believe in many gods (polytheism). Some
believe that God is a metaphor for a transcendent reality. Some
believe in a female god (goddess), a passive god (Deism), a Christian
god, or a god manifested in nature or the universe, as revealed by
science. Many UUs reject the idea of deities and instead speak of the
"spirit of life" that binds all life on earth. Unitarian Universalists
support each person's search for truth and meaning in concepts of
spirituality."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarian_Universalism

This hardly characterizes the church as 'atheist', and in fact two of
those descriptors apply to you quite perfectly.

>So it is just one more case of one
> atheist targeting another.

Jim Adkisson was not an atheist

None of the victims were atheists.

Care to try again?

Or are you now too embarrassed with your complete display of
ignorance, arrogance, racism, and hatred to attempt to worm your way
out of it?

At some point I would think your conscience - if you have one - would
tell you to quit embarrassing yourself, but it's pretty clear that
your ego has aptly dispatched any conscience you may have ever had.

[Keith MacNevins]

If dev and poochio weren't butt buddies dev would have been banned a long time ago. I suppose we could complain to Google but they don't have time for mere filthy, rabid rhetoric from the demon.

[Neil Kelsey]

On Jul 31, 6:50 am, Drafterman <drafter...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I never thought one statement could generate so much sarchasm.

You just scared me for a minute. I thought they'd got to you.* :)




* fat chance of that

[LL]

On Jul 31, 6:52 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> LL: "It's certainly a significant connection and bears investigation,
> however."
>
> Omprem: So, all of the gang-related violence is just some
> disagreements between religion rivals? Oh, please.
>
> FYI: the poster to whom you responded said that was not a mandatory or
> even a tangible connection between guns and religiosity. Your jump to
> a 'significant connection' is pure fiction.

LL: Suit yourself. Nearly every member of the NRA is also a god-
fearin' Christian, as is every member of the KKK. There is no "jump".
It's as plain as the sneer on your face.

"I see people who are products of our gundamentalist culture, people
who drape the cross with a flag, people who believe the Second
Amendment should be one of the Ten Commandments, people who seem to
have more trust in guns than in God."
http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/undergod/2008/07/in_guns_we_trust.html

>
> On Jul 30, 3:25 pm, LL <llp...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jul 28, 8:13 pm, doctorjohn <johnfc...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
> > vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
> > least not a mandatory, connection.
>
> > LL: It's certainly a significant connection and bears investigation,
> > however.
>
> > > It seems that this guy was just a drunk who blamed any available
> > > target for his miserable life.  In this story about him
>
> > >http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-07-27-tennessee-shooting_N.h...
>
> > > one lady says that he also ranted against the bible as well as
> > > everything else.
>
> > > Also, the first story I read about this did describe prior church
> > > shootings over the years including some in conservative christian
> > > churches.
>
> > > While in the US guns and religiosity tend to go together in the most
> > > vocal groups, I am not sure that there is really a tangible, or at
> > > least not a mandatory, connection.
>
> > > Dr. J
>
> > > On Jul 28, 6:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"
>
> > > <ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > >http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080728/ap_on_re_us/church_shooting
>
> > > > Has there been a case of a liberal shooting conservative churchgoers?- Hide quoted text -
>

> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[zencycle]

On Jul 31, 9:52 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> LL: "It's certainly a significant connection and bears investigation,
> however."
>
> Omprem: So, all of the gang-related violence is just some
> disagreements between religion rivals? Oh, please.

Where did he say that?

[zencycle]

On Jul 31, 9:58 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> LL: "So you're saying that a shooter has to be a church member in
> order
> to blame religon?
>
> Omprem: No. He clearly said that the guy was not a churchmember and
> therefore religion was not his motivator.

No, They said he wasn't a member of _their_ church. That doesn't mean
that he could not have been religiously motivated.

> LL : "He can't be a member of a different church,"
>
> Omprem:  The poster said the guy was not a churchmember. He didn't say
> that the guy was not a member of just that 'church '. His statement
> includes lack of membership in any church.

So how does that define him as an atheist?

> LL: "   or simply someone who doesn't belong to any particular church
> but blames
> some churches for the ills of the world?"
>
> Omprem:   That would be an atheist.

So, because someone does not belong to a church, that makes them an
atheist? One cannot believe in god but not belong to a church? Wow are
you fucking stupid.

>  You shouldn't trouble your head with trying to think because you are
> not very good at it.

This from someone who thinks that a person who does not belong to a
church is an atheist.

[zencycle]

On Jul 31, 9:47 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> Dev's incoherent, foaming-at-the-mouth hate mongering is well known to
> all here.
>

no, you're just chickenshit like roger asshat

http://groups.google.com/group/Atheism-vs-Christianity/msg/1a8bef3733689a30?hl=en

[trog69]

Oh yeah! I shot'em a dirty look once.

