E4000 datasheet

[Adam Nielsen]

Hi again,

Is there any documentation available on the E4000 tuner? From reading the
promo material there are a bunch of different amplifiers and things in the
chip, and it would be very useful to be able to change these manually. Just
yesterday I managed to somehow tune a previously silent Ham frequency with
different settings (I think I jumped to the freq instead of gradually tuning
it) and I got about a hundred signals showing up (many of them in foreign
languages and overlapping) but after getting an I2C tuning error and
restarting HDSDR the same frequency was silent again.

I'm guessing I somehow managed to tune it with different gain settings, so it
would be great if I could have more control over those adjustments.

Has anyone been able to get hold of the E4000 datasheet? The Elonics
mailserver was down for a few days a couple of weeks ago but my e-mailed
request eventually went through, although I never heard back apart from a
confirmation e-mail. They do have a Twitter account[1] and so does Alf
Sheppard[2] who is their Vice President of Operations[3] so maybe we could try
contacting them via Twitter instead? Maybe if they realise the popularity of
their device they might be more supportive of the community? After all,
people are already preferring devices with the E4000 because of its increased
range, so if it was better supported it would only increase its popularity.

Cheers,
Adam.

[1] https://twitter.com/#!/Elonics_info
[2] https://twitter.com/#!/AlfSheppard
[3] http://www.elonics.com/management.do

[Farhad Abdolian]

HI Adam,
I have the E4000 datasheet after I signed the NDA with them. I used their chip in a freelance project and that is why I got it.
The company does not want to share that information with anyone who is not a major developer, but I am working on modifying the linux driver and add some extra options to it that I found very useful. The only problem is that I am choked at work after my contractor left and now I have to do all the work myself. I am hoping to have this ready in a couple of weeks time.

Best regards,

[Adam Nielsen]

> The company does not want to share that information with anyone who is not a
> major developer, but I am working on modifying the linux driver and add some
> extra options to it that I found very useful.

Glad to hear it! I hope your code will be well documented :-)

Cheers,
Adam.

[Miguel A. Vallejo]

Farhad Abdolian wrote:

>>> HI Adam,
>>> I have the E4000 datasheet after I signed the NDA with
>>> them. I used their chip in a freelance project and that is
>>> why I got it.

Can you check the documentation to find how to tune between 975 and 1310 MHz?

Current E4000 code has a tuning hole between 975 and 1310 MHz, keeping these devices out of ADB-S (1090 MHz) and 23cm ham band (around 1296 MHz).

The hole is there, but FunCube's hole is only 1100-1270 MHz using the same tuner..

So:

a) Someone asks the FCD developer how they did it or...

b) Someone looks for a PLL expert ;-)

As ham radio operator, I'm really interested in the 1296 MHz area.

[Bob R]

Balint demonstrates it receiving ADS-B here:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKzii5K3AqA 

If you're using windows, maybe try grabbing the updated librtl2832++.dll [  http://wiki.spench.net/wiki/USRP_Interfaces#librtl2832.2B.2B ] and/or add tuner=e4k to the device hint in the ExtIO dialog .

[Miguel A. Vallejo]

Bob R wrote:

>>> Balint demonstrates it receiving ADS-B here
>>>:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKzii5K3AqA

I suspect that dongle don't use the E4000 chip... Who can confirm it?

>>> If you're using windows, maybe try grabbing the updated librtl2832++.dll
>>> [  http://wiki.spench.net/wiki/USRP_Interfaces#librtl2832.2B.2B ] and
>>> /or add tuner=e4k to the device hint in the ExtIO dialog .

Yes, I'm using both windows and Linux and I have the librtl2832++.dll updated since first day, and I use tuner=e4k, and there is a tested no tuning hole between 975 and 1310 MHz.

[GØNMY]

Well I am currently hearing GB3SE beacon/repeater using my tv antenna with tv coax
SE is on 1297.075MHz
so mine does work in that part of the band
my device is a JAY Tech and has the correct E4000 tuner etc

Although I seem to be suffering from warbly sound which i think maybe down to oscillator instability?
HTH Mark

[Miguel A. Vallejo]

GØNMY wrote:

>>> Well I am currently hearing GB3SE beacon/repeater
>>> using my tv antenna with tv coax SE is on 1297.075MHz
>>> so mine does work in that part of the band
>>> my device is a JAY Tech and has the correct E4000 tuner etc

So I supose you are lucky. I've just test my second device (Unikoo P160) and have the same tunning hole: 975-1310 MHz. That is the reason I think is a software problem.... but maybe I'm wrong.

Can someone else test their E4000 tuning ranges?