On Jul 28, 3:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

[trog69]

>hatred and resistance to
>change, for example.

Um, yeah. That's why we follow the precepts entailed in centuries old
books of fairy tales. And just look at how shabbily we treat another
of God's creations by marginallizing and Homosexuals and depicting
them as evil animals, not to mention the acceptance of slavery of
another human. While you're trying to show that since slavery is now
illegal, that proves the theists are about change, remember that they
had to forced, violently in most cases, to renounce slavery.

Knowing how you'll just rewrite history and concoct ridiculous slaps
at your straw atheists, go fuck yourself assface.

On Jul 29, 1:19 pm, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> You notice that there is no mention of his being a member of a
> religion in the description you posted. There is however plenty of
> support for his atheism in the report - hatred and resistance to
> change, for example.
>

> It always amuses me when atheists post something that is supposed to
> support some nutty idea or another of theirs when the reference does
> no such thing and, in fact, often invalidates the very notion that the
> atheist claims it supports.
>

> Better luck next time.
>
> On Jul 29, 3:15 pm, dali_70 <w_e_coyot...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Jul 29, 8:19 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
>
> > > > Unitarian Universalism is atheist. So it is just one more case of one
> > > > atheist targeting another.
>
> >  Like always you jump right to conclusions without checking up on the
> > facts.
>
> > According to reports the shooter described himself to neighbors as a
> > "Confederate" and a "Believer in the Old South". He claims to have
> > committed this horrible act because of his hatred of liberals and
> > homosexuals. After police searched his home they found more guns, ammo
> > and books by conservative commentators.
>
> > Sounds more like a typical fundamentalist christian than anything
> > else, but we'll have to wait for more information.

[trog69]

Where the fuck are those posted? I'd love to see just one,

On Jul 29, 6:46 pm, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
> He wanted to save a fellow atheist. Just like you atheists rallying
> around a wounded atheist (i.e. one whose ignorance I have exposed to
> be illogical and/or factually incorrect) supporting him/her and
> hurling attempted insults like 10 year olds.
>
> On Jul 29, 5:23 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

>
> <ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > On Jul 29, 8:19 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
>
> > > Unitarian Universalism is atheist.
>

> > How about the hero (usher) who was ready to give his life to save
> > others? Was he atheist? If so, how does that square with your claim
> > that atheists can only be selfish?

[Dev]

In the guy's apartment, it turns out they found atheistic books by
Enlightment philosophers Bill O'Reilly, Michael Savage and Sean
Hannity. :D

> > > else, but we'll have to wait for more information.- Hide quoted text -

[trog69]

>You seem to be forgetting the main Christian
teaching regarding one's interaction with others - Love thy neighbour
as thy self.

Aye, there's the rub. Most Christians are self-hating hypocrites, like
you.

[trog69]

Praise the Lord and Pass the ammo! Next on No Spin Zone: Geraldo
shoots the locks off of what could be the Ark of the Covenant! Tonight
at 8:00!

[thea]

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 2:39 PM, trog69 <tom.t...@gmail.com> wrote:

>You seem to be forgetting the main Christian
teaching regarding one's interaction with others - Love thy neighbour
as thy self.

Aye, there's the rub. Most Christians are self-hating hypocrites, like
you.

 

 

If that's what you think -- you are in trouble -- because what you think is what you are! :)

thea

[trog69]

I'm rubber, you're glue; Everything....oh, um sorry.

On Jul 31, 12:52 pm, thea <thea.n...@gmail.com> wrote:

[LL]

On Jul 31, 11:52 am, zencycle <zency...@bikerider.com> wrote:

> This from someone who thinks that a person who does not belong to a
> church is an atheist.

LL: Evidently so. No wonder he can blame everything on atheists.There
must be billions of them under that definition.

[Neil Kelsey]

On Jul 31, 2:47 pm, trog69 <tom.tro...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm rubber, you're glue; Everything....oh, um sorry.

If she talks like this to grown ups, I wonder what she's like with
children.

[Cormagh]

On Jul 31, 6:37 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:

> cormagh: "Just because Stalin was a rebel, doesn't means he was
> unaware of
> Christian teaching while he was at seminary."
>
> Omprem: There are a number of atheists here, perhaps all of them, who
> claim to be aware of Christian teaching but alas they demonstrate on a
> daily basis in each of their posts that they do not understand
> Christian teaching and that their understandings of Christian teaching
> is wrong. Stalin falls into this category. No wonder he was asked to
> leave the seminary.
>
> Further evidence that atheist do not understand Christian teaching is
> provided by your own specious, self-serving claim that Christianity
> teaches mass killing. You seem to be forgetting the main Christian
> teaching regarding one's interaction with others - Love thy neighbour
> as thy self. You are in desperate need of a Bible study class if you
> want to claim to understand Christian teaching.

I didn't say that Christianity "teaches" mass killing, but the Bible
definitely does teach war and genocide. I said that Christian
tradition "allows mass killing", as witnessed by the assimilation of
Christianity by the Roman Empire, the routing of the Moslems in Spain,
the Inquisition which killed people of other races and beliefs, and
practically every European War on record. It seems that this old
tradition may never die, and you can guarantee that states will
continue to send Chaplains to war, as long as it appears profitable to
have a war.

"There are several factors that turned Stalin from a bank robber into
a
killer. One of them was achieving absolute power, for example. Most
likely the central factor was his assmilation of the Christian
tradition, that allows mass killing, as long as it is sanctified.
Christians and other religionsists have killed millions thoughout
history, not atheists. Just read your Bible critically once, if you
want proof."

Interpreting "Neighbor" as equivalent to "Foreign Enemies" is your
choice, but seems quite idiotic to me. No one is in need of a Bible
study class, desperate, or otherwise, and I obviously understand
Christian teaching better than you do - a whole lot better.

[Pandeism Fish]

Used to be the very definition of atheist -- one who is not a member
of the accuser's particular belief system.... by this route,
polytheists (who believe in many gods) are atheists, deists or
pandeists (who believe in one unintrusive god) are atheists, Catholics
are atheists, Mormons are atheists, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists,
Shintoists, all atheists....

[Dev]

He was motivated by right-wing Christianity, and they found books by
right-wing Christians in his apartment. He called himself a
"Confederate", for fuck's sake. These "South will Rise Again", Fox
News-loving, queer-bashing rednecks love their Jeebus like they love
their guns. I used to get in fights with these hicks all the time
growing up--atheism in no way fits into their worldview.

On Jul 30, 1:41 pm, LL <llp...@aol.com> wrote:
> On Jul 29, 10:15 am, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"
>

> <ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > On Jul 29, 8:19 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
>
> > > Unitarian Universalism is atheist. So it is just one more case of one
> > > atheist targeting another.
>

> > How do know the killer is atheist?
>
> LL: I'll bet dollars to donuts they'll find a fundamentalist Christian
> connection in this guy's background.
>
>
>
>
>
> > > On Jul 28, 6:10 pm, MEG <ekrub...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > Religion strikes again.
>

> > > > On Jul 28, 3:07 pm, "ranjit_math...@yahoo.com"

>
> > > > <ranjit_math...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > >http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080728/ap_on_re_us/church_shooting
>
> > > > > Has there been a case of a liberal shooting conservative churchgoers?- Hide quoted text -
>

> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[trog69]

Hey, some of the best times at family reunions are when the kids get
crazy Old Uncle Billy to start rambling about the whorehouse he used
to run, until the parents shoo them away from the side show!

[Neil Kelsey]

On Aug 1, 2:03 pm, trog69 <tom.tro...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey, some of the best times at family reunions are when the kids get
> crazy Old Uncle Billy to start rambling about the whorehouse he used
> to run, until the parents shoo them away from the side show!

I can only imagine. Damn! Both my parents were only children, so I've
never been to a family reunion. It's one of my life goals. I would
like nothing better than to hear crazy Old Uncle Billy talk and the
whorehouses and watch the frightened relatives.

> On Jul 31, 4:55 pm, Neil Kelsey <neil_kel...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jul 31, 2:47 pm, trog69 <tom.tro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > I'm rubber, you're glue; Everything....oh, um sorry.
>
> > If she talks like this to grown ups, I wonder what she's like with

> > children.- Hide quoted text -

[Pandeism Fish]

The scarier thing is that tolerant Christians fit nowhere in their
worldview either -- apparently this dude thought any Christian who
wasn't as bigoted as himself was fair game for shootin' (maybe he
should've read something or other that Jesus said about that)....

[omprem]

Ah, the ignorance of those who troll wikipedia seeking to appear
informed.

There is a vast difference between what atheists say and what they do
or believe. Every atheist here attempts to put on a face of inclusion
and morality but with even a minor bit of prodding they soon revert to
their true nature of hatred, fear and ignorance. Unitarians are no
different. They talk about respect for all but they respect none and
seek to persuade all to embrace their ignorance and mean-spiritedness.
They are the militant arm of atheism and seek the overthrow of all
laws that hem in their licentiousness, hedonism and libertarianism.
They are the religious/atheist equivalent of those nutty militias that
inhabit Montana or the Texas Freepers.