[GØNMY]

This is the one I bought however they are out of stock but you may find one elsewhere?
https://www.cosycave.co.uk/product.php?id_product=220

[G0NMY]

I have discovered something interesting
IF in ExtIO for the hint I use RTL tuner=e4k
I cannot set 1296 frequencies
If however I just set
Hint RTL
I can set 1296 frequencies!
So it may be a software driver problem afterall
So before ordering another usb device try just setting Hint to RTL and then see if you can set 1296 MHz
HTH Mark

 

Sell your bikes n bike bits swap trade etc

All welcome

 

 

http://www.facebook.com/groups/bikes.n.bits/

 

 

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[imo]

My P160 Uniko has problems with tuning between ~970 and ~1300MHz as well.

The ExtIO shows errors when tuning in that range:

"While setting frequency: ... "

So hopefuly it is a bug in ExtIO..

imo

[imo]

yea, P160 tunes with RTL only setting, with few errors:

..i2cReadByte: the control request was not supported by the device [-9] @ DCoffLUT:225.....

The Q is whether the frequencies are ok in fact :)

imo

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[Miguel A. Vallejo]

G0NMY wrote:

>>> I have discovered something interesting
>>> IF in ExtIO for the hint I use RTL tuner=e4k
>>> I cannot set 1296 frequencies
>>> If however I just set
>>> Hint RTL
>>> I can set 1296 frequencies!
>>> So it may be a software driver problem afterall

I confirm this.

Without tuner=e4k I can tune 1296 MHz. I can't check the exact tuning range (because of I2C errors) but I have no problems listening to myself on 1296 MHz.

So definitely it is a software issue.

[imo]

I am receiving the local 1296MHz beacon with P160 Uniko, RTL only (without tuner=e4k),

Beacon frq=1296.888 MHz, my tune 1296.8731MHz. Not bad, 15kHz off.

So it is sw bug.

imo

[Ton Machielsen]

Hama Nano:

With tuner=e4k gap between 972MHz and 1.311MHz.
With tuner-e4000 no gap.

Ton.

On Wednesday, April 25, 2012 4:30:23 AM UTC+2, Adam Nielsen wrote:

[Balint Seeber]

Thanks all for testing this. I'll take another look at this issue soon. I didn't realise it would such a problem because it doesn't happen for me on my Win/Lin dev machines! (I have the ezcap EzTV, which does have the E4000).

In regards to the suggestion brought up in the OP (that there are several other filters you can adjust in the E4000), this is possible and has been on the to-do list. The code that actually calculates the appropriate gain mode (when auto gain mode is enabled) reads back all the filter settings. So it's just a matter of writing to those registers. I'll come up with a nice abstraction around this, and implement it through librtl2832++ when I get a chance - things are kinda busy right now ;)

(Workaround in the meantime as suggested above, go back to just 'RTL' and be conservative in your re-tuning!)

[G0NMY]

No problem Balint
I am having fun messing with this ultra cheap SDR.
Thank you for sharing your drivers and info
Its just a shame the tuner wont go below 54MHz
I wonder if the xtal oscillator could be lowered say to 24MHz
would the E4000 tune 48MHz? I cannot find any info on the chip so dont really know.
Keep up the good work Everyone on here appreciates it.

2802

 

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[Miguel A. Vallejo]

G0NMY wrote:

>>> Its just a shame the tuner wont go below 54MHz
>>> I wonder if the xtal oscillator could be lowered say
>>> to 24MHz would the E4000 tune 48MHz?

I really doubt it. VCO ranges (*) don't depend on xtal frequency.

(*) Asuming the tuner uses VCO. Maybe it uses DDS... I don't know.

[imo]

With the "old" librtl2832++.dll (80k) I can tune well below 50MHz. Just now I am receiving FM on ~10m band (taxi services).. At least it seems so.. I need to verify somehow..

imo

[Miguel A. Vallejo]

imo wrote:

>>> With the "old" librtl2832++.dll (80k) I can tune well
>>> below 50MHz. Just now I am receiving FM on ~10m
>>> band (taxi services).. At least it seems so.. I need to
>>> verify somehow..

I've just test it.

There seems to be a real tuning range around 33 MHz. Setting LO at 33.000 MHz, a 33.5MHz signal appears on 32.600 MHz on waterfall.

I was not able to tune in 50MHz band, only around 33 MHz.

Quite interesting...

[Ton Machielsen]

Without the tuner hint, just using RTL, i can tune my Hama Nano all the way down to 0kHz. Now, this is not real. ExtIO tells me at this moment that the tuner is set to 16MHz and i am listening to (probably a mirror of) an FM broadcast station i normally listen to on 102.8MHz.

What's going on here?

Ton.

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[Adam Nielsen]

> Without the tuner hint, just using RTL, i can tune my Hama Nano all the way
> down to 0kHz. Now, this is not real. ExtIO tells me at this moment that the
> tuner is set to 16MHz and i am listening to (probably a mirror of) an FM
> broadcast station i normally listen to on 102.8MHz.
>
> What's going on here?