FYI: You attempted insults are yet another logical fallacy.

[omprem]

The atheist here like to indulge themselves in 'free speech' which
they misinterpret as license to say whatever comes into their little
minds. They forget that free speech also means responsible
speech.

> --
> Ambassador From Hell

[omprem]

You failed to address the two points that were raised. Yours is just
another example of the atheist belief that bullshit baffles brains.

On Jul 31, 1:32 pm, LL <llp...@aol.com> wrote:
> On Jul 31, 6:52 am, omprem <omp...@magma.ca> wrote:
>
> > LL: "It's certainly a significant connection and bears investigation,
> > however."
>
> > Omprem: So, all of the gang-related violence is just some
> > disagreements between religion rivals? Oh, please.
>
> > FYI: the poster to whom you responded said that was not a mandatory or
> > even a tangible connection between guns and religiosity. Your jump to
> > a 'significant connection' is pure fiction.
>
> LL: Suit yourself. Nearly every member of the NRA is also a god-
> fearin' Christian, as is every member of the KKK. There is no "jump".
> It's as plain as the sneer on your face.
>
> "I see people who are products of our gundamentalist culture, people
> who drape the cross with a flag, people who believe the Second
> Amendment should be one of the Ten Commandments, people who seem to

> have more trust in guns than in God."http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/undergod/2008/07/in_guns_w...

[omprem]

cycle: "No, They said he wasn't a member of _their_ church. That

doesn't mean
that he could not have been religiously motivated. "

Omprem: Nope. There was no 'their'. There was only not a church
member.

cycle: "So, because someone does not belong to a church, that makes

them an
atheist? One cannot believe in god but not belong to a church? Wow are
you fucking stupid. "

Omprem: Religion brings the idea of God to the people.

[omprem]

trog: "Aye, there's the rub. Most Christians are self-hating
hypocrites, like
you. "

Omprem: Your saying so doesn't make it so. In fact, that statement of
yours demonstrates your ignorance of religion and Christians.
Attempting to displacing your self-hatred unto others is just one more
example of the refusal of atheists to accept responsibility for their
actions and thoughts.

[trog69]

My family is of Irish descent, so we can't have reunions, unless it's
in a bar! I've been to enough of friend's get togethers though, that
I've met a few Crazy uncle Billys and the 500 lb. unmarried Aunt
Sophie who guards the potato salad with her life!

For the sake of your sanity, DON'T mention religion to Aunt Sophie!
You'll be wearing that salad, trust me on this.

[trog69]

Oompy the clown sez: "Only talk about things that I agree with, or I
will cast you into the flaming pit of despair!"

[trog69]

Do tell, oh great mystic!

[Keith MacNevins]

Sometimes I wonder if they have problems with other concepts. That is, concepts that normal people would have no problem with. More offbeat, today I wondered what the response from atheists would be if inter dimensional beings began to appear before humans (beings able to travel to and from here and dimensions invisible to us). Let's say that this starts to happen routinely and after a few years it is generally accepted as a real phenomenon and that humans are in regular contact with the beings. I assert that it would have no effect on earthbound atheists clinging to atheism. They would say it was no proof at all there there was a God, and that it only proved that there was inter dimensional travel and the existence of alien beings.

--
Ambassador From Hell

[LL]

On Aug 1, 2:20 pm, Neil Kelsey <neil_kel...@hotmail.com> wrote:

Damn! Both my parents were only children, so I've
> never been to a family reunion. It's one of my life goals. I would
> like nothing better than to hear crazy Old Uncle Billy talk and the
> whorehouses and watch the frightened relatives.

LL: Yours must have been a lonely childhood. No aunts, no uncles and
no first cousins! Most uncles aren't like crazy old Uncle Billy,
though. Most families don't have one like that.

I'm hoping you weren't also an only child.

>
>
>
> > On Jul 31, 4:55 pm, Neil Kelsey <neil_kel...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Jul 31, 2:47 pm, trog69 <tom.tro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > I'm rubber, you're glue; Everything....oh, um sorry.
>
> > > If she talks like this to grown ups, I wonder what she's like with
> > > children.- Hide quoted text -
>

> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[trog69]

Why are you posting your little love notes to Ompy here, when you
could just turn to him and say it to his face?

[trog69]

No, most uncles are not 'Billys', but most family reunions have a
Billy AND a Sophie in attendance. At least the Midwestern ones I
attended.

[omprem]

A self-confessed stereotypical paddy. No wonder he is so prone to
fighting and arguing and so unsuited to thought and reasonable
discourse.

[omprem]

No, you cast your self into the flaming pit of despair, self-loathing,
hatred and fear. Take responsibility for your actions.