Interesting. I can tune mine right down to 0Hz and ExtIO says that's the
frequency it's tuned to. I don't pick up anything but there's a lot of faint
wideband signals at 0Hz which disappear when tuning a few kHz above it.

I figured the tuner chip allows itself to be set that low, but since it's
operating out of the 64-1700MHz spec (for the E4000) what's going on is
anyone's guess.

Odd that you're getting a mirror of such a high frequency there though, I
would've expected it to just pick up a lot of noise and not be very sensitive,
but otherwise be tuned to the reported frequency.

You don't happen to have a radio running near by tuned to this frequency, that
is influencing things perhaps? Maybe you've inadvertently tuned to that
radio's IF or something.

Cheers,
Adam.

[Ton Machielsen]

Not really. Going through the band I can hear most of the broadcast stations I normally hear much higher. The stations are faint and wide apart, so instead of being mirrors it might be some kind of multiplier. 

Try something for me: Tune BEYOND the 0kHz and listen between 0 and -1 MHz. I have a lot of strong AM signals there....

Ton. 

[Adam Nielsen]

> Not really. Going through the band I can hear most of the broadcast stations I
> normally hear much higher. The stations are faint and wide apart, so instead
> of being mirrors it might be some kind of multiplier.
>
> Try something for me: Tune BEYOND the 0kHz and listen between 0 and -1 MHz. I
> have a lot of strong AM signals there....

If you mean to tune the centre frequency/LO to 0Hz and then listen below that
then there's nothing, just some faint wideband signals (which do look similar
to WBFM, but they're too faint to tune and wonder over half the band.)

If you mean to tune above 2.1GHz where the ExtIO reported frequency goes
negative, well, I've no idea what frequency I'm listening to there :-)

I've yet to receive any AM signals with mine.

Cheers,
Adam.

[Miguel A. Vallejo]

Ton Machielsen wrote:

>>> Without the tuner hint, just using RTL,
>>> i can tune my Hama Nano all the way
>>> down to 0kHz. Now, this is not real.
>>> ExtIO tells me at this moment that
>>> the tuner is set to 16MHz and i am
>>> listening to (probably a mirror of) an
>>> FM broadcast station i normally listen
>>> to on 102.8MHz.

You can ask the tuner to tune any frecuency, but it will only tune the ones in their range. when the tuner is tuned outrange, the real tuning frecuency can be anyone.

To check if the tuner is really tuning, move the LO frequency 100 kHz up or down. If the waterfall scrolls left/right, everything is ok. If the waterfall is stalled (horizontally) you are out of tuning range.

Of course you need some signals to see the waterfall left-right scroll.

[g0nbd]

 

QQ  what  is the  full  text  string  required , to  enable   1296  coverage ??

 

Is this  the  'full'  text  ''tuner-e4000''   to  enable  no   1296 gap ??    Not  been able to get this to  run  , using  the  ezcap  dongel

 

Tnx -G.

[Ben Ryan]

On Wednesday, 25 April 2012 12:30:23 UTC+10, Adam Nielsen wrote:

Hi again,

Is there any documentation available on the E4000 tuner?  From reading the

Yep:)

Full datasheet, reference schematic..

 

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=E55F3F5F75B5A7BB!1160 

 

Balint - Dunno if you've seen this yet or not but there's some great stuff in there..

[Adam Nielsen]

> Yep:)
> Full datasheet, reference schematic..
> https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=E55F3F5F75B5A7BB!1160
> Balint - Dunno if you've seen this yet or not but there's some great
> stuff in there..

Oh wow, that's great! That has the register map and everything. Thanks
for posting! Can I suggest you also post it to the Osmocom SDR list?
That's where all the development happens and while some of the devs
already have access to the datasheet, it would be good for them to know
it's out in the open now, so it can be more openly discussed.

Out of curiosity, where did you come across this??

Cheers,
Adam.

[Ben Ryan]

Yeah she's good stuff alright.. I'll cross-post it shortly. Hehe well if I said I brute-forced the elonics website url's I'd be lying :P

It's out now anyway, I'll try and spread it round before the  lawyers come for me.. if you think of any other groups etc that could use it, please send it along to them.

laters

 

 

[GØNMY]

Hi Ben,
          I have not been on here for a while, as have been busy with other things.
But would like to say thank you for making the E4000 information available,
Reading some of the spec shows the xtal/clock freq can go down to 20MHz
and the chip will auto detect the external oscillator and turn the internal oscillator off automatically.
I still have a bit of reading to do but it looks interesting.
However it still suffers badly from front end overload from out of band signals.
 I have acquired a cavity which I will tune for 1296 and see
how much I can then receive on that band.
Cheers Mark